I put stock in symbols and momentous occasions.So what price would you put on WingDings and the day you realized that defecating in your undergarments was not ok ????
Zen riddle: What is the sound of one troll clapping?
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Yepp. Absolutely. And what a shame that the first non-caucasian person elected was voted in almost entirely because of their being non-caucasian.
And in like form, I'll wager the first latino and or female presidential candidates (backed by party and formally in the election) would win as well, regardless of background or political stance. Ahhh...you see...neither of those two gentelmen were the party candidate...or made it to the ACTUAL election :)
Just think about it when our first female president is someone the likes of Palin...that'll be a sad day, because she was the first presidential candidate (running in the election, nominated and backed by party) elected because she was a woman.
Unfortunately, given the solitary history of caucasian waspy males in the upper echelon of government, the firsts have a huge potential to suck no matter what.
See now you're making contradictory statements, the first was that he elected almost entirely because of race, now you say it was because he was the party candidate, so now it's not primarily his race, but primarily his being the party candidate and being african american. But it's not like he's the first african american to try and run for the party nomination, so how come he was the first to become the party nominee.
Zen riddle: What is the sound of one troll clapping?I put stock in symbols and momentous occasions.So what price would you put on WingDings and the day you realized that defecating in your undergarments was not ok ????
Actually, pious-one...I was making that comment to be funny...I found the comment he/she/it made to be a bit odd...and thought asking them what stock price they'd put on the symbol true type font from Microsoft and the day he was pottie trained as an infant would be funny as well. It was not meant to be inflammatory or otherwise insulting.
Maybe the humor was lost on you. Perhaps you feel better by thinking highly of yourself (by regarding myself as a troll). Who knows.
Ciao!
See now you're making contradictory statements, the first was that he elected almost entirely because of race, now you say it was because he was the party candidate, so now it's not primarily his race, but primarily his being the party candidate and being african american. But it's not like he's the first african american to try and run for the party nomination, so how come he was the first to become the party nominee.Yepp. Absolutely. And what a shame that the first non-caucasian person elected was voted in almost entirely because of their being non-caucasian.
And in like form, I'll wager the first latino and or female presidential candidates (backed by party and formally in the election) would win as well, regardless of background or political stance. Ahhh...you see...neither of those two gentelmen were the party candidate...or made it to the ACTUAL election :)
Just think about it when our first female president is someone the likes of Palin...that'll be a sad day, because she was the first presidential candidate (running in the election, nominated and backed by party) elected because she was a woman.
Unfortunately, given the solitary history of caucasian waspy males in the upper echelon of government, the firsts have a huge potential to suck no matter what.
I'm not so certain you have that many straws left to grasp at, friend...just let it go...shhh...let it go...(think of the stabbing scene in "Saving Private Ryan", but without the violence..mmm'k?)
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I honestly believe that if Barack Obama was a white guy named Henry Smith (i.e. that he was the same person, background, personality, etc. with white skin and a different name) that he would have had an even easier time getting the party nomination and winning the presidency than he did. Others clearly think differently.
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I put stock in symbols and momentous occasions.So what price would you put on WingDings and the day you realized that defecating in your undergarments was not ok ????
Hm. That day was certainly momentous. Not quite on par with the election of the first black president, but I'm pretty sure I overheard Strauss's Also sprach Zarathustra the first time I crapped on the john.
You could always go with "B0llocks"
b@&&~*&s.EDIT: I am not sure which I am more surprised by... that the filter knew that word well enough to tag, or that it apparently un-capitalized it on me.
Thou art wise.
I knew losing Innuendo in the 3.5 conversion would someday come back to bite me on the b@&&~*&s.
These little quotes are why Obama gave me hope this very fine day.
"Our health care is too costly; our schools fail too many; and each day brings further evidence that the ways we use energy strengthen our adversaries and threaten our planet."
"We will restore science to its rightful place, and wield technology's wonders to raise health care's quality and lower its cost. We will harness the sun and the winds and the soil to fuel our cars and run our factories. And we will transform our schools and colleges and universities to meet the demands of a new age. All this we can do. And all this we will do."
The professor president has taken office, let use hope that charisma and knowledge can fuel the start of a scientific renaissance based on our very real need for new fuel sources and our rapidly changing world.
I honestly believe that if Barack Obama was a white guy named Henry Smith (i.e. that he was the same person, background, personality, etc. with white skin and a different name) that he would have had an even easier time getting the party nomination and winning the presidency than he did. Others clearly think differently.
Fair enough.
However, fact is, he is NOW President Obama. He made it. Good.
Now, hopefully people will finish putting so much emphasis on his color (I think the term "race" is silly...he's only different in skin color...he's still human) and name (Mine is Scottish...who cares).
I hope we can finally get PAST all of this cRAP and onto fixing things.
And I hope people won't be forced to regret their votes, for whatever reason they voted.
I honestly believe that if Barack Obama was a white guy named Henry Smith (i.e. that he was the same person, background, personality, etc. with white skin and a different name) that he would have had an even easier time getting the party nomination and winning the presidency than he did. Others clearly think differently.Fair enough.
However, fact is, he is NOW President Obama. He made it. Good.
Now, hopefully people will finish putting so much emphasis on his color (I think the term "race" is silly...he's only different in skin color...he's still human) and name (Mine is Scottish...who cares).
I hope we can finally get PAST all of this cRAP and onto fixing things.
And I hope people won't be forced to regret their votes, for whatever reason they voted.
Race is the appropreate term. Two people can be of two seperate race and still both be human. Race when it is used accurately refers to ethnicity.
DnD has traditionally misused the term to mean species.
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Honestly, I was a little disapointed with the ceremony. That was not one of Obama's better speeches and the crowds chanting Obama, Obama and screaming like the Beetles were coming to town made me wonder how many people knew we were electing a president and not voting for the next American Idol.
I agree. I thought his speech after winning the election was much stronger, although I did love the classical piece right before he was sworn in. But I like Yo Yo Ma, so whatever. ;p
Race is the appropreate term. Two people can be of two seperate race and still both be human. Race when it is used accurately refers to ethnicity.
DnD has traditionally misused the term to mean species.
The point I was trying to make is that I happen to feel that the concept of "race" is in and of itself biggoted. We are all humans. We are all defined by culture, nation of origin, etc. To use "race" as a divisor due to skin color...well, might as well divide people by hair color...
And, no...*LMFAO*...I was not using the term in any way shape or form as it is used in the context of D&D. Somewhat silly IMHO that you'd suggest I somehow did.
Honestly, I was a little disapointed with the ceremony. That was not one of Obama's better speeches and the crowds chanting Obama, Obama and screaming like the Beetles were coming to town made me wonder how many people knew we were electing a president and not voting for the next American Idol.I agree. I thought his speech after winning the election was much stronger, although I did love the classical piece right before he was sworn in. But I like Yo Yo Ma, so whatever. ;p
I'm down with the YO YO man...he rocks...and is one talented m'er f'er...
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I honestly believe that if Barack Obama was a white guy named Henry Smith (i.e. that he was the same person, background, personality, etc. with white skin and a different name) that he would have had an even easier time getting the party nomination and winning the presidency than he did. Others clearly think differently.
If he were a white guy named Harry Smith, the media wouldn't have fawned on him so much, nor would they have given him a pass on some of his stickier associations. Also, were he a white guy named Harry Smith, it would have been perfectly ok (and not racist, as the media made it out to be) to question how someone with so little actual experience, such a thin resume and a practically non-existant voting record ("present" doesn't count) thought he was ready for the toughest job on Earth (yeah, his predecessor wasn't ready either, frankly).
So, perhaps the voting public didn't pick his name on the ballot because his dad was African, but the absolutely embarrassing performance by the media over the last year had everything to do with that fact.
I just hope the dude does a complete 180 from what my expectations are for him. Dude is taking office today, and I STILL have no idea who he is. All I know is he gives pretty speeches...
If he were a white guy named Harry Smith, the media wouldn't have fawned on him so much, nor would they have given him a pass on some of his stickier associations. Also, were he a white guy named Harry Smith, it would have been perfectly ok (and not racist, as the media made it out to be) to question how someone with so little actual experience, such a thin resume and a practically non-existant voting record ("present" doesn't count) thought he was ready for the toughest job on Earth (yeah, his predecessor wasn't ready either, frankly).
So, perhaps the voting public didn't pick his name on the ballot because his dad was African, but the absolutely embarrassing performance by the media over the last year had everything to do with that fact.
I just hope the dude does a complete 180 from what my expectations are for him. Dude is taking office today, and I STILL have no idea who he is. All I know is he gives pretty speeches...
I lub you man!@!!! AMEN!!! <wipes snot from nose on sleeve...not going to tell who's sleeve>
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Honestly, I was a little disapointed with the ceremony. That was not one of Obama's better speeches and the crowds chanting Obama, Obama and screaming like the Beetles were coming to town made me wonder how many people knew we were electing a president and not voting for the next American Idol.I agree. I thought his speech after winning the election was much stronger, although I did love the classical piece right before he was sworn in. But I like Yo Yo Ma, so whatever. ;p
I thought the same thing, he had some good quotes in there, but I did expect something he said to just wow me like his acceptance speach, honestly most of his speach struck me as slightly repetative. Still the guy is a good speaker. My question is how much are the 24 hour news networks going to harp on his trouble with repeating the swearing in?
And I can't wait to listen to Hannity tonight, that ought to be good (I find him to be hillariously over the top)
It's not surprising that a political discussion brings out so much bitterness in people, but it never fails to sadden me a little to see it.
To answer the OP's question, I still have hope for the future. Just like I did for the last election, and the one before that, and the one before that, etc.
I'm more excited about the possibilities than I have been before, but I'm still keeping a healthy dose of reality check to keep me in line.
As a non-american of some 40 years of age:
This is the first time in my memory that any American president has been elected with such a sense of hope and optimism being raised OUTSIDE America.
That´s the feeling I get as well. There are very high hopes piled on the shoulders of one man, not only from inside the US. Of course, action speaks louder than words, but I guess we will have an interesting four years. In his speech, he warned all that there are hard times to come, and he addressed a few topics that are very interesting as well: ending the engagement in Iraq, continuing it in Afghanistan, and reviewing the security politics of the Bush administration. And that is just a start. He will have a hell of a workload, and I´m not sure if I would want to take his place (even if I could).
And I feared right away that some nutjob will try to kill him, even during the inauguration ceremony. The fact that his skin color is a topic at all serves to show just how far away from normalcy it is to have a black president, even after all these years. Honestly, I don´t see a turkish chancellor in Germany for at least the next twenty years. (I´m well aware that the situation of the black people in the US and the turkish people in Germany is not really comparable, but it is the closest thing I can relate to.)
In the end, it is a good thing to see, but we will have to wait what comes from it.
Stefan
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I honestly believe that if Barack Obama was a white guy named Henry Smith (i.e. that he was the same person, background, personality, etc. with white skin and a different name) that he would have had an even easier time getting the party nomination and winning the presidency than he did. Others clearly think differently.If he were a white guy named Harry Smith, the media wouldn't have fawned on him so much, nor would they have given him a pass on some of his stickier associations. Also, were he a white guy named Harry Smith, it would have been perfectly ok (and not racist, as the media made it out to be) to question how someone with so little actual experience, such a thin resume and a practically non-existant voting record ("present" doesn't count) thought he was ready for the toughest job on Earth (yeah, his predecessor wasn't ready either, frankly).
So, perhaps the voting public didn't pick his name on the ballot because his dad was African, but the absolutely embarrassing performance by the media over the last year had everything to do with that fact.
I just hope the dude does a complete 180 from what my expectations are for him. Dude is taking office today, and I STILL have no idea who he is. All I know is he gives pretty speeches...
See I disagree, the press fawned over him because he was a more charming and erudite candidate than hillary clinton and they are in the pocket of the democratic party, not Obama's race. The fact is the guys personality is engaging and the reason he slips past all those questionable associations is the fact that the guy is tremendous when it comes to avoiding scandal, people just want to believe him when he says things like "we weren't closely associated." It's not like there haven't been other presidents with the same ability, wasn't it a republican who was coined the teflon president? forgive my spotty memory.
It's not surprising that a political discussion brings out so much bitterness in people, but it never fails to sadden me a little to see it.
To answer the OP's question, I still have hope for the future. Just like I did for the last election, and the one before that, and the one before that, etc.
I'm more excited about the possibilities than I have been before, but I'm still keeping a healthy dose of reality check to keep me in line.
<blinks eyes repeatedly> Bitterness???? </blinking>
See I disagree, the press fawned over him because he was a more charming and erudite candidate than hillary clinton and they are in the pocket of the democratic party, not Obama's race. The fact is the guys personality is engaging and the reason he slips past all those questionable associations is the fact that the guy is tremendous when it comes to avoiding scandal, it's not like there haven't been other presidents with the same ability, wasn't it a republican who was coined the teflon president? forgive my spotty memory.
And his skin color / ethnicity had NOTHING AT ALL TO DO WITH how the media fawned over him...nope..nothing to do with obtaining ratings...sell more crap we don't need from Johnson & Johnson...nuh-uh....certainly didn't...nah...couldn't have...no way...never ever ever...he was erudite!!! Yeah...ERUDITE!!!
THAT's IT...ERUDITE!!!
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Senators Byrd and Kennedy collapsed at the Congressional reception.
Do some stat crunchinghere for some perspective on what that could mean.
I have to go to class now. You get 3 hours without me!
Senators Byrd and Kennedy collapsed at the Congressional reception.
Do some stat crunchinghere for some perspective on what that could mean.
I have to go to class now. You get 3 hours without me!
Shame they didn't all "collapse"...I'm in favor of a fresh start with people who actually give a crap anywho....
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My question is how much are the 24 hour news networks going to harp on his trouble with repeating the swearing in?
And I can't wait to listen to Hannity tonight, that ought to be good (I find him to be hillariously over the top)
Actually, it was Chief Justice Roberts who had trouble with the swearing in - Obama did kind of jump in and start to say "I, Barack Hussein Obama" before Roberts finished the first part, but the difficulty with the rest of it came from the fact that Roberts messed up the wording by misplacing the word "faithfully." Obama's hesitation came from the fact that he knew the actual oath and heard something different, so he looked like he wanted to repeat the version Roberts had used.
EDIT: It looks like they both messed it up, but I would place the blame for this more on Roberts:
[Roberts] then recited the next part of the oath incorrectly placing the word "faithfully" at the end of the phrase": "...that I will execute the office of President to the United States faithfully". Obama repeated "that I will execute," then paused, waiting for a repeat of the prompt. Chief Justice Roberts then repeated the prompt correctly as "...that I will faithfully execute the office of President of the United States." Barack Obama then incorrectly recited the remainder of the oath as "...the office of President of the United States faithfully".
I, for one, welcome our new muslin overlord.
Nah, seriously, I'm just glad he's finally in office. I'm tentatively optimistic.
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See I disagree, the press fawned over him because he was a more charming and erudite candidate than hillary clinton and they are in the pocket of the democratic party, not Obama's race. The fact is the guys personality is engaging and the reason he slips past all those questionable associations is the fact that the guy is tremendous when it comes to avoiding scandal, it's not like there haven't been other presidents with the same ability, wasn't it a republican who was coined the teflon president? forgive my spotty memory.And his skin color / ethnicity had NOTHING AT ALL TO DO WITH how the media fawned over him...nope..nothing to do with obtaining ratings...sell more crap we don't need from Johnson & Johnson...nuh-uh....certainly didn't...nah...couldn't have...no way...never ever ever...he was erudite!!! Yeah...ERUDITE!!!
THAT's IT...ERUDITE!!!
Heh damnit, I had a whole post about how I that that got eaten well let me see if I can re-type it.
For the record I do believe that obama's race played a part in the momentum of his candidacy, I just don't believe that it was a primary factor, because for every person I know who voted for Obama because he was black (and keep in mind I married into a large black family) I know just as many, actually more people who weren't voting for him because he was black. Let me repeat that, I know just as many people who voted against him because he was a secret muslim or because they just plain don't like ni@#ers. I mean when I have to come to work and see pictures passed around the break room with a young mccain in front of his fighter jet next to Obama in his daishiki with a caption of ARE YOU F#@$ING SERIOUS?!? I find it ludicrous to believe that the primary factor of his victory was his skin color.
Maybe it's just me, I do live in the south (grew up in Osteen, FL there's a reason you've never heard of it) and work in a maintenance shop, so maybe I'm just in an isolated bubble of absurd stupidity. But while his race played a part in his candidacy I just don't believe it was the main reason he won and find the idea that it is frankly kind of dismissive and insulting to the man's increadible charisma, I mean lets face it, the guy has an 18 charisma and he put his human bonus into his CHA, you just can't tell me that his skin color somehow beat out his speaking ability. And lets not forget the celebrity worship factor. I think Oprah's backing him had more to do with his winning than his skin color.
This is one of the greatest days in the history of politics for the United States of America.
"Greatest"? I think that has still to be shown. It is certainly one of the most significant days in the history of the U.S.. If it is one of the greatest depends on how this person developes as a president.
How do others feel?
I feel proud of the fact that the U.S. is one of the greatest countries in the world, where we can have an exchange of power so peacefully and mostly mature (leaving out the "Arrest Bush" signs and the singing of "Hey, hey, good-bye!").
I feel nervous for those people that are saying things like the fact that an african-american (actually he is bi-racial, and raised almost exclusively with his white family) has been elected president makes their lives better. I am nervous because if he ends up being a poor president these people will feel betrayed and perhaps set back emotionally.
I feel hopeful that things might get better.
I feel secure that there is enough inertia in the system that no one person, not even the president, can too unbalance the system.
I feel like we won't see the same level of anti-war demonstrations even though the new administration has no intention of stopping the conflict in Afghanistan.
I feel upbeat that we get a new president from a "post"-vietnam generation and maybe we can get past some of those baggage.
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My question is how much are the 24 hour news networks going to harp on his trouble with repeating the swearing in?
And I can't wait to listen to Hannity tonight, that ought to be good (I find him to be hillariously over the top)
Actually, it was Chief Justice Roberts who had trouble with the swearing in - Obama did kind of jump in and start to say "I, Barack Hussein Obama" before Roberts finished the first part, but the difficulty with the rest of it came from the fact that Roberts messed up the wording by misplacing the word "faithfully." Obama's hesitation came from the fact that he knew the actual oath and heard something different, so he looked like he wanted to repeat the version Roberts had used.
EDIT: It looks like they both messed it up, but I would place the blame for this more on Roberts:
[Roberts] then recited the next part of the oath incorrectly placing the word "faithfully" at the end of the phrase": "...that I will execute the office of President to the United States faithfully". Obama repeated "that I will execute," then paused, waiting for a repeat of the prompt. Chief Justice Roberts then repeated the prompt correctly as "...that I will faithfully execute the office of President of the United States." Barack Obama then incorrectly recited the remainder of the oath as "...the office of President of the United States faithfully".
I was actually more talking about his jumping the gun on the I barack, but regardless I got a good laugh from all of it :)
I, for one, welcome our new muslin overlord.
Nah, seriously, I'm just glad he's finally in office. I'm tentatively optimistic.
James,
Thank you, thank you, THANK you...you GENUINELY made me laugh out loud!!! :)
I'm just hoping it does not go up to three.Hey Kobold I'm 98% certain you meant to include a not in this sentence.
Oh crap. Whoops.
Sorry.I'm not even going to bother reading all the angry rants against my post. People can claim it 'didn't happen' but I'm afraid I simply won't believe them.
Yes, I guess that is kinda bigoted. But I don't have time, either.
As for reflective thoughts, here's a poem I just did. Interpret it as you will.
I, the chicken, peck the dirt,
Knowing not of the past,
Old days gone by, still very real,
Full of death and darkness,
But I know nothing of all that,
I am, after all, a chicken
I, the cat, stalk the mouse,
Knowing little of how things are,
The things which echo the past,
Full of fear, but with some hope,
But I care nothing of all that,
I am merely a cat
I, the dog, sit by the fire,
Not knowing of the future,
Simply sitting by a fire,
Not knowing of the hope,
Sighing at the lack of food in its bowl,
Not knowing how great the day is,
For I know nothing of all that,
I am, after all, a dog
I, the goat, sleep on the grass,
Not knowing what has happened,
How much a country has changed
In but a single day,
I do not care, for I'll still have
My food, my bed and my home,
I rest my head upon the grass,
I do not care.
For I am but a goat.
Heh damnit, I had a whole post about how I that that got eaten well let me see if I can re-type it.
Yeah, I know the feeling...had one that I think THEY zapped out of existenz....and yes, THEY know who THEY are!!! :)
For the record I do believe that obama's race played a part in the momentum of his candidacy, I just don't believe that it was a primary factor, because for every person I know who voted for Obama because he was black (and keep in mind I married into a large black family) I know just as many, actually more people who weren't voting for him because he was black. Let me repeat that, I know just as many people who voted against him because he was a secret muslim or because they just plain don't like ni@#ers. I mean when I have to come to work and see pictures passed around the break room with a young mccain in front of his fighter jet next to Obama in his daishiki with a caption of ARE YOU F#@$ING SERIOUS?!? I find it ludicrous to believe that the primary factor of his victory was his skin color.
Unfortunately, stupidity is color blind. And from what I can see lingers closely to cultural groups as well (see redneck...as well as other poor, uninformed groups)
However, I think at this point we need to agree to disagree, you and I. After all, I already used my "Saving Private Ryan" reference...
I am not saying that I believe he was elected due to skin color because I am against that fact (which I am not, I could care less, I equally hate everyone :)...I am saying that I believe he was elected due to the mass populace either feeling that "one of their own" finally had a chance...or that "we really should give this colored man a chance, after all, we're PC"...that is what I believe the average person who voted for Obama used as their reasoning. Just my thoughts, not necessarily correct.
LKL, I respect your viewpoint.
Maybe it's just me, I do live in the south (grew up in Osteen, FL there's a reason you've never heard of it) and work in a maintenance shop, so maybe I'm just in an isolated bubble of absurd stupidity....
I cannot say that I blame you for being upset...had I been exposed to the same crap you describe I'd have been pretty damned pissed off. I am a computer programmer (SQL and Peoplesoft / Databases mostly)...but worked once for a utility company, which was entirely union...and as such, I had to sit with the guys who had the hard jobs...fixing gas mains...etc....even though I was technically "mgmt". I tend to wear alot of black, and sport alot of tattoos...suddenly, I started getting "flyers" left on my chair, my desk, in my lunch box...telling me how "If you'd only give yourself over to God"...well...suffice it to say, I know your pain. Like I said, it's stupid all over.
I'm just hoping it does not go up to three.Hey Kobold I'm 98% certain you meant to include a not in this sentence.Oh crap. Whoops.
Sorry.
I'm not even going to bother reading all the angry rants against my post. People can claim it 'didn't happen' but I'm afraid I simply won't believe them.
Yes, I guess that is kinda bigoted. But I don't have time, either.
As for reflective thoughts, here's a poem I just did. Interpret it as you will.
I, the chicken, peck the dirt,
Knowing not of the past,
Old days gone by, still very real,
Full of death and darkness,
But I know nothing of all that,
I am, after all, a chicken
Don't bogart...not cool...
4:20!!!
Honestly, I was a little disapointed with the ceremony. That was not one of Obama's better speeches and the crowds chanting Obama, Obama and screaming like the Beetles were coming to town made me wonder how many people knew we were electing a president and not voting for the next American Idol.
I understand your concern David. It's definitely not as austere as previous inaugurations, but this is different.
This was, in a sense, a different type of election. In a sense, it's a bit of synergy regarding the economy and 8 years of war coming together to demand hope from people. Like the man who promises water to someone dying of thirst.
People are going to get emotional and excited.
Like the man who promises water to someone dying of thirst.
He promised me Banana Bread...
I just hope the dude does a complete 180 from what my expectations are for him. Dude is taking office today, and I STILL have no idea who he is. All I know is he gives pretty speeches...
I feel that's really sad Derek. Obama has published TWO books mainly about who he is and what he wants politics to be like. If you don't know him from reading those, I don't know what will give you some peace of mind.
I just hope the dude does a complete 180 from what my expectations are for him. Dude is taking office today, and I STILL have no idea who he is. All I know is he gives pretty speeches...I feel that's really sad Derek. Obama has published TWO books mainly about who he is and what he wants politics to be like. If you don't know him from reading those, I don't know what will give you some peace of mind.
Yeah Derek, SAD....SAD....
"Greatest"? I think that has still to be shown. It is certainly one of the most significant days in the history of the U.S.. If it is one of the greatest depends on how this person developes as a president.
Greatest in the sense that this is a milestone that we as a nation now recognize equality of ability as more important than class or race.
I feel we are witnessing history and have reached a point when Martin Luther King Jr's dream is beginning to be fulfilled. Regardless of what I feel about his politics, it proves that we have begun to judge people on their ideas and character rather then their skin color.
Hear, hear.
I'm really impressed with just how broad his support in the election really was. Here in Wisconsin, he carried the vast majority of the counties. Neither Gore nor Kerry managed to carry even half the counties (though they still carried the state). And many of those counties Obama carried are in solidly Republican territory.It's only 20 years ago that people in those areas were turning up at boat landings to hurl racial epithets at Native Americans exercising their spear fishing rights. Now, Obama picks up votes over McCain.
We've come a long way.
"Greatest"? I think that has still to be shown. It is certainly one of the most significant days in the history of the U.S.. If it is one of the greatest depends on how this person developes as a president.Greatest in the sense that this is a milestone that we as a nation now recognize equality of ability as more important than class or race.
What WingDing would you assign to this momentously magnificent milestone ? :)
I feel we are witnessing history and have reached a point when Martin Luther King Jr's dream is beginning to be fulfilled. Regardless of what I feel about his politics, it proves that we have begun to judge people on their ideas and character rather then their skin color.Hear, hear.
I'm really impressed with just how broad his support in the election really was. Here in Wisconsin, he carried the vast majority of the counties. Neither Gore nor Kerry managed to carry even half the counties (though they still carried the state). And many of those counties Obama carried are in solidly Republican territory.
It's only 20 years ago that people in those areas were turning up at boat landings to hurl racial epithets at Native Americans exercising their spear fishing rights. Now, Obama picks up votes over McCain.
We've come a long way.
BABY!!!!
flynnster, are you kidding? Where is all this coming from?
flynnster, are you kidding? Where is all this coming from?
All of what, Veector?...Oh WAIT...you wanted to know if I was serious about wanting to know what WingDing you'd associate with this wonderful thing that we all have done ????
YES...Tell me what WingDing you'd associate with this!?!?!?!?
All of what, Veector?flynnster, are you kidding? Where is all this coming from?
If you don't know, that's even worse.
If you don't know, that's even worse.
I am not sure what you're driving at, Mr. Veector...please expound on your query....
"Greatest"? I think that has still to be shown. It is certainly one of the most significant days in the history of the U.S.. If it is one of the greatest depends on how this person developes as a president.Greatest in the sense that this is a milestone that we as a nation now recognize equality of ability as more important than class or race.
Not to diminish the moment but I'm not so sure about class. It seems that few/none working class stiffs can gather the support of the rich and powerful. At least at the national level. Regardless of party.
But for race, 'Amen'. It'll be even nicer going forward when race is truly not an issue. Too much to expect it to be a sidebar for the groundbreaker but it bodes well for the future.
Not to diminish the moment but I'm not so sure about class. It seems that few/none working class stiffs can gather the support of the rich and powerful. At least at the national level. Regardless of party.
But for race, 'Amen'. It'll be even nicer going forward when race is truly not an issue. Too much to expect it to be a sidebar for the groundbreaker but it bodes well for the future.
I think class only because I feel Barack has largely made it because of his hardwork and the chances given to him after he showed others what he's capable of. If the highest offices in the country were only limited to people who have graduated from private prep schools, then class would still limit us as a society.
Not to diminish the moment but I'm not so sure about class. It seems that few/none working class stiffs can gather the support of the rich and powerful. At least at the national level. Regardless of party.
But for race, 'Amen'. It'll be even nicer going forward when race is truly not an issue. Too much to expect it to be a sidebar for the groundbreaker but it bodes well for the future.
I think class only because I feel Barack has largely made it because of his hardwork and the chances given to him after he showed others what he's capable of. If the highest offices in the country were only limited to people who have graduated from private prep schools, then class would still limit us as a society.
No, no...really, Veector...expound...and explain yourself...
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I just hope the dude does a complete 180 from what my expectations are for him. Dude is taking office today, and I STILL have no idea who he is. All I know is he gives pretty speeches...I feel that's really sad Derek. Obama has published TWO books mainly about who he is and what he wants politics to be like. If you don't know him from reading those, I don't know what will give you some peace of mind.
veector, um, I was more thinking his rhetoric in February - July as opposed to his rhetoric from August to November. Compare and contrast, and it is two different (completely different) candidates. Is Obama the guy who pandered to the far left in the primaries, or is he the guy who tried to seem moderate in the general election. His voting record tells me nothing, a collection of "present" votes doesn't pin a politician down (which is probably why he voted that way).
So, was he lying to the party faithful, or was he lying to the general population? I have no idea.
So, was he lying to the party faithful, or was he lying to the general population? I have no idea.
I can definitely understand your sentiments on this. However, quite honestly, I put it down to the election machine at work. I felt that the true candidate (McCain and Obama) could not be seen in the election. The election is about taking swings back and forth and endless repeated speeches. I don't feel they tell you anything. I liked and respected McCain before the Republican Electioneers got their hands on him. So I say that the best view of the candidate is what they say outside of all the rhetoric on the campaign trail and I think the real John McCain showed himself in the conciliation speech and the real Barack Obama can be found in his books if you don't feel the voting record tells you enough.