After some personal consideration, I have decided to share a system with everyone that I have been working on for the past few weeks. I mainly wanted to see the communities reaction on this system, and incorporate some feed-back to help shape this into something fun for everyone to add to their table! To help start this off, I have made an FAQ to help answer what this system entails.
What is the Paragon Path System?:
The Paragon path system is a new way to add thematic abilities to characters, while allowing them to direct their character towards a more specific role within the group. This is accomplished by providing players with three options they may choose from, once they reach 4th level: Defensive – Which focuses around abilities that raise AC, saves, HP, CMD, or provide damage mitigation; Offensive – Which focuses around gaining bonus damage, chance to hit, new ways of dealing damage, and causing stat ailments to enemies; Utility – Which focuses around increasing stats/skills, increasing/decreasing movement of targets, and granting abilities that increase battlefield control. Within each of these paths, a character will gain access to one of each of the following: A passive that remains active at all times (unless otherwise noted); a once per encounter ability, which is usually the core concept of the path; and a once per day ability, which is usually a powerful ability that gives the player an edge.
Once per encounter abilities, WTF 4th edition!?:
I know, I know….I personally have nothing against 4th edition, and this was a concept I have always liked. These kind of abilities give the characters something they can do every fight, no matter what. Even if your Sorcerer has ran out of every spell, and exhausted their bloodline powers, they will still have a unique ability to perform in combat, until they can find a sport to rest.
What am I hoping to accomplish?:
My players all come from MMO backgrounds, they are used to having an array of powers and abilities thematic to their characters. While I do understand adding in this system seems to gear the game towards the “Holy trinity” trap (Tank, Healer, DPS), I also know that some players simply don’t want to level of choice Pathfinder offers. Since these players require a structure in order to truly play their characters the way they want. With this in mind, I have tried to make each path flexible enough that they can be incorporated into most games. Just because a character chooses the Defense path, doesn’t mean they must be at the forefront of combat; just as a player who chooses the Offense path can still hold back and offer support his/her party.
Why level 4?:
Because it is early enough in the game for players to begin defining themselves and really come into their roles, while not being too late for the character to feel trapped choosing a specific path. Around 4th level, new players have a general gr asp of what they can do, and what their characters are capable of, allowing them to make informed decisions on what path appeals to them the most. 4th level also seemed to be a bit of a lull for most classes, the last thing I wanted to do was place it on a level where a class gains several abilities and overload the players.
Doesn’t this break the game!?:
Well yes and no; I am fully aware that adding abilities to any character always runs the risk of someone abusing it. While I have done my best to keep each ability within a reasonable level of power, I can also assume that number crunchers out there would find a way to break this system. That is why the Paragon Path system will not be for every group!
When will you be releasing more classes?:
Well with my job and home life, I will be working on what I can, when I can. Further to that, I will be starting with the classes that my players are currently running: Barbarian, Cleric, Magus, Oracle, Ranger, and Sorcerer. Followed by their characters from our 2nd campaign: Druid, Fighter, Gunslinger, Inquisitor, Monk, and Rogue. At this time I have no plans on incorporating the ACG classes into this system, though I have given thought on characters choosing a Path based on the parent classes.
To help everyone visualize the direction I am going with this system, here is a look at the Ranger Class:
Ranger
Survivalist (Defense):
“In life there are no second chances; we must adapt, or risk extinction”
Passive – Ready for anything: The Ranger gains a +3 competence bonus to their survival skill. This bonus increases by 1 per 3 levels after 4th (+4 at 7th, +5 at 10th, +6 at 13th, +7 at 16th, +8 at 19th). In addition, after resting each day, the Ranger may select one of the following skills: Climb, Intimidate, Perception, Stealth, or Swim. Until the next time the Ranger rests, they gain a +2 bonus to the selected skill. This bonus increases by 1 per 3 levels after 4th (+2 at 7th, +3 at 10th, +4 at 13th, +5 at 16th, +6 at 19th.
Once per encounter – Warden’s Mark* (Move action): The Ranger selects 1 target to bear the Warden’s Mark, this does not provoke attack of opportunity. While marked, the target gains a +1 Natural Armor bonus to AC. This bonus increases by 1 for every 4 levels beyond 4th (+2 at 8th, +3 at 12th, +4 at 16th, and +5 at 20th). The Mark lasts until the end of the encounter, when the target is dead, when the Ranger dies, or when it is consumed (see below).
As a standard action, the Ranger may choose to consume the Mark and remove one of the following conditions from the target: Blind, Deaf, Fatigued, Shaken, or Sickened. Alternatively, the Ranger may remove a single Disease or Poison from the target by consuming the Mark. The target may take a Will save in order to avoid this effect (DC = 10 + ½ Ranger level + current Mark bonus). If their save is successful, the mark is still consumed, and the target retains the condition.
Once per day – Adapt (Swift action): Upon activating this ability, the Ranger may choose to apply their Warden’s Mark to a target as a free action, if they have not already done so this encounter. The Ranger can select one of the following adaptations which lasts until the end of the current encounter. The Ranger may choose to apply this adaptation to themselves, or the target of their Warden’s Mark. Once selected, the adaptation may be changed on the Ranger’s turn as a swift action, however the Ranger may not change the target of the adaptation. The numerical bonuses provided to the target of Adaptation are always based on the Ranger’s current level.
Chameleon skin: The Ranger or target gains 10% concealment; this does not stack with any other effects that grant concealment. Effects that bypass concealment also bypass the concealment granted by Chameleon skin.
Cerebral insulation: The Ranger or target gains a +2 resistance bonus to Will saves; this bonus increases by 1 per 4 levels after 4th (+3 at 8th, +4 at 12th, +5 at 16th, +6 at 20th)
Elastic muscles: The Ranger or target gains a +2 dodge bonus to reflex saves; this bonus increases by 1 per 4 levels after 4th (+3 at 8th, +4 at 12th, +5 at 16th, +6 at 20th)
Elemental adaptation: The Ranger or target chooses one of the following energy types - Acid, Cold, Electricity, Fire. The Ranger or target then gains energy resistance (3) to that type; this resistance increases by 2 for every 3 Ranger levels after 4th (5 at 7th, 7 at 10th, 9 at 13th, 11 at 16th, 13 at 19th.)
Mutagenic Blood: The Ranger or target gains a +3 resistance bonus to saves against poisons or diseases. This bonus increases by 1 for every 3 levels after 4th (+4 at 7th, +5 at 10th, +6 at 13th, +7 at 16th, +8 at 19th.)
Resilient Anatomy: The Ranger or target gains a +2 resistance bonus to fortitude saves; this bonus increases by 1 per 4 levels after 4th (+3 at 8th, +4 at 12th, +5 at 16th, +6 at 20th)
Thick Skin: The Ranger or target gains a + 1 natural armor bonus to AC, this bonus increases by 1 per 4 levels after 4th (+2 at 8th, +3 at 12th, +4 at 16th, +5 at 20th)
Hunter (Offence):
“All creatures have a weakness, it’s just a matter of finding and exploiting it”
Passive – Thrill of the hunt: The Ranger gains +2 morale bonus to initiative (increases by 1 per 3 levels after 4th).
Once per encounter – Hunter’s Mark* (Move action): The Ranger selects 1 target to bear the Hunter’s Mark, this does not provoke attack of opportunity. While marked, the Ranger Gains a +1 bonus to attack and damage rolls against that creature. This bonus increases by 1 for every 4 Ranger levels beyond 4th (+2 at 8th, +3 at 12th, +4 at 16th, and +5 at 20th). The Mark lasts until the end of the encounter, when the target is dead, when the Ranger dies, or when it is consumed (see below)
As a standard action, the Ranger may choose to consume the Mark and apply one of the following conditions to the target: Blind, Deaf, Fatigued, Shaken, or Sickened. Alternatively, the Ranger may disarm one weapon from the target, or knock the target prone. The target may take a Reflex save in order to avoid any of these effects (DC = 10 + ½ Ranger level + current Mark bonus). If their save is successful, the Mark is still consumed, and the target suffers no ill effects. If this target fails this save, the condition last for 1 round per 3 Ranger levels (disarm and prone excluded).
Once per day – Ambush (Immediate action): Upon activating this ability, the Ranger may choose to apply their Hunter’s Mark to a target as a free action, if they have not already done so this encounter. The Ranger becomes invisible for 1 round per 2 Ranger levels, this does not provoke an attack of opportunity. If the Ranger successfully hits their marked target while invisible, they will deal an additional 1d8 damage. This damage increases by 1d8 for every 4 levels beyond 4th (2d8 at 8th, 3d8 at 12th, 4d8 at 16th, 5d8 at 20th). Targets immune to sneak attacks are unaffected by this additional damage.
Scout (Utility):
“The road ahead may be dangerous, let’s go find out!”
Passive – Awareness: The Ranger may always act during a surprise round; in addition, the Ranger gains a +1 dodge bonus to reflex saves. This Bonus increases by 1 per 3 levels after 4th (+2 at 7th, +3 at 10th, +4 at 13th, +5 at 16th, and +6 at 19th).
Once per encounter – Vanguard’s Mark* (Move action): The Ranger selects a single square within 15 feet to bear the Vanguard’s Mark. While marked, the selected square projects a 30ft aura. All allies that begin their turn within the aura are granted +10ft movement bonus to their speed, until the start of their next turn. This bonus increases by 5 for every 4 levels after 4th (+15ft at 8th, +20ft at 12th, +25ft at 16th, +30ft at 20th). This bonus movement is added before the character’s armor movement penalty applies. The Mark lasts until the end of the encounter, when the Ranger dies, or when it is consumed (see below).
As a standard action, the Ranger may choose to consume the Mark and apply the “entangled” condition to all enemies within the Mark’s aura. All affected targets may take a reflex to avoid this effect (DC = 10 + ½ Ranger level + the Rangers CHA mod.). If their save is successful the affected targets suffer no ill effects. If a creature fails this save, the condition last for 1 round per 3 Ranger levels, or until the creature frees itself.
Once per day – (Move action): Upon activating this ability, the Ranger may choose to apply their Vanguard’s Mark to a target location as a free action, if they have not already done so this encounter. Enemies within the aura are always considered flat-footed against any of the Ranger’s attacks. As long as the Ranger is standing within the Aura of their Vanguard’s Mark, they cannot be flanked and are Immune to sneak attacks. In addition, the first time the Ranger enters the aura, they gain 10 temporary hit points. The Ranger may choose to divide these temporary hit points among any allies within the Vanguard’s Mark aura. These hit points increase by 10 for every 4 levels beyond 4th (+20 at 8th, +30 at 12th, +40 at 16th,+50 at 20th). The Ranger or his allies may only gain these hit points once during the current encounter, and unlike the other bonuses, these hit point persist even if the Ranger (or affected ally) moves out of the aura of their Vanguard’s Mark. These temporary hit points last until the end of the current encounter.
* Multiple Ranger Marks do not stack, the highest bonus is always used in an instance of 2 Marks overlapping.
Thank you to everyone who reads and shows interest in this system.
From a game design perspective, I have a problem with any content that tries to make a tabletop RPG feel like an MMO.
1) MMOs and TTRPGs offer vastly different experiences. Online video games tend to be real-time tactical combat games whereas TTRPGs are interactive storytelling games with turn-based combat elements. TTRPG players enjoy the games specifically because they do things you cannot do in a video game just as video game players enjoy MMOs because they offer visuals and complex mechanics a TTRPG cannot offer.
2) MMOs try to model TTRPG into the context of a video game, so it's very backwards when a TTRPG tries to model a video game. This is why "taunt" abilities in tabletop RPGs never sit well with me. In a TTRPG, a character can taunt enemies into fighting them simply through roleplay. Players can't do that in a video game because no GM exists to mediate the interaction, so video games give PCs concrete abilities enabling them to do so. So it doesn't really make any sense to adapt a taunt ability to a TTRPG when taunt abilities in video games were meant to adapt roleplay taunting from TTRPGs.
3) Combat in most TTRPGs and MMOs work very differently. In Pathfinder RPG, fights tend to be quick and lethal where players try to make fights as least costly as possible so they can survive the climatic fight. MMO fights are drawn out affairs where the players must simply out sustain the monsters to win. Because combat differs, combat roles are much different in each type of game.
4) Finally, TTRPGs tend to have much more variety in its gameplay. MMOs tend to be almost entirely combat. Pathfinder RPG rests on three pillars of gameplay: social encounters, skill encounters, and combat.
With these points in mind, a system like your offers nothing to Pathfinder RPG. TTRPG players want options and rules that capture their imagination and make the game fun to play and roleplay. Nothing here does that. There's little to no flavor to these abilities. The rules solve a problem that doesn't exist.
I can tell you put a lot of effort into these rules. However, I feel like the motivation behind them is fundamentally misguided.
I respect you being so candid, and I understand the points you are making. As noted in my FAQs, my players all came from MMO backgrounds. This was my way of alleviating their thoughts of "there is not enough we can do". Sadly, this idea stems more from a need to appease a knish player base, then to provide a practical system for players who are happy with how the game currently plays (such as myself, I've been playing for about 15 years, since 3.0).
The players are limited in their imaginations, despite reinforcing the idea of "if you can think it, you can do it", that should be perpetuated by a tabletop game. This may be a failing on my part, or it may be their background that has skewed their views to a point of disrepair. None of them had an investment in roleplaying, and were content grinding content for content's sake.
Posting this system was less a "everyone try this" and more of a "share what I have created". I had no intentions of fixing what I know is not broken, and apologize if it came across that way. For what it's worth, despite all of the work I have put into this system, I would rather have spent the time painting miniatures, or working on my campaign.
But this is the group I chose to GM for, and wouldn't trade them for the world!
Thank you again though for your honest feed-back, it is appreciated.
I find this rather strange, honestly. I started TTRPGing two years ago with a bunch of friends who never played RPGs before. We started gaming specifically because we wanted to roleplay and make stories. Though I had roleplay-timid players, it feels really weird to hear players that don't want to roleplay.
It is pretty much like pulling teeth...out of an angry bull...with chopsticks....and the bull is on fire.
But in all seriousness, getting them to mentally invest in any characters, plots, or twists is exhausting. No matter how much I play something up, or try to "play it cool" they cannot wrap their heads around the concept that "it's more than just a game". No matter what way I seem to bring it up, they want things to be cut and dry. An example of this is when we were running rise of the rune lords:
Minor plot point:
They were in the beginning of the glassworks, and chose to investigate each and every room, prior to the main chamber containing the goblins. To my dismay, after their 2nd store room, the cries of "this is boring!" began. Despite describing signs that the goblins had crawled in through the sewer system (small hand prints could be seen on the inner lip of the toilet0, they showed no interest in the how or why. To them, this was about finding the kidnapped Amiko and taking down anything that got in their way.
We have been playing for over a year now, with many situations like the above occurring. Yet, they insist that they want to continue playing...they simply want more to do. I think they are trying to supplement their dislike of roleplay, with more combat focused abilities. Yet they have no interest in doing arenas because they "like the story". It's a strange situation to be in.
