goblin.hero's page

goblin.hero wrote:

The rules suggest that motion can be detected through senses other than vision.

For example, if a Hidden Invisible Rogue tries to Sneak away from a monster and he fails, he does not become Undetected. That is, the creature that the Rogue tried to Sneak away from was able to track the Rogue's movement from one square to another square. The Rogue remains Hidden because he cannot be seen, but the monster knows which square that the Rogue moved to because the Rogue failed his Sneak check. Maybe he stepped on a branch, and the monster heard where that sound was coming from. Maybe the Rogue farted as they tried to Sneak, and they can smell them. Maybe the monster felt the wind as the Rogue passed by. However they sensed it, the monster was able to detect where the Rogue moved to using a sense other than vision, and they didn't need a special sense to do this. It is similarly plausible that we can sense motion while we are inside another creature even though we cannot see the creature moving. As I mentioned previously, even babies can sense motion while they are inside their mothers.

This isn't Stealth rules that state a specific condition from a specific result, so using it as a basis for general combat awareness isn't palatable in the slightest. (The Stealth rules already come with their own set of unusual baggage, don't need to add more to it.) Even then, those specific conditions still follow the general rules, meaning the Rogue would still become Visible once they no longer benefit from Cover or Concealment for a given creature unless they possess an ability like Legendary Sneak, AKA Hide in Plain Sight, so the idea that the Rogue remains Hidden after a successful check is only true if the Rogue's new position makes them Covered or Concealed to the enemy. And once a creature moves to clearly see the Rogue, that condition goes away.

I guess you missed the part where I said that the Rogue was Hidden because he was Invisible (this can happen when any creature observing the Rogue is watching while he becomes Invisible due to some magical effect).

It would certainly be amusing for a Rogue to try to Stealth while inside the creature, but I would argue that without a feat like Foil Senses,...

Not sure what you are saying here as I did not say that the Rogue was trying to Sneak out of the creature that swallowed it whole.

The rules suggest that motion can be detected through senses other than vision.

For example, if a Hidden Invisible Rogue tries to Sneak away from a monster and he fails, he does not become Undetected. That is, the creature that the Rogue tried to Sneak away from was able to track the Rogue's movement from one square to another square. The Rogue remains Hidden because he cannot be seen, but the monster knows which square that the Rogue moved to because the Rogue failed his Sneak check. Maybe he stepped on a branch, and the monster heard where that sound was coming from. Maybe the Rogue farted as they tried to Sneak, and they can smell them. Maybe the monster felt the wind as the Rogue passed by. However they sensed it, the monster was able to detect where the Rogue moved to using a sense other than vision, and they didn't need a special sense to do this. It is similarly plausible that we can sense motion while we are inside another creature even though we cannot see the creature moving. As I mentioned previously, even babies can sense motion while they are inside their mothers.

There is nothing in the rules as written that say that a character cannot perceive a creature that swallowed it whole.

Swallowed whole says:

"The monster can’t attack creatures it has swallowed.

A swallowed creature is grabbed, is slowed 1, and has to hold its breath or start suffocating. The swallowed creature takes the listed amount of damage when first swallowed and at the end of each of its turns while it’s swallowed. If the victim Escapes this ability’s grabbed condition, it exits through the monster’s mouth. This frees any other creature grabbed in the monster’s mouth or jaws. A swallowed creature can attack the monster that has swallowed it, but only with unarmed attacks or with weapons of light Bulk or less. The engulfing creature is flat-footed against the attack."

The rules here are explicitly stating that the monster cannot attack the swallowed creature, but the swallowed creature can attack the monster that swallowed it. There is no mention of Blindness, a Perception check, or any other impediment on the swallowed creature's ability to react to movement or make an attack on the monster while Swallowed Whole. In fact, the rules state that the monster is flat-footed to any attack by the swallowed creature. This could be because the swallowed creature is currently located right next to sensitive areas of the creature's body and, as such, is currently able to attack those areas more easily. As has already been pointed out in this thread, the swallowed creature's perception of the monster's motion would likely not be based on visual perception of a movement in the more conventional sense. It would likely be based on feeling that the creature that swallowed it was moving body parts and that their position in space was changing (e.g., several real life studies have affirmed that at a certain point in development, babies in the womb can react to music, the sound of their mother's voice, motion, etc.). At that moment in time, when the fighter first became aware that the creature's body parts were shifting around him and that his own position in space was also shifting, I could imagine that the fighter could take an Attack of Opportunity against a sensitive body part (e.g., baby kicks Mom's kidneys as she moves from a standing to a sitting position). This is why I believe that allowing the AoO in this situation would be consistent with both the rules as written and the spirit of Attack of Opportunity.