Second Rate Species?


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The Exchange

smart guys vanish

Any thoughts on why we dont like to talk about the Human Species that was smarter than our own? Is there a surpression of Truth because our religious philosophies have told us we are number one? I realize now that being one of the few people with a 214 IQ probably doesnt rate highly against the other Human with a Brain fifty percent larger than mine.


yellowdingo wrote:

smart guys vanish

Any thoughts on why we dont like to talk about the Human Species that was smarter than our own? Is there a surpression of Truth because our religious philosophies have told us we are number one? I realize now that being one of the few people with a 214 IQ probably doesnt rate highly against the other Human with a Brain fifty percent larger than mine.

There are some people who can't resist taking a dig at religion at any opportunity, aren't there? You atheists are absolutely obsessed with religion. I suppose it's because you can only define your own beliefs as a negative, since the only things you 'believe' in are you own genitals, money, and nothingness. I mean, I don't start every damn thread I write with "the atheists must support this because they believe in infanticide and nihilism," do I? Give it a freaking rest for once.

Watch, now my post will be 'redacted,' because religion isn't politically correct, even though you attacked first. But I'm sick of the fact that you atheists feel you can turn EVERY topic into a bash-fest of religion, while if religious people DARE to say anything, it's a sign of bias, unreasonable behavior, stirring up trouble, whatever. Honestly, ditch the obsession.

Now you're basically saying that Darwinian evolution is some kind "omGzz Reeligious plot!!!1eleventy!!"

And as for this fruitcake theory that the fragments of one skull from Africa, which was apparently last described in 1913, constitute proof positive of a more intelligent variety of human 10,000 years ago, I'll believe it when I see more proof. Have you seen how they were reconstructing dinosaurs in 1913??? Until I see more evidence, I'm placing it in the category of "the same as the idea that the Earth's axis tilted over recently and Chicago is now sitting on the equator, but the government is hiding it so nobody noticed."

And if they're there -- so what? Very interesting. I'd be interested to find out why they went extinct myself. However, given the many possibilities -- including that these few fragments were inaccurately measured way back then (gee, imagine that), or that they didn't simply come from an individual with some unfortunate pathological problem with the skull -- I'm not going to get very excited about some super-race without more proof.

By the way, nice detail on claiming IQ over 214. Establishing some unverifiable personal authority to be taken seriously, eh? :)

Dark Archive Owner - Johnny Scott Comics and Games

Carnivorous_Bean wrote:
yellowdingo wrote:

smart guys vanish

Any thoughts on why we dont like to talk about the Human Species that was smarter than our own? Is there a surpression of Truth because our religious philosophies have told us we are number one? I realize now that being one of the few people with a 214 IQ probably doesnt rate highly against the other Human with a Brain fifty percent larger than mine.

There are some people who can't resist taking a dig at religion at any opportunity, aren't there? You atheists are absolutely obsessed with religion. I suppose it's because you can only define your own beliefs as a negative, since the only things you 'believe' in are you own genitals, money, and nothingness. I mean, I don't start every damn thread I write with "the atheists must support this because they believe in infanticide and nihilism," do I? Give it a freaking rest for once.

Watch, now my post will be 'redacted,' because religion isn't politically correct, even though you attacked first. But I'm sick of the fact that you atheists feel you can turn EVERY topic into a bash-fest of religion, while if religious people DARE to say anything, it's a sign of bias, unreasonable behavior, stirring up trouble, whatever. Honestly, ditch the obsession.

Now you're basically saying that Darwinian evolution is some kind "omGzz Reeligious plot!!!1eleventy!!"

And as for this fruitcake theory that the fragments of one skull from Africa, which was apparently last described in 1913, constitute proof positive of a more intelligent variety of human 10,000 years ago, I'll believe it when I see more proof. Have you seen how they were reconstructing dinosaurs in 1913??? Until I see more evidence, I'm placing it in the category of "the same as the idea that the Earth's axis tilted over recently and Chicago is now sitting on the equator, but the government is hiding it so nobody noticed."

And if they're there -- so what? Very...

If you can disregard the religious inference from the OP, I think you'll find it is an interesting article.

Make sure you click the link to the original article from Discover magazine at the end of the OP's link. There is a lot more to the story than some bone fragments.

Check it out. It's an interesting read...


Brain size doesn't necessarily correlate directly to intelligence. It has more to do with connections between neurons than with sheer mass.

Liberty's Edge

Carnivorous_Bean wrote:
...lotta words...

Feeling grumpy today...?


Andrew Turner wrote:
Carnivorous_Bean wrote:
...lotta words...
Feeling grumpy today...?

Naw, Bean's right. I have a fair number of religious friends and a fair number of staunchly atheist friends (not to mention the agnostics, freethinkers, skeptics, Brights...) and am myself somewhere in the middle. I find myself arguing the goods of nontheism to the theists, and arguing the goods of theism to the nontheists. People on both sides can be very unreasonable sometimes.

EDIT: Course, he makes some broad generalizations about "you atheists," but that's because the atheists that are more reasonable don't talk about it as often, so people don't notice as much.

... Hey! kind of like religious folk...


Did graduate work in evolutionary anthropology. It is no secret that certain extinct hominins had brains larger than ours. It is widely known, for example (anyone with a Paleoanthropology 101 education would know), that Neandertals' brains were larger than those of Homo sapiens (sapiens). Anthropocentrism is alive and well (among unbelievers and religionists), but there is no anthropocentric conspiracy of any kind (at least, any effective anthropocentric conspiracy) to suppress the fact that our species is not the biggest-brained hominin in the history of this planet.


Carnivorous_Bean wrote:
There are some people who can't resist taking a dig at religion at any opportunity, aren't there? You atheists are absolutely obsessed with religion. I suppose it's because you can only define your own beliefs as a negative, since the only things you 'believe' in are you own genitals, money, and nothingness. I mean, I don't start every damn thread I write with "the atheists must support this because they believe in infanticide and nihilism," do I? Give it a freaking rest for once.

CB, it's time to monitor your pulse and caffeine intake. :D But honestly, given I'm one of those "you athiests", I am kind of taken back at your response. Not all of us are the same in the sense that not all Christians are cut from the same cloth.

I personally don't have a problem with religion. I only have a problem with those that cram it down others throats but can't remove the mote out of their own eye as to their narrowmindedness and/or ignorance regarding their own origins.

Quid pro quo. :D


Tim4488 wrote:
Brain size doesn't necessarily correlate directly to intelligence. It has more to do with connections between neurons than with sheer mass.

Kind of like phallic size and its mastery of usage? :P


Urizen wrote:
Tim4488 wrote:
Brain size doesn't necessarily correlate directly to intelligence. It has more to do with connections between neurons than with sheer mass.
Kind of like phallic size and its mastery of usage? :P

You win this round, sir.


yellowdingo wrote:
I realize now that being one of the few people with a 214 IQ probably doesnt rate highly against the other Human with a Brain fifty percent larger than mine.

You do realize you're speaking in glowing terms of a species that no longer exists, yes?

Bigger brain, smaller brain, I'm the one living long and prospering.

The Exchange

yellowdingo wrote:

smart guys vanish

Any thoughts on why we dont like to talk about the Human Species that was smarter than our own? Is there a surpression of Truth because our religious philosophies have told us we are number one? I realize now that being one of the few people with a 214 IQ probably doesnt rate highly against the other Human with a Brain fifty percent larger than mine.

Thank you for the link. Please in the future consider how you approach your opening statements. Also, please remember the old adage "It is not the size that matters, it is how you use it"

Liberty's Edge

I still don't see how YD's question is offensive, or why it would incite. Objectively, I think any religious-based rant flowing from the original post must be stemming from some other combination of perceived slight, and this, at best, might count as the proverbial straw. Most major religious philosophies do promote Man as the highest form on the planet. Being an RC, I think I can suitably say this is Rome's position.


Tim4488 wrote:
Brain size doesn't necessarily correlate directly to intelligence. It has more to do with connections between neurons than with sheer mass.

Correct. Even among H. sapiens there's a very large standard deviation in brain volume, and no statistically-significant correlation between volume and IQ.

Paizo Employee Chief Technical Officer

Linked article wrote:
...found that this human-like skull was capable of protecting a brain 25 percent larger than our own.

Human + 25% = "Human-Like Skull"

Linked article wrote:
Now just think, our brains are said to be 25 percent larger than those of the now defunct Homo erectus.

Homo erectus + 25% = Human

Linked article wrote:
If we were able to accomplish so much with a brain 25 percent larger than a Homo erectus, what could a brain 50 percent larger do?"

(Homo erectus + 25%) + 25% = Homo erectus + 50% ?

Somebody needs a bigger brain.

The Exchange

Kirth Gersen wrote:
Tim4488 wrote:
Brain size doesn't necessarily correlate directly to intelligence. It has more to do with connections between neurons than with sheer mass.
Correct. Even among H. sapiens there's a very large standard deviation in brain volume, and no statistically-significant correlation between volume and IQ.

Its OK to feel inadequate...I'm a god and I feel inadequate for the task.


Vic Wertz wrote:
math stuff

School 'em, Vic!


yellowdingo wrote:
Kirth Gersen wrote:
Tim4488 wrote:
Brain size doesn't necessarily correlate directly to intelligence. It has more to do with connections between neurons than with sheer mass.
Correct. Even among H. sapiens there's a very large standard deviation in brain volume, and no statistically-significant correlation between volume and IQ.
Its OK to feel inadequate...I'm a god and I feel inadequate for the task.

I'm not even sure what you're going for anymore.

Wolfthulhu wrote:
Vic Wertz wrote:
math stuff
School 'em, Vic!

Haha. Win.


Tim4488 wrote:
yellowdingo wrote:
Kirth Gersen wrote:
Tim4488 wrote:
Brain size doesn't necessarily correlate directly to intelligence. It has more to do with connections between neurons than with sheer mass.
Correct. Even among H. sapiens there's a very large standard deviation in brain volume, and no statistically-significant correlation between volume and IQ.
Its OK to feel inadequate...I'm a god and I feel inadequate for the task.
I'm not even sure what you're going for anymore.

It's yellow, none of us do.


Dingo, if his self-reported IQ is vaguely accurate, falls squarely into the idiot-savant category. We love him for who he is.

The Exchange

Kirth Gersen wrote:
Dingo, if his self-reported IQ is vaguely accurate, falls squarely into the idiot-savant category. We love him for who he is.

Maybe I missed the Savant part ;)

Liberty's Edge

that's a big head.

The Exchange

I know there is a reason but ...how do we knwo this isn't just some guy who had a form a giantism? I am sure there is a reason but I coudl not find one.


Evidently they found a bunch of them. The article linked here is still pretty bad (leaping to the oft-untrue "larger brain = smarter" conclusion -- which would imply that elephants are five times smarter than humans), but it's slightly better than the one with the Outer Limits still that Dingo linked.

Liberty's Edge

I don't think we can discount a possible extratesticular influence here.....


THIS seems to be a much better article than either of the above.

And THIS ONE, by a paleoanthropologist, is by far my favorite. It's also not far from what you were suggesting, CJ -- a group of primitive people (although not "a guy") with thick skulls, otherwise similar to the later Khoikhoi and San peoples in the same region.

Liberty's Edge

I think nephilim is a more interesting interpretation myself.
All of kirth's stuff sounds so "truelike" and dross.

Liberty's Edge

Quit being so sciencey. Its okay on teh interwebz to be pseudosciency.

Silver Crusade

Maybe they were just the Old Ones.


Heathansson wrote:
Quit being so sciencey.

What did you expect -- I'm a scientist! I might just as well tell you to quit being so werewolf-y. Or tell Fake Healer to stop being Fakey. Wait... that didn't come out right.

The Exchange

Kirth Gersen wrote:
Heathansson wrote:
Quit being so sciencey.
What did you expect -- I'm a scientist! I might just as well tell you to quit being so werewolf-y. Or tell Fake Healer to stop being Fakey. Wait... that didn't come out right.

You are a geologist correct?


Crimson Jester wrote:
You are a geologist correct?

That's my day job. By night I'm a Pathfinder super-villain, the infamous "Houserule-Man."

The Exchange

Kirth Gersen wrote:
Crimson Jester wrote:
You are a geologist correct?
That's my day job. By night I'm a Pathfinder super-villain, the infamous "Houserule-Man."

Ain't that the truth!

Anyhow, how has your games changed due to knowledge of geology?
I know that after going caving with my kids with scouts, most caves are fairly hard to enter let alone go through.


yellowdingo wrote:
smart guys vanish
Carnivorous_Bean wrote:
...

That was rich. He roped you CB.

Also, I don't think dingo typifies atheists.


Regarding this Boskop man thing. Smells fishy to me. I call BS. You been had, dingo. 214 IQ. LOL. And I'm Bill Gates.


Darn it I didn't look at where the thread was first and thought this was another thread about Kobolds and Goblins.

The Exchange

Abraham spalding wrote:
Darn it I didn't look at where the thread was first and thought this was another thread about Kobolds and Goblins.

It is about the same....LOL

Liberty's Edge

Abraham spalding wrote:
Darn it I didn't look at where the thread was first and thought this was another thread about Kobolds and Goblins.

Naaah, just alien extra testicle halfbreeds from the stonage mans. Damn.


Kruelaid wrote:
Regarding this Boskop man thing. Smells fishy to me. I call BS. You been had, dingo. 214 IQ. LOL. And I'm Bill Gates.

Dude, you recycled my link.

Liberty's Edge

No he didn't.


Kirth Gersen wrote:
Dude, you recycled my link.

Cool. Can't see yours. I found it without you. Great link BTW.

I can't believe someone wrote a book about this. Then again... I can.


Crimson Jester wrote:
Anyhow, how has your games changed due to knowledge of geology?

This is going to sound really pathetic, but I actually drew tectonic maps of the homebrew world, then figured out global wind patterns, and redrew the maps so that all of the mountains would be correctly located, the rivers would flow realistically, and things like wind-shadow deserts would be located in the right places. Anywhere I had limestone caves, I redrew the map to reflect karsting, and made the surface water features reflect that.

The thing is, one of the other players was a fellow geologist. No one else would notice, but then I'd see him peering at the maps intently, and then he'd exclaim, "Nice! These mountains here must be andesitic!"


Found it. GOt lost in the spam.

The Exchange

Kirth Gersen wrote:
Kruelaid wrote:
Regarding this Boskop man thing. Smells fishy to me. I call BS. You been had, dingo. 214 IQ. LOL. And I'm Bill Gates.
Dude, you recycled my link.

Black Holes expand forward and Backward through time from point of origin.

Damn right 214 IQ. If I'm the only one who can solve that, you are in a lot of poop.


I don't appreciate being lumped together with all atheists, Carnivorous Bean.

I also don't believe that IQ is a good measure of anything other than the ability to take IQ tests, nor do I believe in a 1-1 correlation between brain size and intelligence.


Heathansson wrote:
No he didn't.

His link

My last link
Those are copied using the "reply" function: no cheating. I might lie about minor things, like my tax return, but never about something so momentous as a link in the off-topic threads.

Liberty's Edge

Kirth Gersen wrote:
Crimson Jester wrote:
Anyhow, how has your games changed due to knowledge of geology?

This is going to sound really pathetic, but I actually drew tectonic maps of the homebrew world, then figured out global wind patterns, and redrew the maps so that all of the mountains would be correctly located, the rivers would flow realistically, and things like wind-shadow deserts would be located in the right places. Anywhere I had limestone caves, I redrew the map to reflect karsting, and made the surface water features reflect that.

The thing is, one of the other players was a fellow geologist. No one else would notice, but then I'd see him peering at the maps intently, and then he'd exclaim, "Nice! These mountains here must be andesitic!"

Yeah; too sciency.

(J/K that's cool).

Liberty's Edge

Kirth Gersen wrote:
Heathansson wrote:
No he didn't.
[url=http://johnhawks.net/weblog/reviews/brain/paleo/lynch-granger-big-brain-boskops-2008.html]His link
[url=http://johnhawks.net/weblog/reviews/brain/paleo/lynch-granger-big-brain-boskops-2008.html]My last linkThose are copied using the "reply" function: no cheating.

He discovered it on his own, like Columbus discovered america after the vikings, chinese, and egyptians did.

See, he didn't read your post cos it was all sciency.


Kirth Gersen wrote:
This is going to sound really pathetic....

The first thing that comes to my mind: does Kirth live in his Mom's basement?

Liberty's Edge

Kruelaid wrote:
Kirth Gersen wrote:
This is going to sound really pathetic....
The first thing that comes to my mind: does Kirth live in his Mom's basement?

I thought everybody here did.

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