I don't know if and how this has been discussed, but... where do evil deities take their worshippers? I mean, alright for dudes like Asmodeus, which (other than thriving in the curtains of deception) can come to be somewhat accepted by the common folks, if they don't keep violence and suffering too high and too visible. Alright for Lamashtu, which has entire races (though far less numerous than Humans and the other more common guys) culturally devoted to her.
But it's guys like Zon-Kuthon and Rovagug that make me wonder. Zon-Kuthon gave (dark) cookies to Nidal, and got an amount of worship in return, but beyond that (or even within the borders of Nidal), how many intelligent beings can there be who like suffering, self-mutilation and all other nice things Zon-Kuthon has about him? Other evil deities may be whorshipped for power; a lot of people want power. But how many want loss and self-suffering, compared to the mass of worshippers a god like Nethys, or Erastil, or Torag may have?
Same for Rovagug: how many fans can it have, except the occasional madman here and there?
Ultimately, even including all the evil beings in the world and beyond, isn't there a huge disparity in the number of worshippers some deities get, compared to others?
And isn't that a significant problem for the less liked gods?
... Ultimately, even including all the evil beings in the world and beyond, isn't there a huge disparity in the number of worshippers some deities get, compared to others?
And isn't that a significant problem for the less liked gods?
One thing that comes to mind is the level of devotion a worshipper has for their deity. A blazing evil fanatic might count for a platoon of casual worshippers. Also, the question of how many deities a person worships might be a factor. Some people spread their worship among several deities, others are devoted to just one. But yeah, there has to be a limit on how many homicidal fanatically evil cultists there are in any world...
*edit* And those evil types might enhance the power of their worship through methods like human sacrifice (on the alter as it were) or ritual murder (i.e. the Thugee who worshipped Kali in rl). Another element might be actions that happen in the world that give power to evil deitites even if they aren't performed by worshippers or done in the deities name (i.e. a god of murder benefitting from every murder).
And, yet more thoughts, some gods are gretaer than others. Some of the nastier ones might be less powerful than good ones. They might be more involved in the world than good ones too...
Deities who are in the same pantheon might benefit from association with their kinder, gentler bretheren as well.
In case of Zon-Kuthon I would expect his worship often spread through abuse and traumatic bonding, often deliberate and intended to produce brainwashing-like effects.
Alot of this is really covered by Faiths of Corruption. I can only remember some of the info in Regards to Urgathoa and Norgerber(sp?)
In the case of Urgathoa it looks like she draws alot of potential worshipers in Via Parties and other events which seem to be sort of like underground Raves. For alot of people they likely never get beyond that. At some point a potential worshiper craves more and they get pulled in.
In the case of Norgerber, His Stuff about Secrecy leads to alot of connections of worshipers among politics and stuff i believe. Be it actual politicians or spies etc.
Im a little shaky if my memory is correct on Norgerber though.
Z-K and Asmodeus could both get a bunch of attention from people who wanted to Punish Those Guys Over There. Z-K's followers might take up jobs as hangmen, for example, or torturers.
Rovagugs worshippers are anyone who just wants to smash things for the pleasure of smashing them. There are a LOT of those.
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Firstly, you're right, the Evil Gods are a bit less commonly worshipped, but unlike some settings, worship doesn't see4m to inherently equate to power in Golarion, so it's less of a problem than it might be.
Secondly, I'll go through them:
Asmodeus: As you note, he's got plenty of worshippers.
Zon-Kuthon: Has Nidal. His cults are also really pernicious, because they can gradually corrupt people who simply have exotic tastes of one sort or another. I imagine anyone who wants to get whipped recreationally in Golarion needs to go to a Temple of Calistria if they don't want good odds of dealing with worshippers of his, for example. And he's not supposed to be a really popular God in the first place.
Norgorber: Is the God of criminals of all sorts. Almost everyone who makes their living as a thief, legbreaker, assassin, or debt collector is probably inclined to throw a prayer his way now and again. Criminals are a minority, but a pretty big constituency all things considered.
Urgathoa: Has the Undead. Almost all intelligent undead have her as their patron, and that's not that small a group all things considered. Among her non-undead worshippers, she has the lure of immortality to offer, which is a hell of an offer, and one no other deity can make even half as easily.
Lamashtu: Again, as you mention, she has lots of nonhuman worshippers, as well as some isolated human cults.
Rovagug: Orcs as a whole worship Rovagug. So do Ropers and various other Abberations. And many of the races who normally serve Lamashtu have large Cults of Rovagug among them (Rovagug worshipping Gnolls feature prominently in Legacy of fire, for example). Human cults are usually a particular small tribe of Barbarians who do so for his power or something similar.
Additional information of this sort is available in Faiths of Corruption.
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I've always considered (and this is by no means canon, or non-canon) most non-clerics in Golarion to be slightly pantheistic, i.e. they'll worship and pray to whatever god fits the bill currently. People might pray to Norgorber to not get caught, Urgathoa to lift disease, or Lamashtu during a difficult pregnancy. When pushed, people will make a deal with the devil.
Speaking of! I consider Asmodeus's greatest trick (or "legal loophole", as I'm sure he'd prefer) to be the number of otherwise good people who direct worship to him. He's convinced the masses that he's part of the divine plan, that he only punishes the wicket, and that that's what "good" wants.
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Ultimately, even including all the evil beings in the world and beyond, isn't there a huge disparity in the number of worshippers some deities get, compared to others?
And isn't that a significant problem for the less liked gods?
Correct me if I am wrong Astral Wanderer, but you seem to be working off the assumption that the Gods need worshippers in order to maintain their power. While this has certainly been true for some campaign settings, it does not seem to be the case with the Pathfinder Campaign Setting.
Some Gods do not care if they are worshipped or not, as their power is not necessarily dependant upon worship. For example, Rovagug is simply an intelligent and primal manifestation of complete annihilation. He cares not one iota about garnering the devotion of mortals. They signify nothing to him, except perhaps a quick meal.
Even for Demons like Lamashtu, worshippers are only important in that they more effectively allow the spread of Chaos and Evil upon other planes of existence; like vectors for a virus. And really, the same goes for Asmodeus and the Legions of Hell.
Evil gods don't need as many worshippers as good ones because theirs are *better*. The faithful of Erastil will go to church every Sunday and pray a bit, maybe sacrifice a sheep every year and so on. woot. Not much power to be gained there.
Followers of Rovagug, OTOH, lay waste to entire towns in his name, sacrificing the virgins on midnight altars and pledge their very souls to his undying service. A bit better.
Of course it's not explicit that the gods need worshippers on Golarion to give the power. Cayden Caylean became a god for a bet, not because a million people thought he deserved it.
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And don't forget that even if the gods' deific power is self-sufficient, the evil gods (as well as the neutral and good gods to a lesser degree) are able to use their followers as tools to further their schemes.
For example, Rovagug the Rough Beast wants to be set free from his prison at all costs, and is more than willing to promise his individual worshipers anything to achieve that end. Of course, we all know what will happen to those loyal devotees if he is released.
Correct me if I am wrong Astral Wanderer, but you seem to be working off the assumption that the Gods need worshippers in order to maintain their power.Ultimately, even including all the evil beings in the world and beyond, isn't there a huge disparity in the number of worshippers some deities get, compared to others?
And isn't that a significant problem for the less liked gods?
I'll correct you, then.
I haven't read anything about Golarion in regards to the number of worshippers fueling a Deity's own power, and in fact I didn't mean to assume that.Besides, that's an approach I dislike for a number of reasons.
Yet, worshippers do give power to a Deity, in a way. Having an army of 1,000 is surely different than having one of 10. This has an impact on many ways. The first (and also the rarest to occur) is open war between Gods. But it's in the more subtle everyday care-taking of plans that trouble comes.
To stay on Rovagug and Zon-Kuthon's examples...
Rovagug: yep, for the big spider, mortals are basically like spiders are for most mortal themselves: unworthy of more attention than the one required to stomp on them. Yet, it doesn't deny his powers to whoever whorships him, even if it is someone that in another situation it would have crushed. And it does the right thing in not negleting them, because he's imprisoned not just in a world, but in a whole universe of mortals, and they are (supposedly) the only tools it can use to break free. So, a larger number of worshippers would mean a proportionally closer freedom.
Zon-Kuthon: he likes the world of mortals, and would like it better enshrouded in darkness and loss and pain. And he also likes to be worshipped (otherwise he wouldn't have bargained with the ancient people of Nidal for salvation in exchange for devotion), so a large number of worshippers who work to his ends would do him good (figures, he likes "good"). But, as previously said... how many, outside of Nidal (or even inside) worship a God of loss and pain? He should have a problem, if relatively, with that.
This W.O.E. group, reminds me of the great and powerful 'Every Villain is Lemons' - Otherwise known as EVIL!!!!