Another Rules / Power Combo Question!

[Cacophonik]

Looking for clarification for the following scenario:

Can a Half-Elven Wild Sorcerer who has the following features (and uses a pair of daggers) cast a Twin-Strike Dragonfrost bolt at range, as an At-Will power?

Dilettante Power: Twin Strike: Two melee or ranged attacks, must use melee or ranged weapon
Sorcerous Blade Channeling: Use any Ranged Sorcerer power thru a Dagger as a Melee Attack
Reaper's Touch: Dragonfrost power gains range of melee touch, can be used as Melee Basic Attack
Versatile Master: Makes Dilettante Power (Twin Strike) into an At-Will, instead of an Encounter power

My interpretation of the combination is "No." What's yours? Why?

[Blazej]

I would say the answer is "No, you can't use it to Twin Strike with the dragonfrost power." The reason is that Twin Strike does not allow you to make two basic attacks, it instead just describes the attacks you make so your "This Power can be used as a Basic Attack" will not affect Twin Strike.

Edit: However, as an example for something like this could work, I believe you could use something like the paragon feat Two-Weapon Opening from Player's Handbook 2. It sometimes lets you make a free melee basic attack with your off-hand weapon, so that would allow you to use Dragonfrost Bolt with your off-hand dagger using the other abilities you have described.

[Cacophonik]

Blazej wrote:

I would say the answer is "No, you can't use it to Twin Strike with the dragonfrost power." The reason is that Twin Strike does not allow you to make two basic attacks, it instead just describes the attacks you make so your "This Power can be used as a Basic Attack" will not affect Twin Strike.

Edit: However, as an example for something like this could work, I believe you could use something like the paragon feat Two-Weapon Opening from Player's Handbook 2. It sometimes lets you make a free melee basic attack with your off-hand weapon, so that would allow you to use Dragonfrost Bolt with your off-hand dagger using the other abilities you have described.

As a ranged attack, or solely melee? The situation came about originally when using the Dragonfrost/Twin Strike to make two Ranged attacks.

[Blazej]

Cacophonik wrote:

As a ranged attack, or solely melee? The situation came about originally when using the Dragonfrost/Twin Strike to make two Ranged attacks.

The feat I described only granted it as a melee attack, so it would not help with a ranged two-weapon fighter. I can not think of any specific abilities that exist that would allow for this. My best suggestion is working with your DM to create some solution that might be satisfactory to your character concept.

[Cacophonik]

Blazej wrote:

Cacophonik wrote:

As a ranged attack, or solely melee? The situation came about originally when using the Dragonfrost/Twin Strike to make two Ranged attacks.

The feat I described only granted it as a melee attack, so it would not help with a ranged two-weapon fighter. I can not think of any specific abilities that exist that would allow for this. My best suggestion is working with your DM to create some solution that might be satisfactory to your character concept.

Heh. I am the DM, trying to work out a solution for my player. ;)

[Blazej]

Cacophonik wrote:

Heh. I am the DM, trying to work out a solution for my player. ;)

Ah. :)

What is your player wanting to do exactly? Do they want to be able to use Dragonfrost Bolt twice per turn, or do they just want to be a two weapon wielding ranged spellcaster and not care much how that happens, or someplace in between?

Edit: Now that I think about it, there is one feat that I know of that deals with two implement wielding casters, I saw it in a Arcane Power Excerpts article and it was called "Dual Implement Spellcaster", the description of the ability seems quite clear from the preview (unless there is some big "But..." in the full text of the feat (the only small thing that they might state is that the bonus to damage is a feat bonus). I don't like it for getting the feel of weilding two weapons, but it just came to mind while I was thinking.

[Matthew Koelbl]

To agree with what has been said already: This doesn't work.

The thing to realize is that Twin Strike lets you take two melee (or ranged) attacks. However, the issue you present is based on interpretating this as "take two basic melee attacks" - but that is 100% not the case. Twin Strike clearly defines the attacks it grants you - you can't simply replace them. You can't substitute any other attacks for those, any more than you could do so with any other power in the game.

Note that if you could, you could simply swap the two attacks it gives you (which do 1[W] damage) for two standard basic attacks (doing 1[W]+Str) - obviously, every character would do this, since it would simply ramp up their damage for free! But it isn't a legal option - you have to use the power as written. Basic melee attacks can be made as a standard action, or used when another powers lets you do so (like a Warlord using Commander's Strike, or similar) - you can't simply swap them in place of any other attack, free of charge.

Anyway, hope this helps!

[Arovyn]

I can put this a bit more simply. Diletante did not make Twin Strike into a Sorcerer Power. Sorcerous Blade Channeling only allows a ranged Sorcerer power to be channeled into a melee attack. If you want me to clarify that a bit further, both powers have different sources altogether. I applaud the creativity, though.