| LizardMage |
Just seeing if anyone thinks I need to increase the CR for the Emperor Cobra if I give it the following attack
Spit: +6 (No Damage causes Blindness, Save Reflex DC 16) Range 5ft.
Appreciate your thoughts or suggestions about making it into a spitting cobra.
Range is based on a real spitting cobra which only gets at most 6ft, granted they don't get as big as in Pathfinder so I might make it a 10ft range.
| TanithT |
Just seeing if anyone thinks I need to increase the CR for the Emperor Cobra if I give it the following attack
Spit: +6 (No Damage causes Blindness, Save Reflex DC 16) Range 5ft.
Appreciate your thoughts or suggestions about making it into a spitting cobra.
Range is based on a real spitting cobra which only gets at most 6ft, granted they don't get as big as in Pathfinder so I might make it a 10ft range.
I have very little input on the stats; I'm not great with the crunchy parts of game mechanics. However, some words about this genus may be helpful.
The Asian spitters do tend to be on the twee side, especially the little brown jobbers out of Java that are hard as heck to identify without counting subcaudals. Lots of those get imported, and doing veterinary and husbandry care on them is ever so much fun and requires a full face mask as they will spray quite copiously and indiscriminately and you don't really want the stuff up your nose. Not that it will harm you directly, but it is Bad News for a handler to be repeatedly exposed to venom proteins through mucous membrane as it tends to sensitize to future anaphylactic reaction. The little brown jobbers, which are usually misclassified as sputatrix and aren't, rarely top 5'.
But some of the African spp, most notably Naja nigricollis, can easily top 8'. My friend's breeding pair were over 7' and over 8' respectively (the female and the male) and quite impressively husky. Also, these buggers are far more accurate with their aim than the spastic brown sort whose subspecies is so often in taxonomic question. Whilst sexing a group of babies in order to obtain a trio for myself, this accuracy was repeatedly and impressively demonstrated on my goggles. Adults of this species in captivity totally lose all desire to spit or even to hood, but the youngsters are chock full of spit and vinegar. I like them, though. They are cute little poison worms as long as you keep your goggles on. They take about six months to calm down into decent citizens, and you will be very hard pressed to ever see them hood or spit after that, if they are reared in captivity.
Spitting is always a defensive act and is fear motivated. It is absolutely not used in hunting, in aggression, or in intraspecies combat. An adult spitter of decent size has a pretty good range, under optimal conditions that allow them to stand and throw. I haven't measured, but other researchers have. It wouldn't surprise me if it was more than 6'. I'm sure you could find the numbers with a simple search, but please ignore any drek you get from popular "edutainment" sites, they're mostly dumbed down and inaccurate.
A 9' real life spitting cobra would not surprise me at all, if it was a black-neck red spitter. Over 8' is not unusual in collections. If you were postulating an even larger cobra, modeling on Ophiophagus hannah (the king cobra), a 19' real life specimen of that (currently) monotypic genus has been well documented. I did a minor veterinary procedure on a 16' specimen some years ago. I was utterly unable to restrain this animal's neck in one of my hands due to its sheer size and thickness and had to use two, plus a python patient sized tube, to restrain for anesthesia. Fabulous animal.
Cobras are not physically strong. They are not constrictors. They are moderately arboreal and can coil and pull for leverage when they want to argue with a handler, but they can not exert anywhere near the force of a boa or a python, nor even that of a king snake or corn snake of equivalent size. The 16' king cobra was not difficult for me to arm-wrestle with and win, and I am a 5' female. Though due to its sheer length and awkwardness I called on some assistants for safe restraint. You generally want one pair of hands for every 5' of snake to stabilize the spine and prevent injury to the occipital condyle in case of ischemic contraction during struggle - it doesn't help to break your patient's neck in the process of removing a small tumor. There is no way I would attempt to overpower a 16' constrictor, which is physically strong enough to kick Hulk Hogan's butt, and would outweigh him to boot. Cobras don't weigh that much; the average 5' to 7' adult is only two to maybe six pounds, and an average adult king cobra might go from 15 to 30 lbs. I do not recall getting a weight on the 16' monster, but would estimate him at 35 to 40 lbs.
Little known fact, almost all venomous snakes can spit on an "air strike", and they will when sufficiently stressed. Their aim is dismal and they throw venom and salivary exudate in a descending arc only a few feet away. You really don't want to see them in that much stress though; it's not at all good for them. Snake venom is harmless on skin or clothes, and in fact you can drink it. Some show-offy milkers do, but I don't recommend it as mucous membrane contact with snake venom proteins can predispose to anaphylaxis on a bite. It tastes like very bitter orange juice, btw. No, I didn't drink it on purpose.
Spitting cobras bite, and that bite is *horrendous*. It will melt flesh from bone. Not quickly, and not literally, but that is what your limb will look like over time as the necrotic tissue sloughs. I honestly don't worry a whole lot about spitters that spit. Face shields are easy to wear, and venom washes out. What we keep on hand is contact lens cleaning solution, which is a protein diluent and is very effective in removing venom from eyes when applied immediately. Really any liquid is fairly effective if applied quickly. Most of the handlers I know who work with spitters have had it in the eye at least once. It's not considered too much of a muchness in the field, just a week's worth of being sore, red-eyed, and laughed at by your colleagues for being too careless to wear a face shield instead of just relying on your glasses.
In a fantasy game scenario setting, hopefully the afflicted characters will be smart enough to apply some sort of continual eye wash in short order, and that will mitigate the effects if done quickly. The pain and irritation is quite bad. If you do not have liquid handy, or do not have enough liquid handy, that's when you could be looking at long term consequences like corneal ulceration.
A real life spitter will spit and run as a general rule, though some of the bolder ones will spit and stand their ground. This really isn't common. Even the ones who stand awhile almost invariably cut and run when their spitting is ignored by the cheerful vet tech who is determined to seize them and put uncomfy probes up their tails or whatnot. A pity, as that makes my job harder. They don't stand and fight, as your typical "monster" would. Arguing with a cobra, even a terribly naughty one that is being territorial and wants to chase you out of its enclosure, tends to involve more time spent chasing them to them chasing you. There is a lot of back and forth, cutting and running, then returning in a rush. Or not, if they can just get away. In the vast majority of cases, the cobra will always be the one running away, and will whirl when necessary to make short defensive strikes or charges in an attempt to back you off so that it has the room to turn again and run. All it generally takes to back them off again is a gentle touch with a snake hook. It is very, very rare that a cobra could be characterized as aggressive. Defensive, absolutely, and I don't recommend cornering them in close quarters.
Cobras are fragile. Very, very fragile. All snakes are really, save for the largest of the constrictors who have an impressive girdle of musculature to protect their breakable ribs and tender internal organs. I wouldn't give them a great many hit points. A toddler squeezing too hard could cause fatal damage to a viper due to their lack of supporting musculature. A slightly older child could do the same to an average sized cobra. An overenthusiastic idiot adult handler can do it to a king cobra. There's a reason I advocate tubing rather than neck gripping; they are much too easy to damage. Don't even get me started about Pilstrom gripping tongs; they are a snake chiropracter's nightmare, and I absolutely don't recommend their use if you want your zoo specimens healthy.
From a combat simulation point of view rather than a zoo vet grumbling about valuable specimens point of view, all reptiles may be given a larger temporary hit point pool for the purposes of representing their ability to continue defending themselves after they have taken a mortal level of damage. They can sustain levels of blood acidosis that would be instantly fatal or incapacitating to a mammal. You can literally eviscerate them, pith the brain and stop the heart, and they can continue to strike and bite reflexively for quite some time. Many envenomations have occurred from decapitated snakes.
Nervous wild cobras have personalities that remind me of chihuahuas - rather yappy, prone to rushing and bluffing and then running away again, only to whirl and bluff some more if you pursue. Also, they are slow strikers, easily confused, and blind behind the hood, making it easy to do things like sneak funny party hats on their bewildered little heads from behind. Well, actually it was topical meds for a skin lesion, but it looked like a funny party hat. LOL Some people think it is amusing to kiss cobras on the hood, which I consider a remarkably silly reason to stress the poor thing, but the point is that it's not very hard to do.
Cobras have one sharp pointy end that it is wise to avoid. Beyond that, they're pretty well fragile and helpless. Forest cobras and king cobras can be a bit naughty, as can a big wild caught black spitter, but anyone with the strength of a 12 year old and the leverage of a snake hook or even a long stick can gain complete physical control of them in short order if they know what they are doing. I know there's a lot of mystique and fear about cobras, but most of it really isn't well-earned.
If it helps for further reference, there's pictures and whatnot on my site, though most of it illustrates veterinary and husbandry practices. http://www.snakegetters.com