Sorcerer Lex's page

I was unable to play tabletop rpgs with a lifelong friend due to a disagreeing on size modifiers once he started GMing. He 100% could not conceive the notion that a smaller target is harder to hit than a larger one, therefore negating all AC bonuses and minuses on small and large creatures (and all the other sizes). My brain still hurts thinking back on all the examples I used to try to explain the situation, and his inability to grasp the concept.

I apologize for my iteration in this thread of wizard vs. fighter, and also for projecting my ideals of stylized gameplay. I think it's obvious that everyone wants an epic character at some point, and I'd have to agree that it's unfair that fighters get the short end of the stick.

All I was trying to get at earlier was that I find it unnerving when characters have such high bonuses to skills that the task they're accomplishing becomes trivial to the gameplay. Rolling dice becomes unimportant when you essentially automatically succeed, which to me is boring. But it is indeed unfair that spellcasters should have the ability to automatically succeed and others should fail.

So, to get more on track...

If I were to recommend anything to be given to the fighter to make them meatier and more interesting to play, it would probably have to be some form of fighter talents similar to rogue talents or more fighter specific feats. These talents or feats would have to be powerful enough to put fighters in line with the utility and damage of other classes.

I know this solution sounds obvious and boring and I'm sure someone somewhere has already recommended it, so I'll just list a few ideas for flavor...

These are of course just recommendations, and any actual implementation would require fine tuning...

Dazing Shout
Casting Time: 1 standard action
Components: V
Range: close (25 ft. + 5 ft./2 levels)
Target: one creature of 1 HD/fighter level
Duration: 1 round
Saving Throw: Will negates

The fighter can use Dazing Shout an amount of times per day equal to 1 + con mod. The save DC is 10 + 1/2 fighter level + constitution modifier.

Notes: This would hopefully be utilized against flying enemies, dazing them and subsequently making them suffer falling damage as well as putting them within range of the melee fighter.

Intimidating Presence
Any enemy creature who enters a 30ft. radius of the fighter must make a will save or be demoralized. The creature must have line of sight on the fighter. The save DC is 10 + 1/2 fighter level + charisma modifier. Any enemy who succeeds at the save isn't required to make another save until 24 hours have passed.

Notes: This would give the fighter some utility as a debuffer on enemies.

I would have to agree with other posters that fighters should have at least 4 skill points, and that their will save should be better. I don't want to list to many suggestions because realistically I don't see them being implemented by Paizo, and I don't see any GMs going out of their way to incorporate them.

Thanks for reading, and best of luck to anyone who feels that their fighter is underpowered and tweaking their fighters until they're made better officially. =P

I feel that all the classes are invaluable in their own respect, and it's largely up to the GM to make the PCs realize just how much they rely on each other. There's an infinite amount of possible scenarios that will make the fighter seem useless, and an equal amount that should make a spellcaster feel useless. I won't argue that certain scenarios are more common than others, but I really fail to see why people dislike the fighter so much.

What I see most people discussing in this topic is the potential damage output of a fighter character versus a spellcaster of the same level. Why not set up scenarios that will make the characters in a party appreciate each other regardless of damage output?

Scenarios that will make the fighter appear to be invaluable and the spellcaster useless:

-An enemy rogue stole the PC spellcaster's material components
-PC spellcaster is grappled or pinned
-PC spellcaster is taking consistent damage that is interrupting their spells (Concentration vs DC 10 + the damage taken + spell level cast)
-PC spellcaster is being counter-spelled by an enemy deep in enemy lines
-Enemy has spell resistance
-PC spellcaster suffers from a successful cast of a silence spell from an enemy
-PC Wizard's spellbook has been stolen by an enemy rogue or perhaps targeted for destruction by an enemy

Scenarios that will make the spellcaster invaluable and the fighter useless:

The fighter...
-can't beat a high AC
-is unable to reach target
-can't deal sufficient damage to high HP single target
-can't deal sufficient damage to multiple targets
-has limited mobility from environment or spell-effects
-has been disarmed
-is caught unarmored

With all this out in the open I have some questions to ask fellow GMs:

-Are you not actively challenging spellcasters to pass concentration checks like they should be?
-Are spellcasters NEVER receiving damage from enemies so that they HAVE to make a concentration check?
-Are enemies for some reason not targeting the spellcaster who is obviously a huge threat?
-Are spellcasters not being charged with the task of acquiring their material components?
-Are spellcasters not being targeted by enemy spellcasters?

I feel like this thread is either making fighters unsung heroes, or people aren't using important core rules relating to spellcasting, or maybe both. GMs aren't limited to boring formulaic battles where the enemies all target the fighter while the spellcaster leisurely sits in the back. Make your encounters endanger the spellcaster, make them realize that without the fighter they would be turned into mincemeat.

Sorry for the long post, I hope people find this information agreeable.