Capstone abilities

[Skamander]

Ryan Dancey wrote:

"At 20th level—the maximum level currently supported by the Pathfinder RPG—characters that haven't multiclassed earn a "capstone ability," a special and really cool power reserved for characters who chose to master a single class throughout their adventuring career."

If the designers are smart (and they certainly seem to be), they will keep the details of the capstone abilities a deep and deadly secret. That will make for an excruciating player dilemma, at least for the first year or so: Go multiclass, which is often more fun, or go for the capstone, when you have no idea what it's going to be?

Nor will you be able to hedge your bets; if it takes as long as Ryan is hinting to reach the level cap, you'll have to take the decision early on in order not to waste all that time and experience.

Any views on how you're likely to jump on this one, assuming you join the game at an early stage?

[Nihimon]

If I have to make such an important decision based on such incomplete knowledge, I think I might be a little irritated.

[exil3dbyrd]

It's risky and hard to keep something like that secret. You can only depend on internal testing and if the ability is strong or weak the players will whine. That said I hope that they can pull off keeping it a secret and just the right power. I love the feeling of discovery and uncertainty that comes with a new game.

[Onishi]

From the sounds of it the capstones will more likely be intended to be a flare/status symbal

Ryan Dancey wrote:

I agree. On the other hand, it's easy to have lots of stuff that would be considered "cool" to have earned but which don't affect your character's desirability as a companion. The problem with WoW is that everything they do in the game seems to require some kind of mechanical benefit (well except maybe the pets).

Earning the 20th level in a class will get you a 20th level class-type merit badge and that will unlock a 20th level Ability. That will be the mechanical benefit people will pursue. The capstone ability does not necessarily have to be something that changes a 20th level non-capstone character into a mistake. It could be something that is just enjoyable for the player - a way to "show off" to friends and opponents.

[MendedWall12]

Speaking from the point of view of someone who really wants to enter the game as a craftsman of some kind (perhaps of even seemingly less important items like lamps, or farming tools, or maybe even a stonemason), I'd love the capstone abilities to be much more a flavorful showing off of the fact that I've reached unparalleled skill at my craft. Whether that means my character now travels around in a palanquin, on the back of an elephant, or simply just has better looking clothes than all those around me is up the developers. I agree that a capstone ability doesn't have to be mechanically amazing, if it really showcases the fact that I stuck with a certain skill from dawn to dusk, and worked my tail off to be the best at what I do.

[Daniel Powell 318]

I might hedge my bets, and play two mains. I figure that at least part of the business plan involved being able to develop new skills and abilities a few steps ahead of the players, so the capstone abilities will be introduced in order to make the characters who get them somewhat, but not too much, cooler than the characters who did not have the limits growing up.

[Pucktheplatypus]

I also would really prefer to know what I can do ahead of time, making an uninformed decision kinda sucks

[Valkenr]

First there is no level cap, in the same post he says that after hitting the 20th badge you can move on to training a new archetype.

Second, the game is still in the planning phase, I'm sure a detailed progression map will be released when the game actually has some code behind it.

[KitNyx]

For me, unless they are really diverse, there is almost no way I will be able to stay within a single archetype for 2.5 years. No capstones for me...(I am already resigned to that fact)

[Nihimon]

I still think it would be really cool if there were also Multi-Class Capstones. You've been training Wizard and Sorcerer in parallel? Okay, once you get 20 in both, you get a unique Capstone Ability for Wizard/Sorcerers. I'm not sure this is practical though.

[Pucktheplatypus]

I truly love that idea Nihimon, one of my favorite manga was Yureka which is all about an mmo people play mostly while their asleep. The main characters have been around forever and have maxed 2 typical classes allowing them to do so much more together than they could have done solo.

[Valkenr]

Nihimon wrote:

I still think it would be really cool if there were also Multi-Class Capstones. You've been training Wizard and Sorcerer in parallel? Okay, once you get 20 in both, you get a unique Capstone Ability for Wizard/Sorcerers. I'm not sure this is practical though.

I'm would be fine with that, as long as the Multi-class capstone is only equal to a single capstone.

But I still wouldn't like it in the game. When you focus on a single goal you become much more proficient, when your focus is split you lose some proficiency.

The trade off is getting a quicker development early on.

I don't think they are practical either, it creates too many things to balance, and doesn't help the person that only wants a few ranks in a class or wants to parallel more than 2 classes at a time.

I like having to choose if i want to be a jack-of-all-trades, or a master of a single craft.