Tyalis's page

I am curious what this "Player's Handbook 3.5e" is, and how it is a source of rule information for Pathfinder.

Probably a translation error on my part as it is the core book for player in DnD 3.5, but I have it in another langage and did not bother check its original name before writing.

Sorry for digging this many years later, but I cannot ignore this.

(...)

Thus, if you cast a fireball, and one square of the fireball overlaps the AMF, the spell is being cast into the AMF and the entire fireball is suppressed. The RAW of the spell say that the spell is suppressed, and doesn't allow for partial suppression of AoE spells.

You got the AMF part right, but let's consider the FireBall spell description in the Player's Handbook 3.5e :

A fireball spell is an explosion of flame that detonates with a low roar and deals 1d6 points of fire damage per caster level (maximum 10d6) to every creature within the area. Unattended objects also take this damage. The explosion creates almost no pressure.

Nothing to tell about that part.

You point your finger and determine the range (distance and height) at which the fireball is to burst.

So the first step is to spot and point your finger to the center of the fireball area of effect that you must be able to see.

A glowing, pea-sized bead streaks from the pointing digit

Then, you produce, on the tip of your finger, a mini fireball, hence the creation of the fireball is on the square the caster stands.

and, unless it impacts upon a material body or solid barrier prior to attaining the prescribed range, blossoms into the fireball at that point.

Then the mini fireball goes from the finger to the center of the aoe zone and must stay unhindred.

(An early impact results in an early detonation.) If you attempt to send the bead through a narrow passage, such as through an arrow slit, you must “hit” the opening with a ranged touch attack, or else the bead strikes the barrier and detonates prematurely.

If you miss for any reason, the mini fireball detonate early and the aoe is that much closer.

The fireball sets fire to combustibles and damages objects in the area. It can melt metals with low melting points, such as lead, gold, copper, silver, and bronze. If the damage caused to an interposing barrier shatters or breaks through it, the fireball may continue beyond the barrier if the area permits; otherwise it stops at the barrier just as any other spell effect does.

It implies the fireball effect grows from the reached point outward until stopped or to max distance from the center.

In short :
1. Create the fireball as a pea on the tip of the caster's finger (same square)
2. Go straight to destination but might be hindred or missed on special conditions by physical means
3. Detonate on impact.

I see 4 ways it can interract with AMF :

1. Casting in or out of AMF ?
Obviously, when cast inside the AMF, as an instantaneous spell, the "pea sized fireball" never forms. The spell is forfeit.
If cast right outside of the AMF, the fireball is formed.
Wich means the caster must be outside of AMF to even form a fireball.

2. Pass through AMF ?
When passing through AMF, the fireball is suppressed but not dispelled. Meaning it disappear to the eye while entering, and reappear on the other side.
I like to see it as the AMF blocking the effects of the weave on the plane, and the spell continuing its course on the weave. It is, however, my personal interpretation.
Some can argue that the fireball cannot continue to advance through the AMF since it blinked out of existance, and that one must wait the end of the AMF to see it reappear and continue its course. I am not of that opinion, but it is up to debate, I believe.

3. Detonate in AMF ?
If the center of the aoe is in the AMF, and we consider the fireball continue its way through the weave (is able to pass through AMF without waiting for it to subside), then it is suppressed while it detonate, negating the aoe, even if some of it is out of the AMF. The base for that is it detonate on impact, like true physical impact between the mini fireball and the center of the zone (or physical obstacle).

4. AMF in range when detonate ?
Let's now imagine the center is right outside the AMF. The mini fireball reach it and detonate.
The magical fire of the fireball goes outwards untill it met an obstacle that don't break or untill it reach the maximum distance from the center.
The magical fire that goes through the AMF alone is suppressed, not the fire that goes from the center to the other directions.
Some creatures occupying 2b2 squares that are partially in the AMF, and partially out (at least a square out of AMF that is still in fireball AOE) will be affected normally. If completely inside the AMF or the square out of AMF are out of the AOE, then the creature remain unaffected.

The premice for all this is that the fire itself is magic.
While it is possible to argue any of those points, it is clearly unadequate to say that if even a square of the aoe is in the AMF, the whole AOE is supressed. It is much more subtle.

Possible discussions are :
- is the fire magical in nature, or just magically created ?
I would rule magical in nature, at least due to the explosion size.
- is the moving of the [suppressed] fireball delayed/imaired by the AMF ?
I would rule not, but I don't know if I am missing something.
It would not be if you consider the moving as physical moving or as moving deconnected from the plane through the weave until the destination, with the fireball being the only manifestation of magic truely in the plane (thus only the fire can be negated, not the moving of it)
- is the explosion of the fireball truely negated in AMF ?
I would rule yes as the fire is not present, but if you consider the explosion of the fireball as the mouvement of it, and rule it is not physically triggered (which seems opposed to the text, but is at least debatable) then the fire could spread out of the AMF while the effect of the detonation in the AMF are suppressed.
Seems very unlikely, though.

I may have missed some point, however, concerning negating the whole aoe for one square in AMF, I rest my case.

(sorry if some sentences are not that clear, english is not my first language... I tried to be clear, but have no time to reread the whole thing now...)