cyansylph's page

So in other words "yeah but that's not MEANT to affect this".

Cyan, I agree completely, however in cases where RAW is being used often the only thing anyone will listen to is more RAW.

Sleet, you are using RAW to argue something that is obviously not intended, do not turn around and say that other bits of the raw don't count because it doesn't suit you. It's either RAW or RAI, you don't get to switch half way through.

And, developers frequently add catch all terms to things to stop later add-ons breaking things, thus why bonuses of the same types don't normally stack and other handy rules.

I just hit second level alchemist - which is when I would need to decide to be a ragechemist or not. While I really like the concept (who doesn't want to rp the hulk?), I don't even think I am going to bother with it as the developers intent is unclear to me at this point.

Take a deep breath and a step back. Rather than nitpick words and numbers and untyped vs typed bonuses, just think of the nature of the archtype.

A Ragechemist focuses his studies and practices in evoking more pure strength and power out of his Strength enhancing mutagens. He does this even to the point where such mutagens can cause him to further weaken his mental faculties when under its effects. When under its effects and harmed or under duress, he can quickly lose all self control until finally falling comatose.

I find it hard to believe that the +6 untyped bonus is intentional - the source is still the alchemical concoction and as such would still be a +6 alchemical bonus to strength. I do not think it is a far stretch to see the mutagens of a Ragechemist providing 2 more strength than those of a normal alchemist. Anytime, a mutagen is used that enhances strength, increase the strength bonus by 2. At level 6 and higher, include a +4 natural armor bonus (No natural armor bonuses stacks so this just applies instead of the +2 from a normal mutagen), but also apply the increased penalties. At levels 10 and higher, also include the +2Con(Morale) bonus and the increased penalties.

This leaves a Ragechemist with all his strength enhancing mutagens just a little bit stronger than those of a regular alchemist. He also learns to master resiliency (natural armor) faster than his colleagues, and can even develop a hardier constitution when imbibing such mutagens. The price he pays for these abilities is great. He has ignored some of the more important applications of how to use poison expected of a typical alchemist. He can be a terrifying picture of physical prowess when consuming such a mutagen, but inside he is just a shattered fearful little man who has traded his love of reason for the primal fury of anger.

The wording is confusing when you combine the concept of the 'rage mutagen' with that of the greater and grand mutagens, and there are several possible sets of numbers one could end up at.

Luckily, this can all be posed to the developers as a fairly straight forward question. Hopefully we can get some feedback as I have seen this question appear and disappear several times and am currently playing a Ragechemist myself.

What are the possible Mutagens and/or Rage Mutagens a level 12 Ragechemist possessing the Greater Mutagen discovery can make and what are their total effects?

What are the possible Mutagens and/or Rage Mutagens a level 16 Ragechemist possessing the Greater and Grand Mutagen discoveries can make and what are their total effects?

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For what it is worth, my understanding of RAW would let a level 12 Ragechemist make a greater rage mutagen providing...

+6STR(alch), +6DEX(alch), +2CON(morale), +4NatA,-2INT,-2WIS. Failing the will save from damage in a round is -4WillSaves, -4INT, -1DEX. The base mutagen before the rage modifer would have been +6DEX,+4STR,-2WIS,-2INT

or...

a greater rage mutagen providing +6STR(alch), +6CON(alch), +2CON(morale), +4NatA,-2WIS,-2CHA. Failing the will save from damage in a round is -4WillSaves, -4INT, -1DEX. The base mutagen before the rage modifer would have been +6CON,+4STR,-2WIS,-2CHA

or...

a standard greater mutagen providing either a +6CON/DEX(alch) and +4DEX/CON(alch) with the normal -2 to associated scores. Unaffected by rage mutagen changes as the mutagen does not affect the alchemist's strength.

or... this one takes a RAI approach.

A greater rage mutagen as described above that provides +8STR(alch) and +4DEX/CON(Alch), +2CON(morale), +4NatA, -2INT, -2WIS/CHA. Failing the will save from damage in a round is -4WillSaves, -4INT, -1DEX. The base mutagen before the rage modifer would have been +6STR,+4DEX/CON,-2INT,-2WIS/CHA.

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My RAI take is that any mutagen affecting the alchemist's STR is a Rage mutagen and has its +#STR(alch) replaced with an alchemical bonus to strength 2 points higher; the alchemist also receives the penalties associated with a rage mutagen. If the alchemist is level 6 or higher, or 10 and higher, further apply the changes from Sturdy Rage, and Lumbering Rage as appropriate.

Which means that mithral plate will still fatigue you if you don't have endurance.

Breastplates are Medium, a mithral breasplate would be treated as light for all purposes aside from proficiency. When you sleep in it, it is treated as light. You awake bright and refreshed, as though you had slept in some leather armor or a chain shirt.

Mithral full plate or half-plate or field plate would be treated as medium for sleep and fatigue you without endurance.

I am unsure what "mithral plate" is? A dinner plate perhaps, or possibly a serving platter? Seems such a thing would make for poor armor.

Just go Human and pick up the alternative racial trait Heart of the Fields. You get a .5 per character level bonus to a craft or profession skill and more importantly you can ignore one fatigue or exhaust effect per day. Sleep in field plate, wake up refreshed.

I have scoured the internet and not found a good site where people gather to organize VT (virtual tabletop) games. I am relatively new to tabletop but have been bit hard by the Pathfinder bug.

Scheduling a game RL has been tough lately; and play by post is great but can be frustrating when one of the players is only managing a post every few days.

If anyone has any interest in organizing a VT game or can point me to where these are organized, could you please share?