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Should players be able purchase specific item abilities?

Such as the rhino hide charge bonus of -1 ACP + 2d6 on the charge. If yes continue, if no why?

So the item is 5165g so 165g is armor and mw. 4000 is the +2. My thought is that he gather bonus would be a +1000 or a +1 bonus.

Thoughts?

After thinking about it last night, I have decided that it would be wise to attempt to join one of the last few standing kingdoms that aren't corrupt/evil/ignorant/the dm. Build my town from their, or create an alliance. The more and more I begin to work on mapping and how I am going to create the town the more the political aspect comes into my head.

TL DR:Bah I need to talk to the DM.

Sorry guys! I've been away doing stuffs all day and just got time to check the forums. To answer a few questions that have been asked and more information.

Leadership score is a 24. 14th level, Charisma 26 (Backstory to follow why it's so damn high) Right there is a 22, also add in two more points from leadership bonuses.

The idea behind this town. My character wants to build a town/civilization because so far it seems many people places are evil terrible and bad. The city that we've been working out of travels in and out of the plane based on the lunar cycle. In this town it is all weretigers. I've had it up to my neck with how flustered I get with the people of this city. I've had a personal argument with their god, and I actually was banished from Iomedae's service. The weretigers and their religion have done nothing but piss me off for the most part. Though, they do give us a pretty coin for our world magic which has been nice.

Backstory backstory, I'm going to try and be brief with this explanation without explaining this entire campaign. Started out as a paladin, as a paladin I began to gain much grace in Iomedae's eye due to our great mission to save the world without out any help but our 5 man groups help. I began to truly impress her and she began to grant me special powers and equipment. Our mission was to stop the summoning of an elder evil god.

We had to stop the baddies from corrupting an angel, get book of doom 1, get book of doom 2, and a unicorn horn. (I forgot the names of these books.) We found book 1 without knowing what the hell was going on. We stumbled upon this weretiger city. We handed over the book after receiving an explanation.

(At this point I didn't want to hand over the book after I found out it summoned the evil god of doom. I didn't trust these people. But the group handed it over after I argued with my first encounter with Iomedae AKA the DM advancing the plot wagon.)

We sat around in this city doing stuffs, nothing big. We went and saved an angel, I died. I met Iomedae and became a half celestial and other super stuffs. Came back to life. We went and got book #2 went back to give them the book to destroy it. We came back with the second book of doom and it was the last single entity needed to summon a god of doom. I argued for about an hour trying to convince the group to not give them the book. Then I argued with their god. Pretty much the DM demanding the book. Then Iomedae cast me away from her powers. I came back with the decision to either be a cleric or paladin. I decided to be a cleric. Now being fed up with Iomedae, these weretigers, and their god. I want to build my own town and try not to deal with those people ever again.

I want to build a town that isn't evil and doomed to die where people live in dung pits. I want a town that isn't ruled by an ignorant DM god. I also want a town to begin my journey of possible god hood.

So to start build my plan. I am going to gather a good majority of my skilled followers. Still deciding on who's going to be skilled at what and the %'s on that. Next obtain tons of resources (Stone, wood, iron, ect) Use lyre of building to create a whole in the ground and insert decanter of endless water for water. Next begin strumming to create buildings with Lyre. While the strumming is happening to create the buildings I'll create a wall for a parameter.( I'm thinking something like Helms deep maybe?)

Home base is now kind of set up! Next begin to work on the food situation, I don't plan on building a government/economic system until everything is set up and the town is self sufficient.

So far I'll have Shelter, Water, and some security.
How can I begin to feed those working on the town? Do I have to buy tons of rations or what?

Next crops will need to start to exist, and cattle will need to be brought in. Should I buy them from other towns? Should I have people dedicated to obtaining and tracking down wild cattle? (Ideas please)

What else am I missing? Once the town is done being built and set up I intend on putting away the Lyre for intensive uses. Or give it to the "City Worker's" guild.

Zenyu wrote:

My Cleric has 6 months to do whatever he wants. I have 200 followers from the leadership feat. I also possess 100,000 gold. I am looking to build a town in which I can make a base of operations out of. What tools are there for building towns? I had someone suggest using the 3.0 stronghold builder guide, but our DM wants to stick to strictly Paizo material.

Halp please.

Level and Domains please, do you have building skills or feats? How about your followers, how many of them have carpentry/masonry skills? what is a general statement on their magical abilities?

7cleric 7 holy vindicator(Healing and Rune domains). 12th level cohort (Still deciding on what it is)As far as my followers go, I have yet to decide on what most of them are. I figure as I plan out my town and draw it up I will decide on what %'s of them are. My cleric has a Profession of carpentry and masonry of totals of +20. As far as access to magic there's a 15th level wizard in the group who has become very attached to my paladin. Also I have access to a plane traveling city which has up to 25th level casting divine/arcane.

We have a group of rotating DM's and this is an off period for one of the sessions where we write up what we want to do during this time. I decided after falling away from a god and having an a major dispute with a large nation and a god that I would begin to create my own civilization to work out of. Also in the future I am hoping that my followers will become those who worship me on the track to become immortal/a demigod (Waiting on DM approval for being a god. But immortality is definitely within reach)

Greatly appreciate the help guys! I'll take a look at the 2nd and 3rd kingmaker books.

@Lyrax, I'd love the idea of sitting down and telling him what I want to do. If I don't have it written out pretty clearly with specifics it's most likely i'll be screwed over. Also if I don't have numbers to work with there's a more than likely chance it'll be "You get three huts of mud for 100,000 gold. Thank you come again."

My Cleric has 6 months to do whatever he wants. I have 200 followers from the leadership feat. I also possess 100,000 gold. I am looking to build a town in which I can make a base of operations out of. What tools are there for building towns? I had someone suggest using the 3.0 stronghold builder guide, but our DM wants to stick to strictly Paizo material.

Halp please.

Zenyu wrote:

Everyone in the group is just as powerful. There are 6 of us. The only reason one person has died was because he stepped on a 40 d6 trap.

The DM's creation of BBEG's and Monsters have been a joke.Myself and another player have brought it up to our DM that we are way to strong.

40d6 traps.=> average 200 damage.

Level 10 party.

You provided your own answer.

He _MEANS_ to challenge you properly, but obviously fails to do so with the stuff he creates.
Technically, it's still quite possibly to challenge you, but it will take quite an effort on his part.
You can give him some time for him to get things right...basically consider yourselves as an "epic" group...problem with that being that many DM's are not quite "fit" for challenging epic groups.

Also happens to the best, forgetting a creative player has this or that ability/spell/immunity ruined some very high level encounters i created.
But getting it right MOST of the time is whats important. Seems your DM does not. Either fix everything up or give him time to "learn"/adjust, i guess.

1. How does 40d6 average to 200? 40*3.5 = 140

AvalonXQ wrote:

I hope you won't be terribly offended if I take the time to note that you have repeatedly misspelled "too".

When you mean "exceedingly" or "more than should be", the word is spelled with a double "o".
Examples: "too strong", "too powerful", "given out too much and gone too far".
Sorry for the pedantry.

Wow, someone who's more of a pedant than me...

Also, it is Harbinger, not Harbringer ;)

300% Positive it says Harbringer on my Sheet. Which is from the DM himself.

In my no-alignment house rule, I make the alignments planar forces, and such only planar infused entities have alignments as far as magic goes. Smite/Holy only effects the enemies smite gets its double damage against, so the Paladin is there to fight emissaries of Evil, not just any scumbag on the streets.

Also, I've played a few games now with a no divine casters policy, either just in the group, or in the entire world. What I like about it is the walking wounded party, having to decide to hole up and lick their wounds for a few days or bandage it up and keep marching. Death is final, and a tough encounter leaves its mark on the party for some time. In general I'd prefer the opposite of the OP's DM, access to heals in a can but not druids/clerics/etc.

We have done the no divine casters rule before and it wasn't to bad. It was kind of dull but it wasn't too bad.

Velcro Zipper wrote:

Have you and the rest of the party considered simply not using these incredibly powerful items and abilities?

There's no rule that says you have to use all of your abilities or the most powerful weapons at your disposal.

Use that fruity tabard to wrap a ham and pull out a simple +1 flaming longsword the next time you get in a fight. If your DM asks why you're not using your +12 Righteous Blade of Monty Haul, tell him it's boring.

Hell, you could just sell off all that junk, pick up some level-appropriate gear and give the remainder of your gold to charity or buy an orphanage.

Hm... I would recommend a brothel. They could use the paladin's abilities more I wagger... what with remove disease, fatigue and exhaustion and what not.

Then he can donate a large portion of the profits to an orphanage.

This is the best idear, I have ever read. It would be a good way to recruit those in the name of pelor.

Have you and the rest of the party considered simply not using these incredibly powerful items and abilities?

There's no rule that says you have to use all of your abilities or the most powerful weapons at your disposal.

Use that fruity tabard to wrap a ham and pull out a simple +1 flaming longsword the next time you get in a fight. If your DM asks why you're not using your +12 Righteous Blade of Monty Haul, tell him it's boring.

Hell, you could just sell off all that junk, pick up some level-appropriate gear and give the remainder of your gold to charity or buy an orphanage.

For some reason whenever you attempt to get rid of a +10 holy sword of pwnage it magically appears back in your bag

I've never played a no alignment game, but some people are in to it. Maybe give it a chance, assuming you can come up with a reasonable system for the protection from/detect/magical circle/etc. alignment spells. If they DM HASN'T thought about any of those but wants to play no alignment, then you may have a problem.

A no healing items game could be fun. It just means you need to play a lot smarter to avoid damage rather than Wand o CLW your way out of problems. I can see how it would tend to push your group towards making someone play a positive channeling cleric, but thats not necessarily the same as playing a healbot since those channels can be used out of combat to give a pick me up to the whole party easily, while the cleric can still beatstick/cast offensive spells during combats. You should also probably consider such survival techniques as running away or bribing your opponents in order to avoid taking damage.

In general, you seem to be having problems within your group with rotating DMs. Maybe you should find someone in the group who is good at it and wants to do it so everybody has a consistently better time. If everyone wants a turn DMing... well thats different from every group I've played with :P

Don't get me wrong, creativity to live? Sounds awesome! When the DM sets you up to fail with forcing others to heal through a hack and slash low RP/ low puzzle game. That is infuriating.

The rotating DM's is there for those who want to DM can, and those who just want to play can play. When I get my foot in for a DM spot I will be the 5/8th Dm.

Zenyu wrote:

I am trying to get my foot in the door to take a spot in the rotating cycle. With my foot in I plan to force them to roleplay in some sense, because many players haven't ever been put on the spot for it.

WHOA DUDE TIME OUT!

Are you sure you want to force someone else to do things your way?

This is very close to "Bad/wrong fun", while I agree that if you aren't having fun you should try to help change things some -- but it could be everyone else is enjoying the way things are... please be sure to double check before you "force" something that might not be wanted onto other people.

I tell you missionaries -- Sheesh!

Force may have been the wrong word. Let me rephrase this.

One does not simply work for the king. There is a process in which you are selected to work for the king.
Puzzles are not simply a roll of the dice to figure out, but a chance for minds to collaborate towards a common goal.

If players start a campaign at a level higher than one, they did not simply originate at that level. They had a past, or how some would say a story.

This might just be me, but when I am apart of a roleplaying group I think of it as writing a story with a large group of people that you get to interact with and delve as far as you wish. Not just a game that you kill stuff to beat the game.

Zenyu wrote:

I suppose I forgot an important part of my question. The DM Claims to be making up his own encounters to create a major challenge to counter act the groups power. But it is not just me that is overpowered. Our wizard just got a staff in our off session RP that makes a staff of the Magi look like a tooth pick.

Everyone in the group is just as powerful. There are 6 of us. The only reason one person has died was because he stepped on a 40 d6 trap.

The DM's creation of BBEG's and Monsters have been a joke.Myself and another player have brought it up to our DM that we are way to strong.

On the Role playing aspect, it would seem that I am one of the few people who "Role Play" or ask questions before killing. All my "Role playing" has got me has been "Shut up and go with it."

hack and slash has been an understatement of the game.

I don't want to hurt the DM's feelings but overpowered walks on imaginative beaches aren't why I play the game. >_<

I hate to ask this but do you like how the game plays?

Or would you rather have a more roleplaying centered game?

If you really don't like how the game is going (hack-n-slash) bring it up with the DM...

If that doesn't work...

Well you need to decide if the game is right for you, if not then you may need to find a new game. Or perhaps DM your own?

The game started out very interestingly but, then took a turn towards the "LOLBRO I GOTS SWORD OF DOOM" road.

I am good friends with the DM outside of sessions and I have pointed it out to him numerous amount of times to bring in more roleplaying. Which he has gotten better at but still is no where near par.

I am trying to get my foot in the door to take a spot in the rotating cycle. With my foot in I plan to force them to roleplay in some sense, because many players haven't ever been put on the spot for it.

I hope you won't be terribly offended if I take the time to note that you have repeatedly misspelled "too".

When you mean "exceedingly" or "more than should be", the word is spelled with a double "o".
Examples: "too strong", "too powerful", "given out too much and gone too far".
Sorry for the pedantry.

Actually, I appreciate that. Only because I would go out my way to point that out. I was actually thinking about the proper use of "To, Too" while typing this.

In my other recent post I stated that our group plays in rotating DM's and with the DM change comes an entire different world, and an entire new set of house rules.

The previous session that we just finished was an interesting one. Never before have I seen a play get so upset with a DM that he walks out of the room.

House rules for Campaign 003:

-No Alignments.
-No wands/staves/Potions of healing. (No healing in an item whatsoever.)

So this was the first issue. With the no alignments, we have a paladin. Before the game was started he asked how smite would work. From what I understood it was that it worked on those with evil intentions. That created an argument, so then it went to smite only works on those that are affected for a bonus under the smite evil entry. That was to narrow so smite went to working on everything? Whatever, not that big of a deal the paladin can only do it once a day at our levels.

No healing in an item. ( In a very heavy Hack and Slash game)
This is very upsetting. This essentially forces a player to walk around as a heal stick for some one in the group. One player is essentially sacrificing their time to role play and heal people in combat. If people want to play an MMO they have computer games for that.

The alignment thing has been worked out yet 4/7 of us hate the idea of no alignment.

The no healing items is very very bothersome to myself and the players. All of us together approached the DM and pointed it out that one player was forced to be a healer. ( I understand there could be multiple people to spread out the healing job.) The DM responded with "Yup that's how I want it to be." We then began to state that it was a waste of a players time to show up to be the healer in a low role playing campaign. The DM ceased to care about it and said this is how it is.

How does one deal with a stubborn DM or what is good evidence that this is an awful house rule?

I suppose I forgot an important part of my question. The DM Claims to be making up his own encounters to create a major challenge to counter act the groups power. But it is not just me that is overpowered. Our wizard just got a staff in our off session RP that makes a staff of the Magi look like a tooth pick.

Everyone in the group is just as powerful. There are 6 of us. The only reason one person has died was because he stepped on a 40 d6 trap.

The DM's creation of BBEG's and Monsters have been a joke.Myself and another player have brought it up to our DM that we are way to strong.

On the Role playing aspect, it would seem that I am one of the few people who "Role Play" or ask questions before killing. All my "Role playing" has got me has been "Shut up and go with it."

hack and slash has been an understatement of the game.

I don't want to hurt the DM's feelings but overpowered walks on imaginative beaches aren't why I play the game. >_<

Our group has a Rotating DM cycle. Every time we change DM's we have an entire new set of characters in an entire new world. Coming up in four weeks we will be returning to our original game.

The DM for this game has a past of giving each character one home brewed item or change to the character. I am concerned that he has gone to far this time and I specifically won't be able to be touched.

First off, I once was a paladin now the GM has home brewed a class called a "Harbringer of Pelor" My character had all of his paladin levels changed by having a divine after life intervention by Pelor. Pelor was brought back into the game.

Harbringer of Pelor is the best of both worlds of a Paladin / Cleric. All the spells of a cleric and paladin. BaB of a Paladin, Save of a Paladin, Abilities from both. Essentially my 10th level "Harbringer" is a 20th level character.

Next I was given a Bless that gives me an additional 1d6 Holy damage to any enemy I strike, if it is an evil outsider it does an additional 2d8. Along with this bless I have a large amount of additional smites. 9/day

Another special Item I was given was a Tabard of the Scarlet Rose. This Tabard Gives a DR 2/- That stacks with other DR such as adamantite. +3 AC to stack on armor. And Shield other level 5 3/day.

ALSO, He has made me a half celestial. On top of the rest of this he has given us obtuse amounts of gold.

I am level 10 running around with a +10 Weapon, +5 adamantite armor, and a unnecessary amount of magical items.

Wait, I almost forgot. He also gave me a Staff of Light (Homebrewed with 12 or so spells on it)

My character has gone through what started as deadly situations to now a walk in the park.

How do I make my DM Realize that he has given out to much and gone to far?