With the new Dragon Disciple class here it became clear that this version went a very different way than the original PrC. It seems more of a bloodline focus PrC for the Sorcerer. That is fine and all, but I really missed the concept of developing into an uber melee half dragon. Now I know we don't have the final half dragon coming in a few months, but here is a stab at it with the half dragon we do have.
So my goal here is a total focus on melee and bloodline-like abilities. So here it is.
As from my other thread, in the wrong forum, I am thinking about adding some minor Spell like abilities, probably by type of dragon.
So feedback would be welcomed.
Thank You
....
What the heck, why not. I noticed a piece that could use a little work. The breath weapon, pasted below....
Breath Weapon (Su): At 3rd level, you gain a breath weapon. This breath weapon deals 1d8 points of damage of your energy type per sorcerer level. Those caught in the area of the breath receive a Reflex save for half damage. The DC of this save is equal to 10 + 1/2 your sorcerer level + your Charisma modifier. The shape of the breath weapon depends on your dragon type (as indicated on the above chart) and you can use this ability twice per day. At 6th level, the breath weapon damage increases to 2D8, and you can use this ability once every 2D4 rounds. At 9th level, you can use this ability once every 1D4 rounds like a pure dragon.
Now, here's my thoughts on this. 1d8 per sorcerer level and 10+1/2 sorcerer level? That's rather weird to me. Here are the changes I'd make.
Damage: 1d8*(1/2 spontaneous caster level + Dragon Blooded level) (For example a Sorc 6 DD 2 would deal 5d8 with it's breath weapon)
Save: 10+(1/2 spontaneous caster level + Dragon Blooded level) + Con or Cha modifier (Chosen permanently at Dragon Blooded Level 3. Reason for this is something like a duskblade or whatnot may take the class through the proper feat and Dragon's breath weapon saves are based on Con)
Use: Once per 5 minutes at level 3 (Means once per encounter without getting into the 'per encounter' mechanic some people around here seem to hate for some weird reason), Once per 2d4 rounds at 6th level (which means a reasonable chance of using it twice a fight), and at once per 1d4 rounds at 9th level (same as a dragon)
Let me know what you think, hope I helped.
OK WTF, Google doc must be having problems as I edited this... Thanks.
Okay!
Things should be updated now. I don't know why it didn't do this the first time.
Thanks again.
Other things a-side, I really like to keep it open as rounds, so maybe the minutes could change. So that is a good idea.
I have had some epic fights that were supposed to be individual, but ended up running into each other and we got 20+ rounds of combat, which was very brutal.
Things like caster level will not be touched, as this is supposed to be the almost opposite of Dragon Disciple Build.
....
Another look?
Anyone else?
Okay, I updated the class. I have added the spell like abilities, but I have to wonder if some are too powerful.
Feedback would be great.
Looks interesting but I think its very tough.
I'm not comfortable with the class adding so much to ability scores.
+4 Strength
+2 Con
+2 Int
Seems like a lot over 10 levels. Especially with the rest of the abilities.
I can't see using it as a pc race. I can imagine it as a magical transformation though.
Sigurd
Looks interesting but I think its very tough.
I'm not comfortable with the class adding so much to ability scores.
+4 Strength
+2 Con
+2 IntSeems like a lot over 10 levels. Especially with the rest of the abilities.
I can't see using it as a pc race. I can imagine it as a magical transformation though.
Sigurd
I would rather cut the spell like abilities my self. Maybe drop them to 3/day max? People in multiple servers requested this.
The +8 strength grants you a +4 to hit, making up for the low BaB, as the standard original PrC.What has been added from the original.
Bit attack
elemental damage to natural weapon attacks (very similar to normal blood line ability)
Energy resistance progression, leading up to full, and standard, immunity.
Considering the current DD, I think this is to par, considering you get NO actual spell progression.
Looks interesting but I think its very tough.
I'm not comfortable with the class adding so much to ability scores.
+4 Strength
+2 Con
+2 IntSeems like a lot over 10 levels. Especially with the rest of the abilities.
I can't see using it as a pc race. I can imagine it as a magical transformation though.
Sigurd
I would rather cut the spell like abilities my self. Maybe drop them to 3/day max? People in multiple servers requested this.
The +8 strength grants you a +4 to hit, making up for the low BaB, as the standard original PrC.What has been added from the original.
Bit attack
elemental damage to natural weapon attacks (very similar to normal blood line ability)
Energy resistance progression, leading up to full, and standard, immunity.
Blood Line Feats: I can see this being reduced if not cut.Considering the current DD, I think this is to par, considering you get NO actual spell progression.
I think its sort of bad form to reduce the bab and try to recover it with added ability scores. This is really dangerous as ability scores are used for much more than fighting. Further, I think it is more believable to think that the class gets better at fighting.
Up the BAB, don't play with abilities - I think thats more in line with the game logic.
S
I think its sort of bad form to reduce the bab and try to recover it with added ability scores. This is really dangerous as ability scores are used for much more than fighting. Further, I think it is more believable to think that the class gets better at fighting.
Up the BAB, don't play with abilities - I think thats more in line with the game logic.S
.... Okay, that is a valid opinion. Did you not play 3.5 or did you just not like that one ether?
I think its sort of bad form to reduce the bab and try to recover it with added ability scores. This is really dangerous as ability scores are used for much more than fighting. Further, I think it is more believable to think that the class gets better at fighting.
Up the BAB, don't play with abilities - I think thats more in line with the game logic.S
Except that the original DD did increase your stats. Str, Con, and Cha were all boosted over a ten-level spread until you had boosted stats equivalent to the LA+3 Half-Dragon template.
This is not a class that just makes you fight like a Half-Dragon. It is a class that makes YOU a Half-Dragon. Your stats should change, to reflect the metamorphosis your body and mind are going through.
I like the new one better.
Staying a Humanoid Type instead of becoming Dragon Type (at Capstone)
means you can still use 1st Level Enlarge Person instead of 2nd Level Alter Self. That seems convenient. I think the only problem with the new one is that it is COMPLICATED, i.e. you need to cross-reference the PrC and the Bloodline, and Spellcasting/ Abilities + Bonus Spells use different effective levels.
The new one DOES scale your Abilities (again, you need to cross-reference BL + PrC) and more or less I think it would kick the 3.5 DD's ass. The 3.5 DD's not-spell-progression spell progression was a hideous joke, real spell progression actually is relevant to the game. I actually look forward to similar mechanical-concept PrC's, but for Elemental and Abyssal BL's.
I like the new one better.
Staying a Humanoid Type instead of becoming Dragon Type (at Capstone)
means you can still use 1st Level Enlarge Person instead of 2nd Level Alter Self. That seems convenient. I think the only problem with the new one is that it is COMPLICATED, i.e. you need to cross-reference the PrC and the Bloodline, and Spellcasting/ Abilities + Bonus Spells use different effective levels.
The new one DOES scale your Abilities (again, you need to cross-reference BL + PrC) and more or less I think it would kick the 3.5 DD's ass. The 3.5 DD's not-spell-progression spell progression was a hideous joke, real spell progression actually is relevant to the game. I actually look forward to similar mechanical-concept PrC's, but for Elemental and Abyssal BL's.
Except you no longer have the point to the class, which was to be a kick ass super half dragon. Its a fine class, and yeah about anything was better than the DD in 3.5. That is why I made this one. Please judge this on my write up, not 3.5.
Obviously I DO NOT like the way they went with DD in PF, so saying how much better PF-DD is from 3.5. Means nothing to me and MY version.
So how about some relevant information about my conversion?
I honestly prefer the PRPG version to yours. I don't really see whether or not your technical creature type changes to Dragon really affecting much from an in-game, role-playing perspective. Enjoy your variant, I guess.
BTW: I do like your Draconic Heritage Feat, my only recommendation is remove the language requirement: A character doesn't need to have had any personal contact with Dragons (and Dragons don't need to communicate in Draconic anyways) to have this type of heritage... Getting more in touch with this side (thru Draconic Sorceror Class or DD) would be a valid character development, and picking up Draconic language along the way could be part of that.
I honestly prefer the PRPG version to yours. I don't really see whether or not your technical creature type changes to Dragon really affecting much from an in-game, role-playing perspective. Enjoy your variant, I guess.
The flavor really is the point. Thanks.
BTW: I do like your Draconic Heritage Feat, my only recommendation is remove the language requirement: A character doesn't need to have had any personal contact with Dragons (and Dragons don't need to communicate in Draconic anyways) to have this type of heritage... Getting more in touch with this side (thru Draconic Sorceror Class or DD) would be a valid character development, and picking up Draconic language along the way could be part of that.
Thanks, that is a very good point.
OMG! I had a huge problem with Google doc. It didn't publish again after I corrected a tone of mistakes.
It again, should be up to date.
Guess no one noticed that the class didn't have the spell like abilities I said it had...
Here is the Revised version if the current is too powerful.