Hi all,
I apologize if any of this has been discussed before but my forum-fu is weak. I have a couple of specific questions about playing RotRL with the Pathfinder rules. First some background:
We started the AP using the 3.5 rules and rolled stats (4d6, drop lowest). Some of the PCs ended up with crazy-high stats and I adjusted a couple of the weaklings upward toward the range of the tougher ones, just so things weren't too off kilter (I know, play 'em as they lay, but I was feeling sorry for them.) Switched to Pathfinder rules around the beginning of Skinsaw Murders.
We've had between five and seven PCs for the first few books and just finished up Hook Mountain a while back (on a break now). With their high stats they've been pretty well breezing through the encounters, which I have not really been beefing up too much. BUT, because there is a larger party than expected, the PCs are behind in XP going into Fortress (8th and the adventure calls for 10th, IIRC.) Some of the assumptions about what the party has at hand are, accordingly, a little off-base because of this.
When we get back to it I'd like to offer the players a deal: rebuild your character (or create a new one) using point buy but starting at 10th level with level-appropriate wealth (they're actually quite a lot behind that curve as well). I want to allow anything from the core book as well as the new APG.
The main question, for those that have played using the new rules from the beginning, is what's the best point buy value for me to offer? I'd like to go with 20 points but wonder if that's good enough?
The secondary question, is are there any problems with the wealth-by-level guidelines in the core book? Is it enough? Is it too little?
Anything else I should be thinking of?
Appreciate any advice you guys might have!
M
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From how you describe your party (Pathfinder classes, high stats, 6+ characters) I would say their CR is current level+2-3, which is probably why they have been breezing through everything. I would suggest finding the RotRL for 6 players thread and getting Joey to send you his updated notes for 6 Pathfinder players, that should cut down on 2 of the additional CR points.
Even if you have then re-do their characters with say a point buy, they are still Pathfinder class versions (more powerful than 3.5) and a large party, so you will have to adjust the encounters one way or the other.
Alternative method of increasing the challenge:
As you noted, eventually your characters will fall behind the suggested level of the adventures due to experience division among a larger party. If you are not going to adjust the encounters for a larger group, I suggest letting this happen, so that eventually they will be the correct CR for the encounters they meet, though that is likely to not happen until late AP3 and into AP4. Personally, I would choose this option, because its less work and argument with your players and it happens naturally. However, if they walked over hard encounters like the Clock Tower or Ft Rannick, then I would let their levels lag PLUS I would up the CR of the encounters.
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Joey's guide was a huge help for me, as I have 10 players in my game, so drastic overhaul of encounter structure is necessary to even challenge my group. Here is a list of things I have used to enhance the encounters without a ton of extra work:
1. add in swarms to annoy the party while they are fighting a more straightforward encounter
2. double the HPs of monsters
3. add the advanced template to monsters
4. add a couple class levels (or additional class levels as the case may be) to the main BBEGs.
5. double the number of encountered creatures for straight up animal, mook, or hack and slash type encounters.
Obviously you don't want to apply all of these to any one encounter, but using a combination of them helped me quickly upgrade the AP.
A 20 point buy is fine, though personally I wouldn't go any higher. We used a 15 point buy and my group is doing fine. Remember there are more than 4 players in your group so they can get by with lower stats. That being said, if you culture shock them with too low a point buy after they have extremely high stats currently (depends on how high they are now), you may get player unrest! :)
20 points should be fine. Bear in mind, 20 points goes further in Pathfinder, which uses a different point system than 3.5.
If you have a large party, you may consider going 15 point but, but it won't make much of a difference beyond limiting the kinds of characters who are viable. Multiple-attribute Dependent characters (Monks, Bards, etc) will have a harder time, but you're also starting at 10th level so they could start with gear to help them out.
25, I'd say, is too much, especially with a larger party.
Thanks guys. Very helpful.
M