Bella Sara Charter Superscriber
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So, I'm looking on the wizards website at upcoming products and I come upon this description of The Shattered Gates of Slaughtergarde:
This adventure is designed for characters of levels 2–7 and includes a 64-page adventure book, a 64-page campaign book, a 16-page players’ book, an 8-page illustration booklet, and a double-sided battle map designed for use with official D&D Miniatures.
The little product icon says its softcover, but that description sounds like the contents of the boxed set of yore. Anyone know if this actually is a boxed set, if the books are not under separate cover, or if WotC is doing something wacky like releasing a boxed set w/o the box.
I hope not. Even though I like all the maps and goodies that come with them, and I get nostalgic about them, there are problems.
First, as I understand it the Boxed Set helped TSR tank, because they are cost prohibitive. They are not as cheap to make as say, a massive book (re: Ptolus).
Second, they don't hold up well. When I look at my RPG shelf, I see that they show wear pretty easily on the front, and the sides of the lids begin to bow outward over time. And it can be easy to lose a component.
And they are hard when you move, because boxing them means a pain in the ass to keep from them getting crushed.
So, I'm looking on the wizards website at upcoming products and I come upon this description of The Shattered Gates of Slaughtergarde:
This adventure is designed for characters of levels 2–7 and includes a 64-page adventure book, a 64-page campaign book, a 16-page players’ book, an 8-page illustration booklet, and a double-sided battle map designed for use with official D&D Miniatures.
The little product icon says its softcover, but that description sounds like the contents of the boxed set of yore. Anyone know if this actually is a boxed set, if the books are not under separate cover, or if WotC is doing something wacky like releasing a boxed set w/o the box.
Wow, that would be fantastic. I really miss the boxed sets. It was nice to be able to store your books, maps, and notes all together in a box. There has been a trend away from including maps with hardcover books these days. The Eberron campaign setting didn't include a map - you have to buy the DM screen to get one, for some bizarre reason.
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Bella Sara Charter Superscriber
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First, as I understand it the Boxed Set helped TSR tank, because they are cost prohibitive. They are not as cheap to make as say, a massive book (re: Ptolus).
That was my understanding as well, which is why I would be surprised if they were coming back. I just have trouble figuring out how else this product could be distributed.
Second, they don't hold up well. When I look at my RPG shelf, I see that they show wear pretty easily on the front, and the sides of the lids begin to bow outward over time. And it can be easy to lose a component.And they are hard when you move, because boxing them means a pain in the ass to keep from them getting crushed.
My trick is to put other books into the box during a move. That way they don't get crushed as much. They still take a lot of wear and tear though, no matter what.
I don't doubt that they will try a boxed set to see how it does. If they managed to sell enough at the price point they set to make a profit, they may try another one.
I don't think that this is an indication that they will go back to putting out FR or Eberron in boxed set format though. I think overall even if it is profitable they will limit it to a few mega adventures or maybe some "Campaign Option" type stuff, but few enough of these products that they won't loose their rear ends if they don't sell at all.
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I still have a bunch of old box sets (lots of Ravenloft, both Undermountains, and a bunch of the other FR stuff). Some of them have held up great. I usually make sure to keep them upright on a shelf, just like I do my books. That seems to help them stay together.
If WotC is doing some box sets, maybe they'll have more success if the don't go hog wild like TSR did. If they maybe produce one box set a year (or even every other year), and really load it up with a lot of good stuff, then they might just have some success with it.
It'll be interesting to see.
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I would be very happy to see the return of the boxed set, but in limited instances. TSR released several boxed sets (think of Ravenloft) when sourcebooks were a better option. On the other hand, one of my favorite adventures is The Night Below, mostly because of all the goodies that came in the box. I think that boxed sets are great for epic adventures, but a poor substitute for sourcebooks. That being said, if WOTC came out with a monster Greyhawk boxed set that contained 42 maps, 12 sourcebooks, and 18 adventures that cost $250.00, I would buy it in a heartbeat. I guess with some things, the format doesn't matter as much as the content.
I would be very happy to see the return of the boxed set, but in limited instances. TSR released several boxed sets (think of Ravenloft) when sourcebooks were a better option. On the other hand, one of my favorite adventures is The Night Below, mostly because of all the goodies that came in the box. I think that boxed sets are great for epic adventures, but a poor substitute for sourcebooks. That being said, if WOTC came out with a monster Greyhawk boxed set that contained 42 maps, 12 sourcebooks, and 18 adventures that cost $250.00, I would buy it in a heartbeat. I guess with some things, the format doesn't matter as much as the content.
You wouldn't be the only one...I'd even go for $99.99 Gray-Light Special.
This is for those who have(or will) pointe out Ravenloft as an example of hogwild boxed set production.
As a RL-lover, I feel compelled to defend my setting, and I will mention that the ones they made, totalled 6: the Black Box and Red Box settings, Grim harvest, Masque of the Read Death, one adventure, and Forbidden lore. I may be leaving one or two out that I don't have.
Right now, looking at my game shelf, I see 8 FR boxed sets (Only one is for the Campaign itself- the others are Ruins of Zhentil, Spellbound, Kara-tur, Horde, etc) and I don't have near to all of them. For Dark Sun, again just on my shelf, I see 4, not including the mini-boxes the adventures came in; and Birthright, with a shorter lifetime than RL, I see 4.
The point? Ravenloft wasn't that hogwild, or that much of the problem. They went wild EVERYWHERE, made Spellfire, and Dragon Dice, etc.
Either way, it was too many Boxes. But it was a company wide problem.
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Bella Sara Charter Superscriber
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Thanks Mike. That makes sense - I just hadn't seen that format before and it looked a lot like the contents of a boxed set.
As a RL-lover, I feel compelled to defend my setting, and I will mention that the ones they made, totalled 6: the Black Box and Red Box settings, Grim harvest, Masque of the Read Death, one adventure, and Forbidden lore. I may be leaving one or two out that I don't have.
Even an RL hater like me has to admit that the boxed sets infected nearly all campaign settings. Planescape had five that I can think of, and those were very much the "core" books (the campaign setting, planes of law, planes of chaos, planes in conflict and the blood war).
It's hilarious in retrospect that boxed sets were unprofitable and yet TSR released a vast number of products in that format. God bless the latest generation running the hobby - they appear to possess both creativity and business sense.
As a RL-lover, I feel compelled to defend my setting, and I will mention that the ones they made, totalled 6: the Black Box and Red Box settings, Grim harvest, Masque of the Read Death, one adventure, and Forbidden lore. I may be leaving one or two out that I don't have.
You missed "A Light in the Belfry," "Castles Forlorn," "Bleak House" and "The Nightmare Lands," bringing the total to 9. But I agree with you, excess boxed set production wasn't just a RL thing (and I happen to love boxed sets... so bring 'em on!).
Al-Qadim had a slew of them too - including those "ultra-thin" box sets. Others on my shelf include a few Planescape boxes (nice quality boxes!), undermountain(s), Dragon Mountain, Greyhawk Wars, Ruins of Myth Drannor, and Menzoberranzan. Then there are some real weird ones, like Hollow World, Gamma Knights, and Legend of Spelljammer. Don't ask me how I got those...
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I would love for the box set to come back, but much as everyone here has said not in mass. What I would like to see is an adventure for several levels, and maybe toss in afew mini's for the NPC's and monsters. Put in a playable card for the mini and you have cross sold the product to the D&D mini's only crowd(I know sevral who only got the Basic Box set for the mini's). I would be willing to pay $20-$30 for a nice multi level adventure with mini's for the big combat. These need to be kept to one or two per year. I feel Wizards has already gone too far with some of the books (read complete X, Races of X) so the chances of them making one or two box sets a year that sell well may be slim and none. They tend to publish a good seller to death and I feel they would do the same with box sets.