I'm running 4E so I'm wanting to run my Rise of the Runelords campaign up to 30th-level. However, that has no effect on this thread: this is talking about how to expand RotR to include all the other Runelords and to take the campaign into Epic levels without reference to the edition being played.
What I'm thinking is that Xin's disappearance as mentioned in Pathfinder 1 is sufficiently mysterious as to warrant as an adventure hook. This is what is says:
After ruling 110 years, Xin’s magic consumed him in a conflagration of scarlet fl ames that destroyed much of the imperial palace, and left no remains of the First King.
Careless of their emperor’s mysterious end, the runelords seized their domains for themselves, subjugating Xin’s most powerful generals and viziers and leaving his eldest son a puppet emperor in the city of Xin—a small mountain prison where he could be controlled.
What if the subsequent rise of the other Runelords was actually engineered by the First King?
What if, and I recognise it for the blatant [i]Lord of the Rings[/] rip-off that it is, Xin was working on, for lack of a better term, a Master Rune to control all other aspects of Rune Magic?
What locations and events would you add to the existing RotR campaign to include this expansion of the storyline which would then conclude with a battle against the resurrected First King who may be a lich or a golem or something more mysterious?
Are there are any other threads that I have missed throwing these sorts of ideas around?
Another intriguing reference in the AP is the reference to Lissala the goddess of Runes, now dead. From my POV if I was to consider running a sequel to RotRL (with the same characters ie (3.5) 16th+) it would revolve around the idea of this deity potentially returning to life.
In addition you have to admit when you read about the Runelords and how they pretty much all decided to take precasutions to 'retreat from the world to avoid the coming cataclysym but to return shortly afterwards' and so took certain precautions to ensure their survival, each one a different style, it is pretty improbable that they ALL stuffed it up and havent come back in over 10,000 years. I mean sure 1 or 2 out of 7 archmages making a big error like this is fine, but all 7? really? To me that smacks of someone going round and putting a deliberate spanner in each of their works-- the question is who, why and what happened to them?
oh and where is this city of Xin? A mountain prison eh?
just food for thought.
Another intriguing reference in the AP is the reference to Lissala the goddess of Runes, now dead. From my POV if I was to consider running a sequel to RotRL (with the same characters ie (3.5) 16th+) it would revolve around the idea of this deity potentially returning to life. (snip)
I was thinking along the same lines. Perhaps Xin was her construct and the concept of the Runelords was her idea as part of her plan to become the supreme deity of Golarion. (I'm thinking of what Vecna was doing in a couple of 2E adventures for inspiration.)
What about this:
Lissala, the goddess of Runes, needs the Runelords as primal initiators of some supreme Magic which will wake her from some kind of deity slumber, interpretet as Death by mortals, and therefore has manipulated the events foreshadowing RotR secretely to further her return and ascendance to some even more powerfull state?
And Xin, back then in old times, realized that Lissala´s groth of Power would be quite bad for the world, so decided to uprise against her, which in turn forced her to get rid of him and further install the Runelords as more willing proxys to her end?
But Xin is not quite dead, just...maybe on another Plane, in an otherwordly prison or somesuch, and could be the PC´c most important Ally in the Endgame?
His eldest Son in turn is a Masterpuppet of Lisala, who has left the Runelords back then in the believe they would controll him, but in truth he was the one controlling them for Lissala. He could star as major Villain and servant of Lissala, after the Runelords have been beaten.
There are also possibilities for major intrigues when the Runelords discover, that they are only Pawns and reviving Lissala will lead to their doom.
Just some Ideas out of the Head.
Just a thought, as I'm intrigued by this....Isn't divination the only school not applied to the runelords? What if secretly (only Xin knew) that the entire sehedron rune was actually the divination rune the ultimate sin being knowledge, fed by the other 7 and being the most powerful, but for it to achieve it's true power the other 7 needed to somehow fuel it with their sins. As such Xin basically faked his own death with the foreknowledge of the coming events and set the motions for the runelords to infight and then he died only to be brought back at the right time. Essentially harvesting their power, maybe to bring back the goddess, who knew she would perish. And once she is back she is going to put a hurt on the world. Maybe the pcs whipping the first runelord is part of the plan, and Xin actually woke first and is why the others are not yet awoken properly as he has been making things ready and he basically is pulling the strings of the pcs pointing them in the direction of the runelords through other npcs.... somehow basically trace it back to the reason each of them came to sandpoint in the first place and have him be behind it. I mean theres nothing scarier than an ultimate baddie who knows the future and destiny and all that...
In adapting RotRL to my homebrew setting of Volkheim, I ended up expanding on the idea of the Runelords, establishing that three were unequivocally dead, three were awaiting their eventual return, and one was alive and active.
Karzoug of course was waiting for his runewell scheme to pay off. Alaznist (Wrath) died at Karzoug's hands before the empire fell. Krune (Sloth), ironically did not finish his plan in time to save himself, and Belmarius was the victim of her own envious apprentices who sabotaged her attempt.
Xanderghul (Pride) never went into hibernation. Since his method of life-extension involved him cloning himself, he has simply been alive all this time, manipulating events and societies around the world for 10,000 years, usually in the guise of new identities. If this seems odd for the epitome of Pride to hide his identity, remember that Xanderghul is a master of illusions and deception, and that the method of cloning practiced by Vraxeris did result in some mental instability. You could simply pick any high profile ruler (perhaps Razmir!)and have them turn out to be Xanderghul's latest guise.
Sorshen (Lust), has repeatedly tried to awaken, but has been foiled by a secretive brotherhood who guard over her tomb (the location of which is mentioned in Curse of the Crimson Throne.)
Zutha (Gluttony) has been denied his resurrection because the pieces of his grimoire/phylactery fell into unfriendly hands. Really, this resurrection method is the easiest to foil, since anyone with a high will save and half a reason to want him dead could just keep part of the book away from the other two pieces.
As for Xin...in my setting his soul was claimed by the Elder God of Evil, and was remade into Asmodeus. Of course, this doesn't really work in Golarion's timeline, but it was a neat way of tying the Runelords into my existing world, and continuing the storyline beyond level 16.
Fantastic!
There are some great ideas here: thanks for posting.
Penser: great ideas about Lissala.
Stewart: I must admit I was also thinking of Xin as the master of divination but I like the direction your ideas are going in better.
Robert: your campaign sounds very interesting. I particularly like your revised history for Xanderghul.
Twowlves: yeah, it ties in nicely with Penser's idea of Lissala as the main villain.
Thanks, Coridan. I'm really looking forward to reading your posts.
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Thanks, Coridan. I'm really looking forward to reading your posts.
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