DC Scaling Issues


General Discussion


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Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

TL;DR The DC scaling as of the moment (most predominantly in starships) is utter horsesh!t -- to be blunt. How does a DC = 10/15/20 + 2 x tier even make SENSE?

I tried thinking this over and got nowhere. When you have text, such as stated in the CRB page 322:

Quote:

Repairing damage to the hull (restoring lost Hull Points)

is more difficult. You must first stop the starship completely,
usually at a safe location (for instance, a world with a nonhostile
atmosphere or a dock on a space station), and the repairing
character or characters must have access to the outside of the
hull. On most of the Pact Worlds, the crew can pay mechanics to
repair the starship; the cost and time needed are up to the GM. If
the crew is on its own in uncharted territory, it can still repair the
starship’s hull. Doing so costs 10 UPBs (see page 233) per point
of damage to be repaired and requires 5 hours of work regardless
of the number of points repaired. A character who succeeds at
an Engineering check (DC = 15 + 2 × the starship’s tier) can cut
either the cost or the time in half. For every 10 points by which
she exceeds the DC, she can reduce one of these factors by half

(or by half again), to a minimum of 1 UPB per point of damage and
1 hour. Any number of allies can use the aid another action (see
page 133) to assist with this Engineering check. Failing the check
to reduce the time or cost instead increases the cost by 5 UPBs
per point of damage.

Are you serious? You scale this, not even to 20, but to 10, 15?, and your DCs are already in the 35~45 range? Then you say you want that character to beat that DC by an additional 10? Like you're saying "Good job at not sucking, but only barely"?

Let's not even GET into the APL vs Tier debate. How does it make sense that someone of relatively higher level (say even just 1 level higher) walks aboard your ship, and somehow you guys all are incapable of performing your checks? You go up one level and your DC spikes by 5? Are you sh*tting me right now?

What's more, let's say that the PCs are completely content with their ship modifications. Maybe the only difference they do with their BPs is to upgrade a ship's computer, or to make living arrangements more comfortable, or merely increase their Drift Drive output -- how does this suddenly translate to being completely unable to perform the same maneuver the pilot made not but a few days ago? The SIZE of the ship didn't change, in my example the BULK of the ship did not change dramatically enough, and furthermore the ENGINES/or THINGS ALTERING MANEUVERABILITY did not change -- so explain to me how the hell this makes sense that my pilot suddenly became a complete and utter retard overnight?

The way the DC currently scales doesn't match with NPC ships, and whats more, even if you theory-craft and number-crunch, optimal rolls will NOT happen at a consistent enough rate for players to feel that the odds truly are "balanced" (as some people incorrectly have posted).

I don't care who you are, the roleplaying aspect of the DC scaling simply doesn't add up.

My simple solution is I'm going with this revised formula:

DC = 10 + [1.5*Tier]
DC = 15 + [1.5*Tier]
DC = 20 + [Tier]

Out-of-Combat Starship checks:
DC = 10/15/20 + [.5*Tier], as the "beat by 10" wouldn't mean sh*t unless you could ACTUALLY attain it.

This means that your DC checks still scale, but are reasonably attainable by players NOT hellbent on min/maxing their characters. This results in some fairly even checks, with the assumption that even with players maxing a skill with 20 ranks, class trained, and some extra toppings on the side.

A Tier 10/15, with original DCs of 30 and 45, respectively, now stop being nearly impossible, and now look like 25 (with PCs having 10 ranks, +13 with basic class training, and now need to roll slightly higher than a coin flip at a minimum of 12) and 32 (with a base of 15 ranks, +18 with basic class training, now needing to roll 14, meaning it starts to show that you'll need to get slightly more dedicated if you want to roll reliably well).

This is just MY homebrew solution, and is not saying this is how it should be solved; but come on, no one else thinks this is just downright embarrassing and frustrating as a GM or player?

Silver Crusade

I feel...you may be holding back. Relax your shoulders..., breath in from deep in your soul, now slowly exhale and LET EM HAVE BOTH BARRELS!!!! :)


Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Edenwaith wrote:
I feel...you may be holding back. Relax your shoulders..., breath in from deep in your soul, now slowly exhale and LET EM HAVE BOTH BARRELS!!!! :)

LOL. I did hold back, didn't I? *begins chanting evil ritual, cue anime intro combat scene*

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