Sorry, I don't understand. Are you implying that the class is too powerful?
The language is a little tricky, and I tried wording it right, but still don't think I did so.
Basically, he can only intercept one attack made against each of his allies per turn. If the same ally gets hit twice, he can only intercept the one attack.
It's sort of like the In Harm's Way feat, but better (which is where I got the idea).
Fair criticism.
I suppose it is evident how much I despise feat trees and the investment required to do anything of merit in the 3.5/Pathfinder system.
I like playing something which is relevant from 1st level all the way through to 20th. I hate having to wait until mid-level just for the right feats to begin to synergize, allowing for the character concept to finally play the way I intended from the start.
So, I guess I'm not really trying to balance my homebrew against core. And, yes it is OP in comparison.
I should have mentioned something along those lines in the original post, but alas it is really early and I've been up all night XD.
That'd probably be the best way of going about integrating it with core. Wouldn't be half bad, either.
No problem, and thanks. Thanks for stopping by; the input is appreciated.
Link.
I thought about something similar.
First things:
Challenge and Defensive Stance should be renamed - there are existing class abilities of the same name (Cavalier - Challenge, Stalwart Defender - Defensive Stance) that work differently.
Challenge could be renamed something like Threatening or Distracting Threat or Threatening Distraction. I disagree with the notion that Challenge requires some sort of miss chance. But it would benefits from some clarifications, like how it works with reach weapons, does it allow multiple targets being affected at the same time.
Protective Gaze line about one attack per ally per round is actually redundant. Character can make only one immediate action per turn and I can't remember any ability that would allow making more immediate actions per turn, maybe except of hero points but spending hero point to get another redirect is ok for me. I am uncertain at the moment if this ability should be kept or just reworked into Bodyguard and In Harm's Ways granted as bonus feats, spread between a few levels.
Defensive Powers: Mostly taken from Stalwart Defender so little to disscuss. Maybe a note should be added that Guardian and Stalwart Defenders level stack when determining effects of defensive powers of the same name. Or maybe half the Guardian levels should be added to Stalwart Defender levels when calculating effects of Defensive Powers - as Stalwart Defender's powers were designed as abilities for 10 level PrC and not 20 level base class.
Uncanny Dodge: I think it should be moved to 4th level and Improved Uncanny Dodge to 8th. This would spread his abilities more amongst the levels.
I like the general idea of the class and thought about something like that for some time, but it didn't occured to me of trying to turn Stalwart Defender into base class. However, it *seems* to be too powerful for its own good, but some tests would be required beyond mere eyeballing.
Challenge and Defensive Stance should be renamed - there are existing class abilities of the same name (Cavalier - Challenge, Stalwart Defender - Defensive Stance) that work differently.
Replacing Cavalier with a Captain class (LOTRO) and replacing Stalwart Defender with this class - so, I didn't think to do so. But, yea, probably a good idea.
Challenge could be renamed something like Threatening or Distracting Threat or Threatening Distraction. I disagree with the notion that Challenge requires some sort of miss chance. But it would benefits from some clarifications, like how it works with reach weapons, does it allow multiple targets being affected at the same time.
Intended to only work against a single target. Might need some better language. My head hurts XD.
Protective Gaze line about one attack per ally per round is actually redundant. Character can make only one immediate action per turn and I can't remember any ability that would allow making more immediate actions per turn, maybe except of hero points but spending hero point to get another redirect is ok for me. I am uncertain at the moment if this ability should be kept or just reworked into Bodyguard and In Harm's Ways granted as bonus feats, spread between a few levels.
Hah, totally missed that. Thanks for catching it.
Defensive Powers: Mostly taken from Stalwart Defender so little to disscuss. Maybe a note should be added that Guardian and Stalwart Defenders level stack when determining effects of defensive powers of the same name. Or maybe half the Guardian levels should be added to Stalwart Defender levels when calculating effects of Defensive Powers - as Stalwart Defender's powers were designed as abilities for 10 level PrC and not 20 level base class.
I don't think the two should be allowed anywhere near one another! This base class was meant to replace the Stalwart Defender (takes too long to get into).
Uncanny Dodge: I think it should be moved to 4th level and Improved Uncanny Dodge to 8th. This would spread his abilities more amongst the levels.
Sounds good. 5th level is empty at that point, so I think I will add "Mobile Defense" at that level.
I like the general idea of the class and thought about something like that for some time, but it didn't occured to me of trying to turn Stalwart Defender into base class. However, it *seems* to be too powerful for its own good, but some tests would be required beyond mere eyeballing.
After dropping my girlfriend off at her place, I picked up some snacks at 711 and decided I'd take a crack at building a decent tank class. Dissected the Stalwart Defender and took it from there. Literally just built it though, so it probably needs a whole lot of readjusting. Not sure if it is going to be too powerful, but I think that since the class gets a lot more out of Dexterity (Armor Training), players aren't going to want to dump it like they do with the more Strength-based Two-Handed Fighter/Paladin builds. So, between Str, Dex, and Con I think they aren't going to be able to pump everything... but, then again, I'd love to make Wis more integral to the class. Not sure how I'd go about doing that, though.
Thanks for the feedback, Drejk - always have good things to say.
Oh, and the class relies heavily on attacks of opportunity - all the more reason why Dex is important. More Dex means less Str, means less damage. So, while the class is awesome at the defensive - it isn't going to be a power house of damage.
Replacing Cavalier with a Captain class (LOTRO)
Share! Or else! I was thinking how to do LOTROs Captain for some time (precisely since January when I started playing LOTRO... eh, I need to reinstal system, reinstal gfx drivers and return to playing it).
Intended to only work against a single target. Might need some better language. My head hurts XD.
Maybe add line saying that "A guardian can have only one creature targeted with this ability at the same time."
I don't think the two should be allowed anywhere near one another! This base class was meant to replace the Stalwart Defender (takes too long to get into)
I thought so after reading it.
Not sure if it is going to be too powerful, but I think that since the class gets a lot more out of Dexterity (Armor Training), players aren't going to want to dump it like they do with the more Strength-based Two-Handed Fighter/Paladin builds.
Yes, that class seems to be very MAD but counting on it for players to not abuse it... Well, lets say I would not bet my money on it.
However, the primary source of that gut feeling about Guardian being overpowered comes from seeing high BAB, 1d12 for HD *and* two favored saving throws and lots of things perlevel in addition to those. It has to be checked in pratice to be sure either way.So, between Str, Dex, and Con I think they aren't going to be able to pump everything... but, then again, I'd love to make Wis more integral to the class. Not sure how I'd go about doing that, though.
And Charisma! Don't forget Charisma! :D
What if the penalty for the (soon to be renamed) Challenge wasn't fixed -2 and instead it would be equal to Charisma bonus (minimum 1).Or maybe Guardian could keep Challenge on a total number of targets equal to his Charisma bonus (minimum 1).Oh, and the class relies heavily on attacks of opportunity - all the more reason why Dex is important. More Dex means less Str, means less damage. So, while the class is awesome at the defensive - it isn't going to be a power house of damage.
Replacing Protective Gaze with Bodyguard and In Harm's Way bonus feats would make it rely on AoO more as the Guardian had to use either standard action to aid ally's AC or one of his attacks of opportunity to do the same before he could intercept the attack. It would need to be spread between the initial levels, however, as giving two bonus feats at 1st level would be a bit much.
The Captain class is going to be my next big project. I started with Guardian, as I thought it'd be easier.
Going to build it off the Bard and Cavalier. It will probably resemble the Battle Herald, and 4E's Warlord.
The Captain class is going to be my next big project. I started with Guardian, as I thought it'd be easier.
I have warlord as work in progress, maybe I upload it to GoogleDocs and give link to it later. But now (well, actually in your previous post) you started me to think how to make it from scratch using Paladin as a core instead of Fighter as I initially did.
Going to build it off the Bard and Cavalier. It will probably resemble the Battle Herald, and 4E's Warlord.
Obvious choices. I started with Warlord having commands that were tweaked bardic performances. Now I am wondering about Paladin-based captain that instead of smites marks his opponents to grant bonuses to his allies.
That could work. The Holy Shield does something similar; replaces Smite with a ally-buff.