I would actually have to agree. The binding on my campaign setting for lack of a better term feels loose and the covers have a bit of a bulge to them.
The beta rules book just feels more solid. It will be interesting to see which holds up better over time. My guess is the campaign setting since it has the hard cover.
Since I haven't started a beta play test group I do use the campaign setting more right now (running both RotRL and CotCT with 3.5 rules).
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I was wondering if the bulge on the cover of the campaign setting was me doing something wrong in high humidity.
As for other differences, I generally like a non-glossy finish more than a glossy finish. Maybe that is a holdover from the ancient days, when the covers of my PHB and MM just got sort of pebbly, while all the semi-glossy to glossy covers became scratched or ripped and dull, and just looked terrible after awhile.
It makes me feel like I am paying for fancy-shmancy that everyone knows has no chance of lasting as opposed to just strong and serviceable, even if the cover art is not frameable and collectible.
Creative Director
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Getting good binding on books is pretty important to us. I can't say how relieved I am that there wasn't a deluge of complaints about bindings breaking or pages falling out of either the hardcover campaign setting OR the beta!
As for the binding on the hardcover... it might feel loose, but it's tough. When we got in our first copies. I did my best to break the binding. I pressed the book flat on a table (face up and face down). I tugged at the covers. I even folded the covers all the way back so the front cover and back cover touched, and it held up. High humidity might be a culprit for the bulgy covers... the books we have here don't display much of a bulge.
The final Pathfinder RPG is gonna be the biggest book we've published. That opens up a whole new slew of binding worries, of course, but we're gonna do our best to make sure that it holds up!
I don't own the CS (though I'm considering buying it just to help inform my own homebrew, as it looks pretty cool), but I'd love it if the next hard back you published had the polished and high res images you currently find on the Pathfinder modules and the Beta. The copy of the CS I saw had a very grainy quality to the cover, as if it had been blown up beyond the dpi/resolution of the picture. I'm not sure it isn't a problem with the picture that was chosen for the cover, as it looked kinda grainy in one of the Paizo add books I have lying around, too, but I'd love it if the final Pathfinder RPG hardback had a higher resolution picture. It'd look a bit more professional and therefore hopefully catch people's attention better. And, I'm kind of an art snob, considering my visual communications major.
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I own both products. I've been collecting RPG products for years now, and I have to disagree with the OP.
I definitely want the PRPG to be hardcover. The Beta rules binding is way too thin, way too easy to mark/fold (as a matter of fact, the copy I received through the mail had all the pages and covers already badly folded due to the way it was handled). I want the Pathfinder rulebook to be able to stand for years at my game table and on the shelf. Softcover rulebooks just do not survive that long unscathed, unless you never ever use the book.
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OK, my CS book does have a loose feel to it, and at first I expected it to fall apart any day. However, it has proven very durable and I do not have any concerns now.
For the Beta Rules... I was amazed at the quality of the binding recently. I made the mistake of leaving the book in the sun... in my bag that has plastic dividers in it. I sat the book in the bag so that the divider actually parted the book... and was in the sun. Dumb I know.
So the next week I went to pull out the book and it wouldn't come out. The glue had melted and attached the book to the divider! "Oh, great!" I thought. "That paperback book is so ruined." I fought with it and pulled and tugged and finally decided to go ahead and ruin the book to get it loose.
Book looks fine... no pages damaged! Opens and closes just fine and feels as durable as before.
So, for the books currently in print, and future ones that are bound the same ways, I have no worries anymore. If I get a bad one, I know it to be a fluke.
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The finished Pathfinder RPG hardcover binding won't be exactly like either of the other books—it's coming from a different printer. (For that matter, the Campaign Setting and the Beta each came from different printers as well.)
Hey, Vic, that is interesting? Do you guys use different printers normally for different types of products? And if so, is there more to the reason than cost? Just curious really.
I was wondering if the bulge on the cover of the campaign setting was me doing something wrong in high humidity.
No, I have the bulgy covers as well. The binding isn't nearly as good as my Shackled City hardcover, sadly.
I give mine a so-so rating as far as my game books go...
I've got a bulge, but it is sturdy.
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Chief Technical Officer
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Do you guys use different printers normally for different types of products? And if so, is there more to the reason than cost? Just curious really.
Generally, printers are optimized for one specific thing, and when you go outside those boundaries, other printers are better (and usually cheaper).
Our main printer is ideal for most 8.5"x11" books, so they do all of the Pathfinder Adventure Paths, Modules, Companions, and Chronicles books.
The Beta went to a printer who is better for softcovers with high page counts, and the finished RPG is going to a printer who's better for hardcovers with high page counts.
Planet Stories are done by a printer who is better set up for trade paperbacks.
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Why's that?
On the CS, I too have the bulgy covers. Actually, I've had two and they both had the bulgy covers (the binding broke on the first one and Paizo graciously replaced it - thanks again). Both the front and the back bow out slightly, but enough to make the book a little puffy. Also, and this may just be my perception, but the cardboard in the covers feels lower density than the cardboard in my WotC books, more like some of the old Fantasy Flight and other 3rd party stuff I've picked up over the years. Fine books, but just not quite as solid as my Players Handbook.
The Beta rules, on the other hand, just feels like the cover is more solidly part of the same book (totally subjective, non-technical description, I know).
I'm not suggesting that the Pathfinder RPG book be softcover, but I really do want it to feel solid and heavy, a tome that is going to see a lot of usage over the years and still look good.
Maybe a special leather cover for those who pre-ordered 18 months or more in advance ...
High humidity might be a culprit for the bulgy covers...
We thought this too, until mine started to visibly rise*, while my wife's copy is still as flat as, well, something that's very flat. They're stored in the same place in the same way. Some days the bulge is bigger than others - maybe it is tied to the moon phases or something?
Peace,
tfad
* This is a slight exaggeration. Slight.
My PFCS has the bulgy cover, too. Of course, since it travelled three weeks over the great pond to Germany, I didn't thought much about it, but now I am reliefed that my book isn't the only one. Otherwise it is fine, though, and I don't mind the bulge. But it is a little bit creepy how the book tries to flex its muscles and grap more space in the book shelf ...
By the way, did you think of a special edition bound in flexible goat skin semi-yapp style with red under gold edges, full leather linings and three ribbon markers ...?
*rubbing my hands in anticipation*
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I own both products. I've been collecting RPG products for years now, and I have to disagree with the OP.
I definitely want the PRPG to be hardcover. The Beta rules binding is way too thin, way too easy to mark/fold (as a matter of fact, the copy I received through the mail had all the pages and covers already badly folded due to the way it was handled). I want the Pathfinder rulebook to be able to stand for years at my game table and on the shelf. Softcover rulebooks just do not survive that long unscathed, unless you never ever use the book.
To make it short: I can not agree more to all you said!!! Thanks for taking the words out of my mouth. ;))