Im thinking of trying to rig something up via engineering that will allow me to attach a lance to my mount/military saddle removing my character from the lance equation, allowing the charge to use the horses str bonus instead of my own, but having a pivot such that my character is still aiming the lance.
1) Does this make sense?
2) What kind of cost for materials do you feel is appropriate
3) What difficulty engineering check do you feel is appropriate
4) If i had lance proficiency would it carry to this new device or would it still be a -4 unless i take a feat in my new weapon/device.
Im going to propose this Saturday to the gm for the game i play a character in, just looking for some input so i can polish this up to try and get it past him :)
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Boring answer: Humans have been perfecting ways of killing each other for millennia, and lances have been around for much of that time in one form or another. If an arrangement such as you propose were beneficial, someone would have invented it. So "no" to question #1 and the rest are moot.
Fantasy answer: Sure, go for it. If I were your DM I'd say it should cost about 100 gp more than a regular lance AND it must be masterwork. IMO Knowledge (engineering) allows you to design things, not build them; craft skills are required to execute the design. The engineering check should be very difficult, so DC 25 (if it were easier, someone else would have invented it already). I think it should take three Craft (weapon) checks: a DC 18 check to create the exotic weapon, a DC 20 check to create a "complex or superior item" and another DC 20 check for the masterwork property. It would require an exotic weapon proficiency to use this contraption without penalty.
Im thinking of trying to rig something up via engineering that will allow me to attach a lance to my mount/military saddle removing my character from the lance equation, allowing the charge to use the horses str bonus instead of my own, but having a pivot such that my character is still aiming the lance.
1) Does this make sense?
2) What kind of cost for materials do you feel is appropriate
3) What difficulty engineering check do you feel is appropriate
4) If i had lance proficiency would it carry to this new device or would it still be a -4 unless i take a feat in my new weapon/device.Im going to propose this Saturday to the gm for the game i play a character in, just looking for some input so i can polish this up to try and get it past him :)
Im thinking of trying to rig something up via engineering that will allow me to attach a lance to my mount/military saddle removing my character from the lance equation, allowing the charge to use the horses str bonus instead of my own, but having a pivot such that my character is still aiming the lance.
1) Does this make sense?
2) What kind of cost for materials do you feel is appropriate
3) What difficulty engineering check do you feel is appropriate
4) If i had lance proficiency would it carry to this new device or would it still be a -4 unless i take a feat in my new weapon/device.Im going to propose this Saturday to the gm for the game i play a character in, just looking for some input so i can polish this up to try and get it past him :)
Pretty much agree with all the recommendations Jim makes. They're solid. I'll leave it to folks with better engineering skills than I have to say whether it's even possible. The key point though, is that this is (for the fantasy time period normally assumed to be medieval) cutting edge, very experimental stuff. In real life, to my knowledge, nothing like it was ever attempted, so it might not even be feasible. Therefore, I would probably make the Engineering check a little more dificult, say 35-40. 25 sounds high until you start getting into the mid-levels when someone could have a stat-boosted Int score in the mid-20s, and several ranks in the skill.
Jim hits it on the head....but here ya go.....
The main thing I think your missing in Lance use is the Impact. When you slam that Lance into a target in history anyway, you let go of the thing. When Jousting, they were meant to shatter. You didn't hang onto it usually. Now when they used a spear, they would jab it into the target as they passed. Lances were not 'jabbed' at targets but impaled.
Having it mounted onto your saddle means all that energy is going into the saddle harness, bridle and horse. Not sure how your DM will handle it.
My group has a guy that tried this and I used the above conditions. We used the following:
~ He used his Riding skill as his BAB.
~ He used the Horses Str Bonus
~ Hits to Meaty Critters required a RIding Check of a 10 to make a 'Clean Pass' and extract the weapon to use it again. Failure meant it got ripped out of the Harness. (Long chart I don't have with me for what happened then. From just losing the weapon to ripping off the saddle)
~ Hits to Hard Targets required a Riding Check of a 15 to make a 'Clean Pass'. Failure meant the weapon took damage to shattering, up to ripping off the harness.
~ Critical Hits were handled like normal
~ Critical Misses, we had a chart for the weapon. The worse was the weapon got rammed into rider or mount.
Engineering rolls? My guy needed to make a DC 15 Engineering to make the rig. DC 15 Leatherworking or another skill you like to make the attachment to the saddle harness.
He needed to take Exotic Weapon Prof (Hands Free Lance Harness) to not take a -4 to his Attack.
He only got 1 attack per round with it, regardless of his Attacks Per Round.
Costs? I really don't remember. It was a while ago. That is gonna be up to your DM.
Now, as a side note, he gave up on the rig after 2 or 3 levels because the group didn't spend enough time in the field to make it count. He sold it to the local Gnome Gnuckler Shop to sell. Didn't make him rich, but did make him unique!
Hope some of this helps
Have Fun out there!!
~ W ~