Would unlimited draconic claws as a feat be balanced?

[Sort_vampyr]

That's pretty much my question. Would unlimited draconic claws, for the sorcerer that would trade a feat for it, be balanced or not? Some of you guys out there are a lot more into the rules and numbers than me and i would like your opinion :)

If yes/no then why?

An Alternative/more balanced way to give a sorcerer unlimited rounds draconic claws if you could make one up yourself?

[Nero24200]

I don't see why not. I once used a sorcerer with the Draconic Claw feat from Races of the Dragon. It's claws, and as a bonus you get a free attack as a swift action whenever you cast against foe. Despite the additional bonus the feat was, if anything, sub-par in power, so asking for a permanent claw in exhange for a feat is hardly underpowering, especially for a primary caster class like the sorcerer.

[Quandary]

You shouldn't need to spend a Feat.

IMHO, Once you gain the "elemental" bonus damage,
the base claws (/bite) should become "unlimited",
and just the additional elemental damage has a use limit (3+CHA).

Otherwise, the investment in Enhancements (Amulet of Mighty Fists) AND Feats to keep up with the level-appropriate power level becomes not worth it: get the same enhancements and Feats (WpnFocus, Imp Crit, etc) for a manufactured weapon (even spiked gauntlets) and use them every combat, or throw that investment out the window once your 3+CHA Bonus Rounds are used up?

[mdt]

While the claws probably aren't powerful enough to require a feat, I think it should be a feat, and I don't think it would be too overpowered. There's precedent, the enhanced breath weapons feats from the Races of the Dragon that let half-dragons use their breathweapons continuously like full dragons.

I think it should be, however, a generic feat to sorcerers, not just draconics. Basically, let the first level power be unlimited uses, and set the minimum level as 5 say.

[Set]

mdt wrote:

I think it should be, however, a generic feat to sorcerers, not just draconics. Basically, let the first level power be unlimited uses, and set the minimum level as 5 say.

What he said. Many of those 1st level Sorcerer abilities (and perhaps the 1st level X/day Clerical Domain powers and Wizardly School abilities) should become usable at will eventually, and having a Feat to develop that seems like an ideal choice.

Blood Adept
You have further explored your heritage, overcoming your intial hesitation to embrace its gifts.
Benefit: You can use any one of the following Bloodline Powers an unlimited number of times per day; Acidic Ray (Aberrant), Claws (Abyssal or Draconic), Heavenly Fire (Celestial), Elemental Ray (Elemental), Laughing Touch (Fey), Corrupting Touch (Infernal) or Grave Touch (Undead).
Special: A Sorcerer of the Arcane Bloodline cannot benefit from this Feat. A Sorcerer with a Destined Bloodline can benefit from this Feat, but the nature of the Touch of Destiny is changed so that no single individual can benefit from it more than once in an hour.
Prerequisites: Sorcerer level 5.

A followup feat called Blood Mastery could either allow similar expanded use of later powers, or enhance the effects of the 1st level power, allowing the Sorcerer to become a third-rate Warlock.

A Wizard variant;

Expanded Arcana
You have deeply delved into the practices of your art, allowing you to more readily access the least of your abilities.
Benefit: You can use any one of the following School Powers an unlimited number of times per day; Protective Ward (Abjuration), Acid Dart (Conjuration), Dazing Touch (Enchantment), Force Missile (Evocation), Blinding Ray (Illusion), Grave Touch (Necromancy), Telekinetic Fist (Transmutation) or Hand of the Apprentice (Universal).
Special: A Specialist Diviner can benefit from this Feat, but the nature of Diviner's Fortune is changed so that no single individual can benefit from it more than once in an hour.
Prerequisites: Wizard level 5.

[RicoTheBold]

Set wrote:

Awesome stuff

I'm stealing this. I'll double-check it against all affected abilities, and there is a good chance none of my players will care, but there's a sorceror in the group who might.

[Dennis da Ogre]

Set wrote:

Blood Adept

You have further explored your heritage, overcoming your intial hesitation to embrace its gifts.

Expanded Arcana
You have deeply delved into the practices of your art, allowing you to more readily access the least of your abilities.

Both of these are fine, I don't see them getting much use though because by the time you get to 5th level you probably won't be using them very much.

I might suggest you tie it to the sorcerer bloodline so that Dragon Disciples could use it though. To be honest I think Dragon Disciples should get 100% claw use in any case.

[Sort_vampyr]

Dennis da Ogre wrote:

To be honest I think Dragon Disciples should get 100% claw use in any case.

Thank you!

+1

[Set]

Dennis da Ogre wrote:

Both of these are fine, I don't see them getting much use though because by the time you get to 5th level you probably won't be using them very much.

Good point on the DD mention. And yeah, without a follow-up Blood Mastery Feat allowing you to do more damage with the attack, it's a bit of a waste.

[Zurai]

Honestly, I doubt you'd find it very unbalanced if you just made all the sorcerer/wizard/cleric level 1 bloodline/school/domain powers at-will. They don't do any more damage than a crossbow bolt at low levels, and even at high levels an actual spell will do more damage.

[Slime]

I'd make it a feat, but you'd get to take them out or hide them away at will.

I would probably allow a sorcerer to choose (at 1st level) to always have them usable but would make them hard to hide and make most people a bit uneasy around them.

[Set]

Zurai wrote:

Honestly, I doubt you'd find it very unbalanced if you just made all the sorcerer/wizard/cleric level 1 bloodline/school/domain powers at-will. They don't do any more damage than a crossbow bolt at low levels, and even at high levels an actual spell will do more damage.

For the damaging ones, I agree. It wouldn't be a big deal.

But for abilities like Touch of Destiny (destined Sorcerer), Diviner's Fortune (divination Wizard) and Bit of Luck (Luck Domain), I'd probably want to limit them to not affect a specific individual more than once / hour.

[Zurai]

Set wrote:

But for abilities like Touch of Destiny (destined Sorcerer), Diviner's Fortune (divination Wizard) and Bit of Luck (Luck Domain), I'd probably want to limit them to not affect a specific individual more than once / hour.

Yeah, they could use a once/hour or once/day (ala Rebuke Death) clause, but I still don't think they'd be that big a deal. It'd basically resolve down to once/combat if left as-is, because no one's likely to actually refresh them in combat.