How important is reflex? (4th edition)

[Jam412]

So I just made my first 4th edition character and he's only got a 10 as his reflex save. I'm a little concerned, but I don't really know the system that well to know if it's that big of a deal. So am I about to get my lunch eaten?

Here is the character:

Spoiler:

Jak, level 1
Minotaur, Warden
Build: Earth Warden
Guardian Might: Earthstrength

FINAL ABILITY SCORES
Str 20, Con 15, Dex 10, Int 10, Wis 13, Cha 8.

STARTING ABILITY SCORES
Str 18, Con 13, Dex 10, Int 10, Wis 13, Cha 8.

AC: 15 Fort: 16 Reflex: 10 Will: 12
HP: 32 Surges: 12 Surge Value: 8

TRAINED SKILLS
Nature +8, Dungeoneering +6, Endurance +6, Intimidate +4

UNTRAINED SKILLS
Acrobatics -1, Arcana, Bluff -1, Diplomacy -1, Heal +1, History, Insight +1, Perception +3, Religion, Stealth -1, Streetwise -1, Thievery -1, Athletics +4

FEATS
Level 1: Sudden Roots

POWERS
Warden at-will 1: Strength of Stone
Warden at-will 1: Thorn Strike
Warden encounter 1: Roots of Stone
Warden daily 1: Form of the Fearsome Ram

ITEMS
Heavy flail, Hide Armor, Adventurer's Kit, Crowbar

[Celestial Healer]

At 1st level, I wouldn't sweat it too much. You could conceivably take a point off of Strength or a point each of Con and Wis in order to bump your Dex up to 12 to get your Reflex and AC 1 higher. Every point helps, but it's not likely to be make-or-break for you. At some point later in heroic tier, you might want to pick up the Lightning Reflexes feat (I'm pretty sure that's what it's called, unless my brain is stuck in 3.5 holdover mode) or otherwise find a way to shore up your character's weak spot.

[Uchawi]

A large shield will help, +2 AC, +2 Reflex, if I remember correctly.

[Jam412]

That's pretty reassuring, thanks CH. I didn't want to stumble into a situation like having a horrible will save in mid to upper levels of 3.5.

[Amelia]

It's not a save, it's a defense. It's like AC, except against different sorts of attacks. Will a low ref (or fort or will) NAD hurt you? Possibly, it depends on what you run into. The weak spot on my own Warden is her Reflex, so when she runs into creatures that target it, she takes a lot of damage. I'd agree that droppint STR to 19, or even 18, to bolster Dex might not be bad. Not just for Reflex, but for Initiative. Like Celestial Healer, said, though, it's not a game breaker.

[Whimsy Chris]

You may want to increase your Con and lower your Wisdom. As an Earth warden, Con is more important than Wisdom. Increasing your Con will help with your AC. You'll also want the Heavy Shield as Uchawi suggests. All that together could get your AC to 18 and your Ref to 12. For 1st level, that's not bad.

[Matthew Koelbl]

One thing to keep in mind: Say that half the time enemies attack AC, half the time they attack a Non-AC Defense. And of the times when they attack a Non-AC Defense, one-third of the time they will be targeting Reflex.*

So, you are especially vulnerable to 1 in 6 attacks. Is this a concern?

You can live with it, generally. The biggest downside is that Reflex attacks often come with nasty conditions, like ongoing damage or immobilize or so forth.

But you are a Warden - you get a free save at the start of your turn. That goes a LONG way towards mitigating conditions.

So overall, I'd say you are safe. You might pick some boosts up elsewhere, but honestly - if you like your big tough guy with tons of hitpoints, free saving throws, and a giant flail to smack the enemies with, I suspect he'll do just fine in actual play.

*I have no idea if this numbers actually turn out this way. I suspect Reflex gets targeted a bit more than its fair share. Still, AC is the prime target the vast majority of the time.

[Jeremy Mac Donald]

I think Mathew is basically correct. Reflex probably gets hit more then will but its just not so consistently common as to be worth worrying about. Especially considering that it does not look like you can do much about the situation anyway. A reflex of 12 is still the pits - they can hardly miss if they try. Hence enemies using reflex based attacks are going to hit you - not ideal but c'est la vie.

[Raevhen]

"The reflex is a lonely child just waiting by the park"

[Amael]

Based on what I've seen from Wardens, your saves (except Fort) will probably never be much, but the Warden doesn't seem to be about high AC/Ref/Fort/Will defenses. The free save at the beginning of your turn will be HUGE for you and a bain for the DM, as status effects that can tie up most other defenders will be gone without having affected you. I wouldn't worry about boosting your defenses, but try running with your strengths and find things to boost your saves and durability, damage mitigation, and marks. From my experiences of 4e, you can make any character effective, you just have to alter your train of thought/tactics on how you use the character.