I want to make a rip-off of either Cloud or Sephiroth from FF7... what classes would they be? I mean... Cloud obviously a two handed fighter of some sort... but do I give him magical capacity or? And Sephiroth calls down Meteor... hmm... hard to figure out how to make something that fits best in the rules for them. lol
Magus? :P
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having trouble finding a sword for sephiroth? in the core rulebook, there is this specific magic weapon called the sun sword. it is treated as the more beneficial asppects of a shortsword or bastard sword trait by trait individually. meaning no feat burning for proficiency. a shortsword is a light weapon, this "Shortsword" is normally 4 feet long with a d10 damage dice at no penalty to hit. a large variant is 8 feet long and has 2d8 damage dice and can be held 1handed at a -2 penalty, then there is the huge variation, which can be held 2handed at a -4 penalty. 3d8 damage dice and 16 feet long. and a bastard sword is technically statistically identical to a katana by the rules as written. so this weapon is a 16 foot long katana that can be theoretically wielded by a medium humanoid. i would also personally rule that this option has 15 foot reach as well. simply due to the sword's length.
I don't think ya can hold a large sunsword one handed. If ya got the feat for the bastard sword ya could hold it two handed however.
Well, to be honest, if I made him tiefling and happened to get the oversized arms (I'd flavor it differently) I could wield a large weapon in one hand with no penalty. :)
I'm having a lot of trouble coming up with what I want to do race/class wise more than weapons/armor really.... that's the hard part.
I'm thinking I might try to run him more like when he was in SOLDIER before he went nuts.
I'm not sure. But I'd really like to figure it out so I can run him. :)
I don't think ya can hold a large sunsword one handed. If ya got the feat for the bastard sword ya could hold it two handed however.
a medium sun sword is a light weapon (advantage of the shortsword) even though it's 4 feet long, it only feels like it weighs 2 pounds. and a large light weapon becomes a 1handed weapon, (large shortsword) a huge shortsword is a one handed weapon for a large creature or a 2handed weapon for a medium creature. a sun sword is both a bastard sword and short sword at the same time whenever such would be advantageous. meaning that it's a light martial weapon that deals 1d10 damage, is somehow 4 feet long, somehow weighs 2 pounds, and has the option for 2handing. a large sun sword is a 1handed weapon (because a medium one is a light weapon)
So? its still a large bastard sword, not a large short sword. So it counts as a light weapon ya still could not use it one handed.
So? its still a large bastard sword, not a large short sword. So it counts as a light weapon ya still could not use it one handed.
I think you are missing the point. The sun blade acts as a short sword of it's size category.
A large sized shortsword= medium sized longsword.
I think that's the point that Shuriken is trying to use here.
Basically saying, I could one hand a large sized bastard sword with a sun blade variant.
Nope not missing the point, I disagree with that one is all. It acts as a light weapon, I would not allow it to be used one handed as a large weapon as it is not a one handed weapon.
It is still a "light" bastard sword. that allows ya to use it as if ya had the feat, without having the feat. So it still needs two hands when large, but ya did save a feat.
I suppose that's your interpretation of it. Personally I do view it as a short sword that deals bastard sword damage and looks like a bastard sword. It basically says that in the description.
And in my mind a large sized shortsword is like I said, a medium longsword. So to me it makes sense to 1 hand it.
Or two hand it if it's a huge sized sunblade (Making it a medium sized greatsword as far as ease of use.)
see "looks like a bastard sword" means the size of a bastard sword. If ya make it short sword size I would agree, but as it is not that size I do not.
Straight from the Core Rule book
"This sword is the size of a bastard sword. However, a sun blade is wielded as if it were a short sword with respect to weight and ease of use. In other words, the weapon appears to all viewers to be a bastard sword, and deals bastard sword damage, but the wielder feels and reacts as if the weapon were a short sword. Any individual able to use either a bastard sword or a short sword with proficiency is proficient in the use of a sun blade. Likewise, Weapon Focus and Weapon Specialization in short sword and bastard sword apply equally, but the benefits of those feats do not stack."
I don't know if you have in fact read the wording on this, but the way it's worded it basically says to treat it as a short sword with bastard sword looks/damage.
*Shrug*
I have read it and explained above why I think it still needs two hands for large. Your getting to treat it as light but it still is a bastardsword sized weapon you can use one handed without the bastardsword feat.
Nothing in there say "may count as short sword for size" it spells out clearly the size is of a bastard sword.
"Nothing in there say "may count as short sword for size" it spells out clearly the size is of a bastard sword."
No but it does say counts as a short sword for ease of use.
To each his own I suppose. There will always be different ways of doing things.
ease of use to me is proficiency, you get to use it as a bastard sword without paying for the feat. It clearly to me is still a bastard sword, not a short sword. So for size related items it counts as a bastard sword.
So ya still cold use it, two handed without having the feat. I have heard of folks allowing it the other way a few times and I never have felt that was the correct way to do it. So I do not.
So anyway... now that we're off topic. Any race/class combos I should try to make Sephiroth with. Also, I'm doing 25 point point-buy system. So I have to take that into account.
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ease of use to me is proficiency, you get to use it as a bastard sword without paying for the feat. It clearly to me is still a bastard sword, not a short sword. So for size related items it counts as a bastard sword.
So ya still cold use it, two handed without having the feat. I have heard of folks allowing it the other way a few times and I never have felt that was the correct way to do it. So I do not.
Let me ask you this. Even if you were trained to use a Bastard Sword in one hand, would you say that wielding a Bastard Sword and wielding a Short Sword require the same amount of effort? Do you think it is equally difficult to use either?
if your trained, yes. The effort is different but the same. Unless you mean physical strength, then no, ya would prob need more for the bastardsword.
But the large sunblade would still be counted as a light weapon even if ya still need two hands to use it. It may be lighter, but light means nothing in size. It's still takes as many hands to use as a bastardsword, regardless of what size ya make it.
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if your trained, yes. The effort is different but the same. Unless you mean physical strength, then no, ya would prob need more for the bastardsword.
But the large sunblade would still be counted as a light weapon even if ya still need two hands to use it. It may be lighter, but light means nothing in size. It's still takes as many hands to use as a bastardsword, regardless of what size ya make it.
Then you must have no experience with weapons. Sadly, the rules currently lump things like short swords and daggers into the light weapon designation, and there's a world of difference between ease of use for them as well, but its a necessary abstraction rules-wise.
To me, the Sun Blade's description says "This weapon is the beast of both worlds between the short sword and the bastard sword. Use the most advantageous features of either when using this weapon."
Magus? :P
I'd look at the Adept Godling form Super Genius' Mystic Godling PDF
To me, the Sun Blade's description says "This weapon is the beast of both worlds between the short sword and the bastard sword. Use the most advantageous features of either when using this weapon."
Your welcome to think that, I disagree. Your getting a light finesse able bastard sword without having to pay the feat cost. Which is pretty nice anyhow. But in the end it is still a bastard sword. Sure it's lighter and a bit easier to use but still unweildy as any other weapon it's size.
It was a bigger deal back in 2e where ya had more limited weapons ya knew how to you, but as it stands all the "acts as short sword" does is allows you to use it as if ya had the feat, without having the feat.
Again, who cares about the sword, any help on my build possibilites? =/
Again, who cares about the sword, any help on my build possibilites? =/
the reason i suggested the sword was because of the idea of a request of a cloud/sephiroth rippoff. sephiroth wields what amounts to a 16 foot long katana. (counting the blade alone) and sephiroth would have be built around such a weapon to make a proper ripoff.
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Honestly, just give Cloud a Greatsword and send him down the Two Handed Fighter Archetype.
If you don't want to deal with the Sun Blade, just give Sephy a Bastard Sword and the Weapon Master Fighter Archetype.
I think Human with the Advanced simple template does pretty well for the Mako exposure they both went through.
Really, ripping off Cloud/Sephiroth is more about nailing the personality than having the exact equipment.
I would make them half-celestial (Cloud)/half-fiend (Sephiroth) human sorcerer/fighter eldritch knights who wield highly stylized greatswords.
They would make extensive use of materia (which I would treat simply as reflavored scrolls).
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I would make them half-celestial (Cloud)/half-fiend (Sephiroth) human sorcerer/fighter eldritch knights who wield highly stylized greatswords.
They would make extensive use of materia (which I would treat simply as reflavored scrolls).
I think Half-Celestial/Half-Fiend is going a little too far. There isn't anything overtly Celestial or Fiendish about either of them. I do agree that they would both make great Eldritch Knights, though.
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I wouldn't say half-Celestial at least, but there's enough of an element there to qualify the one winged 'angel' as fiendish, IMO.
Personally I see Cloud as a Warblade, though for either of them it's hard to encompass their strength in a level one character, even with gestalt.
if I were to stat out my boy Cloud as best I could, I'd say...
firstly, focus on strength, natch. Low charisma (idealless, hard to know)
Points spent in Athletics, Climb and other generally physical skills
definitely some sort of advanced template, to represent his extra abilities, perhaps like a sensitivity to magic.
X levels of Warblade//X levels of Fighter, feat focus in pure melee Fullblade work, with PA, Cleave, Lunge
Really most of this is just so common knowledge, it's almost self explanitory.
now, my boy Sephiroth, i see as a zealot, dedicated to a greater purpose, even it if is himself. To me that screams Crusader//Cleric, or possibly Crusader//Magus.
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There is a 3rd party D20 book for D&D that has detailed rules for anime-esque games and characters. Including the overly large should be impossible to wield weapons. I don't remember what it was called since I glanced at it when a friend showed it to me and I laughed really, really hard because I find that stuff redonkulous.
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There is a 3rd party D20 book for D&D that has detailed rules for anime-esque games and characters. Including the overly large should be impossible to wield weapons. I don't remember what it was called since I glanced at it when a friend showed it to me and I laughed really, really hard because I find that stuff redonkulous.
BESM* d20, perhaps? There ARE a lot of ridiculous things in there, but its based off of anime. Have you ever seen a non-ridiculous anime?
*Big Eyes, Small Mouth was an anime roleplaying game published by Guardians of Order and using the Tri-Stat system. Fun as hell, especially if you're an anime geek like me and my friends.
A Free-hand Fighter (Advanced Player’s Handbook, Paizo) seems like a good start it gives bonuses that only work when using one weapon in which Sephiroth is legendary for; by the way if you take the Exotic Weapon Proficiency for it you can use a Large Sawtooth Saber as a one-handed weapon (normally it would be a light-weapon). Likewise there’s a feat in Dragon Compendium called One-sword Style that grants a bonus to AC when using one weapon, and following the Weapon Supremacy Tree (requires Players Handbook II, WotC) gives a good deal of combat power.
Your stats should be all-round high (15 is acceptable and possible), and you should be somewhere in the alignment (depending on which point of his life your basing it out of) somewhere between Lawful Good to Lawful Evil as he’s very strict and, admittedly, predictable in what he does.
My two cents.
Cloud : A fighter using a Greatsword for Large creature (3d6 + Str bonus x 1.5) with the help of the Monkey Grip feat.
Sephirot : A fighter using a nodachi (the japanese version of the greatsword). I think that the elven curved blade would work pretty well for that (only 1d10, but compatible with weapon finess).
Done ! :P