I need some help and feedback. ENDGAME SPOILERS.


Kingmaker


Know that Spoilers run rampant in the following. PCs shouldn't be anywhere near the expand button

The low down.:

My group is essentially at the very beginning of book 6. I should probably go into a bit of detail concerning my additions, please bare with me:

Nyrissa wasn't been the big bad guy for much of what occurred before book four besides the Owlbear. Instead, I have made Irovetti a bit more of a conniving puppet master. He's now out of the picture so I won't go into him in too much detail.

Nyrissa has been witness to the encroachment of civilization on the Stole Lands. She considers this territory part of her domain. So Nyrissa used the Knurly witch and her coven, the black sisters, to control the tiger lord barbarians. (I used Rhys Grey's FANTASTIC poem) She used them as a non-fey front line to stave off encroachment and to spread chaos in much the same way they were written in the books.

I knew I wanted to foreshadow the eventual blooms. I didn't just want to hand-wave their origins. So behind the scenes The Knurly Witch appealed to Gyronna. In order for Gyronna to involve herself in these 'mortal matters' she demanded the sacrifice of a noble born demon child. (No small feat to accomplish.) The Wriggling Man enlisted the help of an Incubus to assume the form of the NPC Queen's lover and bed her. When the child was born, the handmaidens of the Queen (clerics of Gyronna) locked the door, murdered the Queen and began performing a ritual sacrifice. (at this point in the campaign I was doing everything I could to get rid of the NPC Queen. I honestly was trying to get one of the PCs to assume the mantle) As an addition to Rhys's poem I had the handmaidens chant the following:

Forsaken Child.
Spawn of chosen hand.
Sacrificial lamb whose blood stains Stolen Lands
Mark the Blooms and shed the tears.
Mark the Blooms to ignite the fears.
Drawing sanguine fluid down ley lines seam;
Fusing worlds in a dream
Mirrored form, mirrored soul
All set right by heavy toll.

(It's worth noting here that in my campaign the first Bloom is The Nights of Dread. Hence the mention of "a dream". I wanted to have them seem more intimate, more terrifying and more gradual.)

The ritual was interrupted by the PCs who then saved the child. After the group discerned the nature of the child, they decided to kill it. They then exiled the Queen in a coup and eventually one of the PCs finally assumed the role of King. (Which worked out for the prophecy. Otherwise, I would have Nyrissia find another way to kill the child.)
After the child was killed, an extremely weak breach was torn in the fabric of reality. The group mage investigated this and discovered that it was a planar rift to the first world. Using the poem above as a hint, the group decided it would be a good idea to sleep in the vicinity of "the dead demon child rift portal". Over several nights the PCs decide to monitor each other as they slept upon the planar breach. Each person has unique nightmares tailored to their character, each dream includes visions of an immense black bird and each time they wake they are affected by their nightmares. The mage of the group recalled Zuddiger's Picnic. And has heard of the Nightmare Rook, a First World mythic creature said to bring forth nightmares. They surmised that the breach led to the first world, but decided not to directly investigate further. Soon after, they were able to procure a copy of the book from the Tiefling Anamar Lellwen in Restov. Anamar was then invited to come and research the anomaly.
The Rushlight Festival takes place. Irovetti sets the PCs up as murderers during the festival so all of the other River Kingdoms can witness. The war ensues.
The war ultimately looked bleak for Irovetti, who was holed up in his Palace. He did however, uncover the plan the PCs had to storm his castle. In an effort to turn the odds, he sent word to Nyrissia that the bearers of Briar (a lie, it was still in his cubby hole) would be attacking him. She then sent The Wriggling Man to retrieve Briar. After some pre-battle banter, The Wriggling Man knew he was being played by someone. Instead of choosing a side, he gated the very Incubus that fathered the breach and watched in amusement as three sides battled it out. The Incubus was killed in the battle and afterwards he told the victors they had by nightfall on the next day to retrieve the sword and bring it to The Castle of Knives.
After retrieving the sword, they brought it to their kingdom for safekeeping. They showed up at the gates without the blade where The Wriggling Man appeared with 4 Ankous. They asked what the nature of the planar breach was, to which The Wriggling Man replied "A contingency in case you fail to deliver the blade. Now give it to us." The group said they didn't have it. The Wriggling Man simply looked to the Ankous and said "Kill them." And walked through the gates to the First World. After battling the Ankous, the group returned to their capital in time to see the rift diminish. They specifically asked Anamar if it was closing, to which he replied "More like dispersing". Even though Anamar said it was dispersing, the group decided to leave the capital and go explore the remaining hexes that separate their kingdom from Pitax so they can assume control of it.

With the breach dispersed throughout their Capital, the Nights of Dread begin.

Night 1: Commoner 1 feels effects of Creeping Doom but rolls a natural 20. No report of a Bad Dream is made.

Day 1: No reports. PCs explore hexes moving towards Pitax.

Night 2: Commoner 2 feels effects of Creeping Doom, fails save is consumed.
Commoner 3 is attacked by a Tyrannosaurus results in a very public report.
The PCs were awakened in the field to a sending informing them of a mysterious murder in which a mother and her two children were ripped apart by some great beast. The PCs do a bit of detective work and realize that the creature was most likely summoned and based on tracks and description, they are confident it was a dinosaur. After some raising dead they moved the victimized family to the Palace in the city.

Day 2: Reports of Commoner 2's death surface. PCs head to the gates of The House of Knives to wait until nightfall hoping to confront the Wriggling Man. (who they are now absolutely sure is responsible.)

Night 3: Wriggling Man shows up when PCs stay at the gates. He casts mislead. For now he is far more comfortable intimidating and threatening the PCs. After demanding the sword another time and being denied he says "Perhaps We misjudged you. If the lives of the innocent won't spur you into action, perhaps the lives of ones more dear." The group attempts to return to the capital, unfortunately Teleport is a fickle beast and they end up in Tatzleford. Their roll not mine ;) That night includes attacks on individuals within the Palace: the attempted domination of Anamar, the bloodbath that was Sootscale and 4 other kobolds by the hands of monstrous scorpions, and the killing of Commoner 3 (again) by a Smilodon.
Hint 1: Anamar specifically states to the group that he had a dream that he felt was trying to compel him to kill the PC King, but they ask no further questions.

Day 3: Nothing transpires but the PCs decide to stay up to discover the source. (who they are still sure is The Wriggling Man.)

Night 4: They put the city guard on alert. The group clearly had no plan in case of an event. The perceptionless mage flew around via overland flight, the acute ranger stayed watch in the highest tower of the Palace with the kings cleric cohort. The monk sat at the table in the grand hall watching the king play dominoes with Anamar. In my effort to help them realize it's not The Wriggling Man, they hear three alarms sound simultaneously accross the city sounding off incidents. The group scurries in a panic and everyone heads off in different directions. Barbed devil kills commoners 4,5,6,7,8,9 & 10. Storm of vengeance targets commoner 10 saved at another nat 20, the cathedral is attacked by a bebelith that kills many of the clergy. Finally, a poor commoner and his dockside house are ripped apart by some aquatic creature that disappeared in the water below his home.
Hints 2 & 3: As stated above, incidents occur simultaneously. The group decides that The Wriggling Man must have someone working with him. Secondly, the cleric that had the dream at the temple lives. He tells the King that he feels he is responsible because he had been doing research on Bebiliths yesterday and had a nightmare only to awaken to it rampaging through the temple. The King tells him he is clearly not at fault and refuses the Clerics request to be locked up and monitored.

Day 4: At this point, everyone is frustrated. Everyone is getting pissed off at me and each feels they deserve a hint as to what's going on. Now we aren't children and only one of us has been gaming for less than three years. (In fact some of us are reaching 20 years experience.) So I take the frustration seriously and I want to mitigate it ASAP via a between session email:

"At the table, I can see the weight of frustration become something almost palpable. As I said about mid game last night, I know how hard it can be as a player to address events that span such long lengths in real world time. We all have real life concerns and play this game every Friday to ease and escape from some of life's drudgeries. I don't want both game and real life to become work, and I know without having to ask that you all feel the same. I think that it is important for us to separate character frustration with meta frustration. Your characters are confronted with an escalating situation targeting the innocents of High Guard (capital city) and there is seemingly nothing that anyone can do to thwart it. I know that I would be very upset as a player if I was presented with this type of situation. I can say with absolute certainty, all avenues of investigation have not been exhausted. I understand the want for 'a carrot on a string' but I promise you if i was to do that it would completely devalue the situation."

Day 4 continued: After a lengthy email discussion between sessions we continued last night. The group raised Sootscale, and finally questioned someone about their experience. He mentioned a massive black bird and scorpions in his dream. Finally the group begins to tie dreams to the summonings and investigates another crime scene to confirm. They find a reference book in the house of the leatherworker who was the first target of the barbed devil. The book is titled "Chelaxian Imprints and Patterns" and details many designs of an infernal nature.

Night 5: The PCs decide to enter their dreams. Instead of only targeting one of them and more random commoners, I targeted all of them. I planned that if even one of them was to face the Rook none of the dreams would take effect and they would defeat their first bloom. So I Individually took each player out of the room and described a nightmare entailing a horrifying visceral experience accompanied by a massive black crow. Independently, each PC ignored the Nightmare Rook and addressed their dream instead.

A battle with a Bebilith occurred while several spell effects took place. The group survived, but after the battle an interesting conversation took place. The group decided that The Wriggling Man must have been in the room but invisible. Now I am at a loss.

I see now that putting a face to the fey realm was apparently a dumb idea. I simply didn't foresee the group refusing to accept the Nightmare Rook as the deliverer of the dreams. Even though the Rook was explicitly described as the bringer of nightmares on several occasions, the group continues to think that The Wriggling Man is the source. This event has gone on for its third RL week, and clearly the novelty is wearing off.

So the only options that I, in my naïveté, can come up with are as follows:
A. Continue on my course and continue to hound the group night to night. Clearly this is what Nyrissa would do.
B. Start the second Bloom (The Whirling Lake) immediately to expand the scope of the Blooms beyond what is capable of one (wriggling) man.
C. Drop bigger hints to the PCs including possibly a method of ending the dreams. (Perhaps the Rook takes a more active role in the dreams forcing them to interact with it.)
D. Allow a skill check to discover a way to defeat the bloom. (I honestly hate doing things like this in high level play. I much prefer clever solutions, clue gathering, deductive reasoning and problem solving over simple "Skill check success=answers to legendary issues")

Please help me get my group back on track. This game is one month shy of its fifth RL anniversary. I don't want it to end with a sour taste in ANYONES mouth.
In any case, please give me some constructive criticism on the additions I have implemented to the game. What do you like? What do you dislike? What could/should I have done differently?

I'm fully willing to admit I am not a great GM yet, but I would like to hit that tier. Any feedback is appreciated and thanks for taking the time to read and help.


If you have a cleric see if they can commune with their god for some answers. Honestly my party figured it out but only because i told them their dreams in front of the other group members so they understood that the bird is the key. Introducing a big villain before they hit the thousand screams might keep them from following him into the plane of a demi god. Let them make their lore skills, its not fun but sometimes they want to move forward.

My party ran kingmaker, that whole AP is just a mess of a game from a DM's standpoint.


That's a good point, why are they not making use of magic to try and answer their questions? Or is it that they have no questions, because they are so convinced the wriggling man is the culprit?

It's frustrating for everyone when the players become utterly obsessed with a red herring.

Since the group already uncovered the information about the rook's nature, you might want to just remind them of it. The players have probably forgotten, the PCs might be a little more mindful of the clues. Maybe have them make an easy Int check to recall that bit of data.


Thanks for the responses. I honestly believe that the group has convinced themselves of The Wriggling Man's guilt so thoroughly that they are now justifying any clue I give to them. The NPC cleric cohort could certainly cast a divination spell to shed some light on the origins of the nightmares. Typically in the past any time they needed her to cast a "plead to the GM for clues" spell, they ask her to cast it and she does. The only thing is, they haven't asked her and just doing it is a bit of a deus ex machina. BUT desperate times call for desperate measures. I just hate to take the potential satisfaction players deserve and put it in the hands of a character that I control.

What do you think of a combination of several potential plot advancing tactics?
I think that introducing The Whirling Lake would be a nice break from the current situation. While the cleric cohort could suggest pleading to her god to ease the suffering of the innocents in the form of a cryptic divination spell. At least this way there would still be some figuring out to do for the PCs. What do you think about this:

"One thousand iniquities of the one with a thousand faces weigh on a million faded memories.
But the night black mare you seek, rides on hooves of remiges."

Also does anyone have any feedback on the additions?


It's been a while, wasn't Nyrissa punished by one of the Lords of the first world?

You could always have one of the Lords decide that Nyrissa is getting too close to success and have them drop your PC's a hint, just for their own amusement.

DBH


DBH, I've been thinking about this suggestion for quite a while. I'm really glad I have because at first I dismissed it and thought it was too much of an outright dues ex machina.

Now that I have had some time to digest it, I really like the idea of Magdh the seer of the Eldest offering aid for a price.

My question is what would an Eldest like Magdh ask for in return for shedding some light on the problems facing the PCs kingdom?


BornofHate wrote:

DBH, I've been thinking about this suggestion for quite a while. I'm really glad I have because at first I dismissed it and thought it was too much of an outright dues ex machina.

Now that I have had some time to digest it, I really like the idea of Magdh the seer of the Eldest offering aid for a price.

My question is what would an Eldest like Magdh ask for in return for shedding some light on the problems facing the PCs kingdom?

I had first thought of one of the Lords dropping an anonymous hint, just so they can watch Nyrissa's plans fail and her life end, all for laughs.

If it's Magdh though..

A Seer could have seen something coming that she could use a group of competent pawns for?

Or there is the Fey standard. Your firstborn child given to Magdh to be raised in the first world.

It's said her tribute can range from a child's shoe to the heart of a star, so it might be something that seems worthless to your PC's, yet has them wracking their brains as to just why this power wants it?

Not knowing your players and your campaign I can't be definite, all I can say is I would go with something reasonably innocuous that your players can pay quite easily, yet have it come back to bite them in the ass at a later date.

Something like having a glade in the Greenbelt become part of the first world, an area of the world that Magdh controls, meaning the a Lord of the first world now has a permanent foothold in the material plane.

Hope that was of some help?

DBH


So during game last night, we picked up right after the group all had dreams in the capital. I was ecstatic to see them beginning to talk about their dreams. In fact they all realized that, in some form or another a great black shadow or crow was in their dreams. Still, the group was hell bent on the Wriggling Man being the culprit. During a trip to the market, they encountered an old crone, Aggys the Crone with the Cart, giving harrow readings in the market square drawing a HUGE crowd. She was accompanied by someone who she referred to as her benefactor. This other woman was silent and stood behind Aggys. It was made apparent that every reading she was doing resulted in The Crows being in the malignant future spot, hence the crowd of onlookers.
Initially, only one of the PCs was present and wanted his reading. The Crone said that he was not ready and his future was tied to others too tightly to tell individually. Long story short: the PCs arrive as a group, the reading was done and Aggys admitted her card flipping was far too petty and unpredictable compared to She of Three. Magdh, her benefactor begins talking to the group and eventually gave the PCs this information:

The 1,000 iniquities of the one with 1,000 faces weigh on a million faded memories.
Blame all you might, but the mare of night you seek rides on hooves of remiges.

After the group shot glares at me for pulling a deus ex machina, they finally agree that the Rook is the one bringing the dreams. That night they decide to watch the skies for a crow as their king slept in order to go into his dreams again.
In the kings dream he dreamt he was walking through a field of pillars each marked with the names of thousands of innocents. As a large bird like shadow loomed over the field blocking out the stars, black tentacles composed of the dead rose from beneath the pillars. The paladin king channelled positive energy to thwart the tentacles, ignoring the rook. After waking and being the victim of yet another dream spell, the group heard the guards alarms of more occurrences ring throughout the city.

The group now knows the rook is responsible, has only seen him in their dreams, and is pissed at me. They all agreed they never would have figured out it was the Rook but are angry that I pulled the biggest faux pas of story telling.
The breach was originally found out to be tied to the first world in the form of dreams. The Black Bird in the dreams was known to be called the Nightmare Rook, the bringer of nightmares. The Nightmare Rook was mentioned in the story of Zuddiger's Picnic. Nightmares begin plaguing the kingdoms capital where the breach and research took place.Ulltimately (after GM coercion) the group ties the nightmares to the Bird in their dreams but is angry that it took me leading them by the nose. And now, the group is looking for a black bird in the sky during the night while people sleep. They have yet to confront the bird in their dreams, instead choosing to repeatedly, after a cumulative 6 dreams, react to the descriptive elements that are then brought into their reality.
The definition of insanity is doing something over and over and expecting a different result. I am going insane. I think my next step is to have the Rook arrogantly confront them in their dreams after introducing the next bloom. I would give the opportunity for answers if the right questions were asked.

So here is the lesson I think I learned: never assume your PCs are taking notes.


Well, the good news is that one of the PCs just sent out a group email after thinking about game. He pretty much nailed the solution.

It unfortunately took four weeks of game, but I think they have their answers. Thanks for the help guys. I'll post a follow up in two weeks when we play next.


BornofHate wrote:

Well, the good news is that one of the PCs just sent out a group email after thinking about game. He pretty much nailed the solution.

It unfortunately took four weeks of game, but I think they have their answers. Thanks for the help guys. I'll post a follow up in two weeks when we play next.

I look forward to hearing what happens.

You can always just smile at your players and agree that a major power of the first world gave them a hand, with no strings attached...

DBH


Oh, there were strings attached. If they chose to listen to her prophecy.... The price was five moments in time each.

What that means, they have yet to find out.

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