[Spoilers] Seek Thoughts at Ascanor Lodge


Carrion Crown


Spoilers, please don't read if you are a player.

I have a diviner in my group that has a pretty high concentration and has already informed the party that he intends to spend his time at Ascanor Lodge talking with the guests and using Seek Thoughts. He intends to do this to find out more about why the Whispering Way came to the Lodge. I'm talking about Seek Thoughts here, not Detect Thoughts.

I'm mostly concerned about him doing this to Estovion as we know Estovion is the one hiding the most.

I'm looking for some early advice from my fellow DMs on how to play this out.

I realize that Estovion has an extremely high Will save (+12) and is a conjurer himself - so perhaps would recognize what's going on. Perhaps he just Spellcrafts it and puts up some protection himself and becomes even more paranoid about the PCs (which moves us along in the Events).

Since I have some time before the next session (a couple of weeks) I was hoping I'd get some cool ideas from you guys about how to play this out, what he might be thinking about, what maybe some of the other NPCs at the lodge would be thinking about, etc. It'd be cool for me to write these down ahead of time and be prepared. I find spells like this somewhat hard to do off-the-cuff at the table so am trying to prepare ahead of time.

Thanks!


Divination is the bane of storytelling and suspense if not properly prepared for. You essentially have three options.

#1) If you're worried about it messing things up then just fudge Estovian's save as a pass. It won't be entirely negating the PC as they can still gain plenty of info from the other guests. Then you can have him figure it out and raise his paranoia score. In which case he may become "entirely too busy" and avoid speaking to the PC in question when possible to not give them another chance.

#2) If you want to be fair about it then go by the rules. He has a high save, chances are he'll pass. Otherwise give them some info. Have him make that sense motive check. He might be paranoid enough to purposefully try to avoid thinking about it. They have to know what to ask for first and it's always simple and general information. They won't get his -entire- set up and plan.

#3) If you're worried and want to be fair then just rearrange some of Estovian's feats and give him Improved Iron Will so he can re-roll his save if he fails. If he somehow fails twice then see #2.

Also, remember that Seek Thoughts isn't conclusive proof and Estovian can always play innocent and seek protection from the other lodge guests if the PCs just attack him. "He's guilty because I read his mind!" is not exactly compelling evidence. Otherwise it's just a lead that they can follow up on for more investigation. If they make shorter work of the investigation than you expect then just accelerate the timetable.

Treat it as a hook. Have him think about his journal in his room (appearing as an image) and the empathetic feeling of nervousness as a potential answer, thus prompting investigation. Nothing says the answer must be entirely straightforward. If they try to get more specific and ask about his secret journal... well, that's kind of a giveaway. Give them just enough info to follow up on. It's a means, not an end.


Make sure you understand how Seek Thoughts works. It doesn't at all let you read the minds of people (though the language is just a bit unclear). It allows you to identify people currently thinking of that subject upon which you are concentrating. Ex:

I, the almight diviner, says to the DM, "I'm casting Seek Thoughts focusing my attention on anyone who is thinking about the Whispering Way."

You, the clever DM, can say, "No one appears to be thinking about the Whispering Way, currently." or you might grant, "Oh, look, Estovian appears to have them on his mind."

By casting it and maintaining it, you can try to trick people into thinking about that subject. You might think, what good is that? You just mentioned it, of course they're thinking of it.

Well, imagine that you're talking to Estovian and he's *not* thinking about the Whispering Way. And so you casually just drop a name in the middle of your conversation, "Adivion Adrissant". Of course that's going to flummox him. Most likely it would dredge up thoughts of the WW. And then he would "ding" for you; you would know he's thinking about the WW. This would prove and tell you three things: he knows AA, he knows of the WW, and he knows that AA is connected to WW. You've just learned a lot.

As a DM, that's a lot less difficult to manage and, like Luther's last suggestion, provides a great hook opportunity if you need or want to give any hints to your group.


There is also a reasonable decoy in the form of Cilas Graydon. There is every possibility someone in his position knows just enough about the whispering way to be justifiably afraid and suspicious of anyone bringing them up in polite conversation, and to know

PFSRD Seek Thoughts wrote:
...the beliefs of an evil cult.

Considering that both Cilas and Estovian will both immediately be distrustful, suspicious, and think about the Whispering way in some detail, it should be enough to throw them off the trail a bit. At that point everyone in the room should get that sense motive check to detect them using seek thoughts, and someone should call them on their terribly uncivilized behavior.


I appreciate the replies, all. I'll let you know how it plays out (it'll be almost a month due to some travel with several of our players). Cheers!

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