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Just be careful it is very expensive to replace a shaman familiar and without it, you will lose the ability to prepare new spells. Don't deliver touch spell into threatened areas if you can avoid it.

The protector is good not only because it allows you to take more damage from life link and shield other but it also gives you a second target of you channels make them much more effective as well.

My original idea in using the Protector archetype went along with these thoughts too - I forgot it was actually so expensive to replace a familiar, but I do like the idea of my familiar having Fast Healing 1. I just worry because amongst other things, the familiar loses Improved Evasion with the Protector archetype (I am guessing because it would be sitting on me most of the time, probably harder to dodge). I will discuss the more versatile familiar option, such as flying animals delivering touch spells, and the life-sharing Protector option with my DM on game night.

I will check with her regarding Hex Vulnerability as well but that one may be a harder pull. It would be amazing with Healing Hex for sure, though!

And I hear you regarding Ant Haul, PCScipio. I started making my character in Hero Lab since I was making it on my own and wanted to make sure I got the numbers/abilities right. Even with barely any gear and the shield/armor/sickle, my Shaman is almost beyond Medium Load.. yikes.

It's funny, I didn't even really consider using a flying familiar if I go the route of having my familiar deliver touch spells for me. I'll definitely have to keep that in mind also! It sounds very useful if my Shaman ends up using Move actions to Chant during the round.

One note on Familiar, Protector is nice for sharing damage, but might want to also look into Valet, for ease of delivering touch heals. For survival Life has FH/1 as you are already using, and for your Wandering Hex you could take Stone to give it DR also.

Healing Hex is handy with a bigger group, the 1/day per group member adds up fast.

Haste is handy and you can get it with Lore, also at L9 can grab Blessing of Fervor (off the Cleric list, using Favored Class Bonus), has a Haste like bonus and is a nice all around group buff.

Another option, since you are going for Mainly Healing (with channels) the Witch Doctor Archetype, that gives a Second Channeling Pool. Smaller Pool. but still 5 more channels/day (3+cha 1d6)

Thank you for the reply! I think the DM would be okay with me switching to the more useful familiar archetype after the first session. I went with Protector originally to help offset Lifelink damage but I'm not sure how bad it will actually be yet (I guess it depends on how often party members get hit). I can see why the Valet archetype would be good with so many healing spells being Touch range.

It sounds like I should try grabbing Haste and Healing Hex. If I have Healing Hex, would it still be worth keeping 2x CLW and 2x CMW? Without Spontaneous casting for Cure spells, I'm worried about going into a fight without a heal ready besides a backup Channel.

Witch Doctor (and Speaker for the Past) looked really intriguing - honestly it seems like a better healer for this group, but I decided on Life-Restoration purely because it seems so different from my previous Cleric. If not for my only other character being a Cleric, I probably would have gone Witch Doctor.

Hello!

TLDR: I am joining a group that has no real main support; will my idea for the level 4 Life (Restoration) Shaman work alright, or are there obvious things I should correct?

I am a somewhat new player who hasn't played in months; before my group stalled out, I played a Reach Cleric to level 4 (with lots of help from the forum in creating it).

I am joining a group looking for a healer - I know full-time healer is not normally needed in Pathfinder, but I enjoy playing support and want to help. They are playing Strange Aeons and I have heard that campaign can be brutal. The Players Guide even recommended having a Cleric or similar. I am replacing their level 4 NPC Cleric.
**Mild Campaign Spoiler* Please no spoilers for the campaign but they did say they just escaped from the starting asylum, if that helps. **

I am trying to prepare as much as I can since I will not see the DM until game night next week. This group does not focus on min/max'ing so I am okay if my character isn't optimal as long as it isn't helpless.. I am open to helpful suggestions! I plan to stay pure Shaman to not overwhelm myself.

Other party members: Melee fighter, Monk/Oracle, Witch (DPS, not sure of type), Rogue (I believe melee oriented but not positive)

My dice rolls: 9, 11, 12, 13, 15, 16
I went with middle aged (-1 physical, +1 mental) to help round my stats better. I went Human, and the +2 racial trait went into Wisdom.

My main concerns include:

I did end up thinking about the situations that will come up when an enemy closes to inside of my weapon's reach. And then I probably spent the last hour or so of my work day reading previous discussions about using a spiked gauntlet or spiked armor while wielding a reach weapon ;)

Just for clarification's sake, and hopefully I'm not re-opening a can of worms (the main post I read was from 2009), I would still be able to make Attack of Opportunities with my reach weapon against enemies moving out of a square my reach weapon threatens. On my turn, if I don't want to 5-foot step but I do have an enemy adjacent to me, I can take a free action to take a hand off my reach weapon in order to use something like a spiked gauntlet or spiked armor to attack them. But, if I am holding my reach weapon and the adjacent enemy does something such as cast a spell on their turn, I cannot use my spiked gauntlet/armor for the Attack of Opportunity since I am holding the reach weapon with both hands. Does that sound right? The post was from so long ago I am not sure if it's all outdated by now.

The good thing is that in the campaign I'm currently running with this group, I am using a reach Cleric (just level 2) so I am mostly familiar with the reach rules, except my Cleric normally tries to acrobatics away from enemies that get close. A secondary weapon would definitely be a new thing to remember but the player who will be DM'ing the new campaign is already in the habit of going "That guy just moved, Attack of Opportunity?" whenever someone near me moves.

Using trips and Combat Maneuvers could be really useful. I had read before that it can be hard to keep up with enemy CMD in later levels, or very feat intensive to invest in. I've never tried to plan that path out though. Does it usually remain a good option throughout a campaign? I know obviously it may not work well against a "boss" type of encounter or something with multiple legs, but it seems like against the typical encounter it could do a lot to protect the backline which is definitely what I am looking for.

I think right now I am mainly leaning towards a Human (or Half Orc), more offensive Paladin build. I am actually really interested in a small-sized Paladin with the Divine Mount so I'm hoping to try that in a later campaign, possibly when I'm not the only melee. I think I may try out something with a shield when more books are allowed; they just have so many options.

The responses have really helped me feel better about the choice, thank you very much! Since my current campaign is all melee, I kept imagining in the upcoming campaign that my character would roll poorly on an Attack of Opportunity and suddenly all of the enemies decide to swoop past me and murder the backline. I know a Cleric, Sorcerer, and Ranger are not helpless but I don't want to fail them ;)

I will definitely give the more offensive Paladin build a try. Taking Combat Reflexes + the reach weapon makes a lot of sense for trying to grab as much enemy attention as I can, or hopefully soften them up for the ranged to finish them off. Fey Foundling seems like it's acceptable to the DM so I would like to give it a try. If I get clobbered a lot, I will probably snag Toughness at level 3 as well if the healing is strained.

I'm not knocking the Paladin but bear in mind the restrictions of playing Lawful Good in a party that may not be can be difficult. I have seen so many complaints of people playing this class when no one else plays even remotely good even if they have one written on their character sheet.

I have to admit it is a little intimidating to remember to play LG. I don't think the DM would knock me if I accidentally do something non-LG as long as it isn't too severe since I'm new, but I do want to try and play it well (or even go the "atonement" route if I do end up straying from LG). Thankfully the other party members have confirmed they are not going to have Evil alignment, and one actually mentioned they are excited for me to play a Paladin since they haven't had much experience RPing with one in the group before. Should be fun =)

Thanks again for the help! The community has been amazing so far.

Hello

TL;DR first: Using mostly Core Rulebook only, should I create a "tank" type of melee character to protect the other 3 PCs (all ranged), or just go as damage-focused melee? And do my 2 Paladin build attempts below make any sense for either?

I am a very new player with about 20 hours of Pathfinder so far. I received a lot of great assistance in my previous thread here and was hoping to receive some more advice. I have been enjoying my Reach Cleric from the previous post, and another player in the group wants to start DM'ing; the current DM and that player will take turns about every chapter or so in their respective APs.

Here is what I know for the new campaign I will be playing in:

• AP: Curse of the Crimson Throne (no story spoilers, please!)
  
• 4 PCs, 1 DM will be playing. This is the DM's first time running a game
  
• Two veteran players are playing: "Ranged Cleric" and "Ranged Ranger" (no further details)
  
• Another new player will be playing: Ranged Sorcerer (Draconic bloodline)
  
• I *prefer* non-Fighter only because I want to see what all the classes are like, but I have no problem rolling Fighter if it makes the most sense (we have a Fighter in the current campaign)
  
• *Originally set up to be Core Rulebook only, but the DM has said I can pick something out of Core if it's required for my character*
  --Basically I think I'm okay taking a few Feats (eg Raging Vitality, Fey Foundling, Antagonize, etc), Class Abilities, maybe a Race.. probably not an Archetype and nothing like Traits since no one else has them outside of the Crimson Throne Player's Guide
  
• We rolled for stats, and my rolls came to be 11 12 13 14 16 17. I feel lucky getting those numbers but it feels sort of awkward trying to optimize around?

I know "tank" does not apply to Pathfinder as it does to an MMO, but what I am hoping for is a melee-focused character who can help deal damage but has a "sticky" quality in that I make it difficult for enemies to get past me once I engage them. Having a good defense via AC, high HP, self-healing, etc would be beneficial. I know I can't control the entire enemy line but I want to make myself the first road block. I am hoping for support/control from the backline.

Monk seems like it would require too much from outside of Core (ie Styles). As fun as it sounds, I may save the experience for when I am in a more open campaign unless it turns out they are actually viable. I'm sure I could snag Raging Vitality for a Barbarian, but I see a lot of posts referencing Invulnerable and Totem builds outside of Core. I'm not writing off a mostly-Core Barbarian, but could it work for what I want?

As I read more about the Paladin, they seem to make the most sense without needing to stray too far from Core (and probably Fighter too). Having decent AC with a shield option and self-healing fits most of what I need. Can they also play a "sticky" role in keeping some enemies on me?

If I go the Paladin route, should I absolutely try to fit the Fey Foundling Feat into my build for survive-ability? It seems very strong for what I intend to do, but with at least 2 others who can possibly throw a healing spell on me when needed, I didn't know if it was as imperative.

My main worry point is how defensive I should be having the frontline to myself? Will I typically get overrun, or will I be stuck playing catch-up as I try to peel enemies off the backline? I made attempts at a couple of builds below. I put Levels 1 and 3 to help compare between the two, since Level 3 is when a number of defensive abilities come online for the Paladin.

Sorry for the gigantic post. I appreciate any response or feedback, and let me know if there are more details I can try to provide.

Thank you!

Thank you everyone for the explanations on armor (AC/ACP/Max Dex/etc) and on ranged attacks. They were able to help me understand it all much more clearly.

I spent pretty much all night trying to plan out a character. All of the posts have been extremely helpful! I know since this is a Core only campaign it limits a lot of the ideas people may have so I appreciate all the time everyone's taken to help out.

I kept waffling pretty much all day yesterday in trying to decide to go for a "Reach Cleric" with build following my main ideas above, or an "Archer Cleric" where I would probably go Half-Elf and swap for a Bow proficiency and then build from there.

In the end I've decided on Reach Cleric since it seemed to fall more in line with my original idea, plus I think the Reach Cleric may be a little easier to fit into the Core rules. I am hoping by level 6 I can convince the GM to let me branch out to Ultimate Magic for even more feats to take. Once we start a new campaign (or expand on this one possibly) I may even revisit the idea of Archer Cleric and a Bard since they sounds like a lot of fun.

If you want to go a bit more in-depth, you could read this guide. I do suggest the main page and possibly the "cleric roles" page, but don't feel you need to read the whole guide to play a cleric.

It's funny, I've had this guide up along with 3 or 4 others in my browser for the past week or so. They have been extremely helpful; it was actually the guide you linked that made me really explore the idea of going Archer Cleric in the first place.

I plan to fiddle with the Ability scores a bit more to make sure they are good for a Reach Cleric who mainly supports the party and does some healing out of combat, and figure out exactly what feats would be more beneficial at lvl 1. Reach Clerics have a few feat choices that sound great at lvl 1, but then Spell Focus: Conjuration + Augmented Summoning sound fun to get also. I'm trying to picture 3 melee and then me standing right behind them and what feats would help most at early levels. The group may end up with an NPC as well (hopefully a caster I can stand between) since the GM needed more character sheets.

Thank you for all the awesome help, I feel much more comfortable now with the whole process.

Wow, I'm thankful for the advice! It was definitely harder making that second build since I didn't know how everything worked together so I'm glad I won't accidentally pick it and Empower Spell for first level now.

Also, thank you for the reminder that Charisma contributes to Channel Energy; flipping back and forth between Domains/Skills/Feats/Spells, I had completely forgotten I will still have that to use also.

I am really thinking of going with that first Summoner build I listed above, since it goes with how I wanted to play and nobody has said it doesn't make sense yet ;) I just realized that those should be listed as "Role 1: Summoner-focused" and "Role 2: Caster/Support," whoops, sorry for the confusion.

For starting gear, I did see Clerics are proficient in Light/Medium Armor and Shields. Getting a Buckler for the AC and still having a free hand made sense to me. I did read that higher levels of armor cause higher -AC penalties, which mainly affected Dex Skills from what I can tell. Is there any benefit for going with a Light starting armor such as Studded Leather and a low -AC penalty, or based on Skills a Cleric typically uses, is less -AC penalty not as valuable as a straight higher AC?

I am also still a little clueless with ranged weapons, since Abilities in a game like WoW work differently. If I were to get a bow of some kind to use during combat when I don't want to use spells, would my attack roll and damage still be based on Strength? Or would I want better Dexterity? And would a -AC penalty affect ranged weapons?

Based on the answer, I know I will probably need to re-work my Ability scores a bit, possibly placing my +2 Human Attribute bonus into Dex for the initiative (or Str if ranged weapons use Str possibly?) and leaving Wis at 17 until I get nearer higher level spells.

Thank you again for all the great assistance, I really appreciate it! We are hoping to finalize our character sheets today.

I definitely did need to get my head thinking differently from WoW/Overwatch in the sense of how the roles work together compared to Pathfinder. I really like the dynamic from what I've read in Pathfinder though; seems to give everyone versatility for their role or task.

Sorry for the delayed response, my friend and I tried to plan out a few level 1 characters and it was way more involved than we thought. Took us forever...

My friend is planning to stay Druid with the idea to eventually being more melee/Wildshape focused (we understand the Druid will still have plenty of good Druid spells they will still use, they just hope to be more melee during combat).

I still haven't been told any campaign details, but one of the experienced players is going to be a Dwarven Fighter and wants to try specializing with Shield to be our tank, and the other experienced player says they are wanting to try a Rogue since they have usually been a healer in other campaigns.

This makes the group seem very melee heavy. When I made my character, I focused more on expecting to be at range in order to diversify our skills a little. Does that make sense, or is it not needed? I am sure four melee characters would work, but when I picture encounters on maps with multiple enemies and the four PCs all going melee it seems like it might hurt in some ways.

If my Cleric will be at range more often, I had thought of two play styles and wanted to post them here. Do they make sense, or even if they work are they very sub-optimal? Without having played, I am trying to account for different situations in the game but I am probably missing many obvious things.

We did our ability rolls for our characters (not point buy system), and I have this to work with:
11 12 14 14 15 17

I tried my hand at making two different Clerics. Please feel free to let me know if some things make sense and if some don't, and what you might prefer to pick in certain places. My understanding is still very limited so I will try to learn from any input.

I took higher Dex over Con because if summons have a 1 Round casting time then I thought a better initiative would be more advantageous.

I went with Chaotic Good since I do not have access to Sacred Summons per we are Core rulebook only, and I know LG greatly benefits from that feat.

I apologize for the monkey-wrench, but after knowing that 3 out of the 4 PCs plan to be melee, would Bard fit the idea of Ranged Support better than making Cleric take the job? The posts discussing Bard here have been very informative, but my own personality (quiet and introverted) seems to go against how a Bard should be played so I feel like I wouldn't do a great job. But, keeping the Cleric at ranged almost feels like I may be wasting part of the class qualities? I'm not sure what the consensus is on that.

But thank you again for all the responses! I now realize how involved making a character can be, and we haven't even started playing yet. But the options make it really exciting and I'm already looking forward to playing more advanced rules once the GM is comfortable.

Unfortunately no details were given about the campaign. If I find out I will be sure to post it since it seems like it would help. Since a few of us are brand new and we are starting at level 1, I don't know if that makes it likelier that it is a homebrew campaign and not something more intense?

There was no budging on anything beyond core classes/rules at this time as well, though there's still a possibility of it opening up later. I'm honestly not sure if there is a set story arc in mind already and the plan is to have these characters stop at the end or not.

I was originally leaning more towards either Paladin or Cleric (again, core classes only). After these comments, I started to swing towards either Cleric or Bard.

I think I may go Cleric since it seems a safe pick for filling in whatever niche I end up in, and I'll have the GM help me finalize the details with the caveat I not be solely focused on healing. Picking from Domains sounds really interesting, and I honestly had no idea they were so flexible in the roles they could play (such as melee support or summoner) - again, completely clueless here!

Thanks again, it's refreshing to see such an awesome community and my friend and I are excited to get into the game.

Thanks for all the great responses so far, they have helped clear up a lot for me and it's nice to have all those questions answered. My friend and I really are clueless; I've bought the core rulebook and researched roles but haven't had the chance to really read through the game rules so far (the experienced players were also going to help once we started playing).

It's a change for me mentally too since in other games (MMOs mainly) I am used to using heal spells constantly throughout the fight and it quickly became apparent that that wouldn't work in a pen & paper. I like the idea of having healing spells but actually being more useful in a tank or damage role when healing isn't needed, and it sounds like that would probably be viable in our group of players based on the responses.

To be safe, I think I'll try to see if I can figure out a character that does mostly damage or tank with backup heals, and another character that may be a better healer than the first but will still be able to backup as meaningful damage or buff/debuffing in a fight. Then I can show both to the GM and see what they think would work better in the group dynamic.

Out of the Core classes, I think I am leaning more towards Paladin or Cleric, since Druid is taken and I am interested in seeing how the other two classes work (and I think I'd make a bad Bard). There are so many Cleric domains that I would need to see if one fits either mold, and with Paladin I'm not sure if I'd be good at remembering to play as LG. I'm sure I'll get it figured out ;)

Thanks again! And also thank you Louise Bishop, I am at work but I have that guide you posted loaded on my tablet to check out during break.

Hello! Sorry for the long post, I have a lot of questions/observations after trying to research this topic.

My friend and I have never played a pen&paper RPG before and are going to be joining a new campaign with a group that has some experience (4 players total including my friend and myself, 1 GM with no PC). I have interest in helping heal the party because when I play other games that is the role I tend to gravitate towards.

The GM has some experience running a campaign previously but it was cut short; as a result, they are wanting to stick with just core rules at this time (core classes, races, rules, etc). They prefer nothing too advanced at the start, so no multi-classing, though it may be allowed later on after they are more comfortable with running the game.

After doing some research, most comments tend to say there is no need for a dedicated healer in a party (though it's welcome if there is one). Many posts comment that in-combat healing tends to be reserved for avoiding deaths, and much of the player healing is done to stabilize outside of combat, via spells or wands. As a result, players can choose to focus on a healing character if that is what they want, or they can focus on doing more damage/buffing/tanking and the off-heals they bring will be enough in most situations.

Is that still a relevant way of thinking and approaching the healing role for the party? Are wands very common in the game, or will they possibly be impossible to get depending on what the GM wants? Can other classes with UMD and wands really heal in a competent way? When my friends decided we would start a campaign, I expressed interest in possibly being the party healer - would it be dangerous to the party if I rely on "off-heals" if they are expecting me to be primarily a healer? My friends have mentioned a few times that in their past campaigns, just an off-healer was not enough, and given hints that a Cleric as a dedicated healer is extremely powerful. Should I be worried that that may indicate their campaigns tend to throw lots of damage at PCs and roll a build with that in mind?

At this point, I am interested in a non-dedicated/off-healer role to try it out, but I'll take "healbot" if it's needed for the party (I already do similar in MMORPGs). My other non-experienced friend is already decided on Druid. I've read about Oradins but with no multi-classing/core classes-only currently, I'm not sure if it's possible. Would a pure Paladin who does either tanking or damage dealing still be adequate at healing? I've seen mention of Hospitaler Paladins, are they technically considered "core?" I've also seen some builds with support Clerics focusing on Archery which could be fun too.

*EDIT*I should mention the other two players (who have experience with RPGs) have not decided on a class yet but have said they will fill-in based on what my friend and I roll.

Sorry for the long post. I've seen lots of helpful topics already on the forums, but wanted to ask about my situation specifically since it will be core rules/core classes only for now.

Thank you for any responses!