Kobold Cleaver wrote:
I apologize for any confusion, I probably should have labeled the post differently. I was hoping to see overpowered builds rather than try to defend my rough draft example. Also, no one has pointed out something i did wrong yet. The Two Handed Thrower feat working with the lesser hurling is the only one that is left to interpretation, and i'm pretty sure it would work in any home game.
This thread didn't go as I had thought it would. I posted what appeared to be a fun build with decent damage. I just wanted to see some cool builds with more damage than it or maybe some suggestions to improve this. Instead, it got ripped to shreds, some people told me I was trying too hard to build a gunslinger that isn't a gunslinger, and then the conversation switched to wizards being overpowered. If you're going to provide some builds or suggestions, then go ahead. If not, please keep all irrelevant arguments/conversations out.
Rynjin wrote:
I'm not sure exactly how it went because i heard it passed on by 2 people, but i think he had a double barreled shotgun or pistol or something, and got a crit. It may have been one turn, instead of one shot. Either way, it's still ridiculous.
Cao Phen wrote:
I checked out your build. Seemed pretty good, but i didn't see where you got the proficiency with rocks. They're improvised weapons, right? I'm probably missing it, but still great build. I didn't consider going more fighter than barb, i guess that would help since i'm feeling feat-deprived with this.
Cao Phen wrote:
Can't Quick Draw something out of it?
Qaianna wrote:
Well, we're level 7, so maybe a 4-6 expected bonus to reflex? some outliers here and there. I think it should work pretty well ranged. I don't plan on doing a lot of melee since the ranged attacks are better. That last part on the weight of the rock. . .yeah. . .800lbs. So I can throw it 150ft with decent accuracy, but I can only stumble around with it. . .seems legit. I guess i'll be needing a bag of holding. Edit: 800lbs if that was water, so more than that.
Qaianna wrote:
Oh yeah, forgot to mention the save. It's DC 21 reflex at this level ( 10 + 1/2 barb's level + str modifier). The rocks are small sized, so about 3ft in diameter.
CWheezy wrote:
Actually, they are touch attacks. Read the lesser hurling rage power.
CWheezy wrote:
My GM's friend was a gunslinger once. His GM was mad because he was killing the enemies too easily, so he sent the gunslinger to his "death". At level 2 he one-shot-killed a cr 11 enemy
Rynjin wrote:
I don't know if you saw this part: they are touch attacks. 2d6+13 3 times per round hitting at a 95% chance, literally. . . at level 7. Maybe i should have bolded that part. It seems kinda hidden in the mediocre stats. The ranged raging attacks are what makes this build good.
I recently quit being a paladin in one of my games because it was not my playstyle, I was probably going to lose my abilities soon anyway. So, I did some research, made a few rough draft characters, and finally I stumbled across something beautiful: Fred Flintstone (not roleplaying him, he just uses rocks)
AC 16, Touch 12, Flat 14 (chain shirt)
Speed: 40
Range of rocks: 30ft increments Str: 25 (18 starting, 4 racial, 1 level, 2 enhancement, an extra +4 when raging)
CMB 14, CMD 26, BAB 7
Rage Powers: lesser hurling, lesser fiend totem
Equipment: Chain Shirt, lesser belt of hurling, bag of rocks The feats work perfectly to give me more attacks with the lesser hurling rage power. The lesser hurling rage power says I can throw a small sized rock as a touch attack with two hands as a full-round action, however the Two-Handed Thrower feat says i can throw any two-handed weapon as a standard action, and make all my possible attacks with Quick Draw. I got Throw Anything and Catch off Guard so i can use rocks as ranged weapons and melee weapons. The belt allows me to add my strength to attack rolls with thrown weapons and gives me +10ft range. For being level 7, i think this build's offense is amazing. It's AC and Will are garbage, but they usually are for barbarians anyway. If you have any builds you think are more powerful than this at around the same level, if you have any recommendations to improve this, or if you might have noticed something i didn't that makes this build not work the way it should, just post your suggestions.
Nefreet wrote:
Could you provide me with a link to the errata. I'd like to see what they changed. EDIT: I found the errata, but it doesn't change anything in my case.
blackbloodtroll wrote:
You used incorrect capitalization, Mr. Grammar Nazi.
I've tried to research it on other forums, but i haven't found much on the topic. Here's my situation: I'm playing a nagaji paladin 4/ sorcerer 1/ dragon disciple 1. I got the final embrace feat (even though nagajis don't qualify for the feat, my GM said they were close enough to the other races to qualify), which gives me grab and constrict. So, after I attack with a natural attack (sorcerer claws) I can attempt a grapple as a free action. If i succeed, i do constrict damage. So far, i've been rolling to see if i hit with any of my claw attacks and then doing the grapple after my attacks; BUT i found out that releasing a grapple is a free action. So what i'm thinking is: I could attack, grapple, constrict, release, attack, grapple, constrict, and an optional release with my 2 claws. This seems really powerful and it just doesn't seem like it could be possible. So here are my questions: 1. Does final embrace only apply to one attack per round? If it doesn't:
Rynjin wrote:
I numbered my responses according to the sections of your response: 1. I have a +8 diplomacy; decent, but not amazing. +11 would require me to not have dumped my intelligence so that i would have more skill ranks AND max out my diplomacy using the still small amount of skills ranks i would have had. 2. This cannot possibly be called a learning experience. Maybe for the GM, because he is a new GM and didn't go by a book, but not for me. There is no way around this, I'm the only competent 1 v 1 fighter in my group even without my abilities. The two other melee combatants in the group are the hunter and the rogue. The hunter is largely dependent on his Roc in combat and the rogue needs to sneak attack. 3. The ogre I will be fighting IS evil. I detected evil on him. The GM made the ogre society evil, for the most part, but they act more like a normal society, in general. I think it does help that the ogres are saving their appetites for the big chunky dwarves during tomorrow's feast, though.
Rynjin wrote:
Ok, i don't want to sound rude, but you didn't listen to me at all. I'm fighting an ogre that has above average stats and possibly a brawler level. So, he's either CR 4 or 5 and I'm fighting him alone. I'm level 4 and at a disadvantage already because I can't use any of my paladin combat bonuses. I NEED to beat this guy somehow. Also, I don't have weapon bond yet. That would also be magic, anyway. I've never heard of the phrase "take your lumps". I figured it just meant "toughen up" or "just deal with it" or something like that.
I'm starting to wonder if you're right about the ogres not caring that I'm cheating. Maybe what they meant by "no magic" is no turning invisible, flying around, and summoning elementals to make the other guy fight. Maybe a little healing and some extra dmg and AC would be fine. And for those of you who keep talking about how I will fall from cheating: There is absolutely no way we are going to get this dwarf unless I cheat. If I lose the fight, the dwarf will be cooked by the clerics and eaten by the guy I will fight in the Great Maw Feast. Many other dwarves will be eaten, but we can't save them being level 4 characters. I'm cheating for the greater good and I'm pretty sure my GM is fine with me doing it, but I might get caught. The GM told me that I might be able to convince a cleric to enlarge me so it's more of a "fair fight" in their perspective. This is not a thread asking whether or not I will fall. It's a thread asking if these types of magic are detectable.
Rynjin wrote:
My handicap is that there are about 2 thousand hungry ogres in the next room and a few hundred ogres in the same room we will be in. If i go all out and use magic, I will certainly die.
maouse wrote:
I can't just go all out on this ogre, as i stated in my description of the situation in a reply.
CampinCarl9127 wrote: While healing bruises may be less obvious than healing open wounds, it's still pretty obvious. Particularly when you're the center of attention. Particularly when you're being constantly scrutinized for cheating. You make a fair point. I'm pretty sure the perception of ogres would be low, though. I checked the average Wis of an ogre cleric and it's 12. I don't think my sleight of hand/stealth roll would be too high, but neither would the ogre's perceptions.
maouse wrote:
Ok, i never said i wasn't the classic Pali. In fact, I act like a classic Pali in pretty much every situation I am in, including this one. I'm not going to follow the laws built by a society consisting only of chaotic evil creatures. I described the situation in a reply. I didn't think it mattered in the OP and, honestly, it doesn't.
Castilonium wrote:
Well, to be fair, the damage would be nonlethal, since it is a "friendly fight". So, maybe people wouldn't notice the damage being healed because there aren't any huge wounds on my body.
Tacticslion wrote:
I do not have access to magic aura, and i don't think it would help anyway since i'm not an object, or at least i don't think creatures count as objects. And besides, I would need a level 64 caster to cast the spell on me. (5lbs per level, i weigh 320 pounds) I don't think the rest of the party matters, but just in case you want to know: we have an elf rogue (disguised as an orc during our time in the city), a human Hunter with a Roc companion, a Vishkanya sorcerer (i don't know how to spell it, it's a snake person), some kind of fox-person race oracle, and a nagaji paladin (me). Not really the best races for role-playing purposes, but they are optimized! They really can't do anything during or before the fight. We will be fighting right before the Great Maw Feast, so about two thousand hungry ogres will be in the building all crammed together in the room next to the pit fight. If anyone tries anything funny, we all die. EDIT: I forgot to also note that there will be a few hundred ogres in the room of the pit fight watching. That includes the ogre clerics.
Mysterious Stranger wrote: It really does not matter because if you attempt to use either ability you are breaking the rules of the fight. Cheating in a friendly fight is not really an honorable thing to do. Probably not enough to cause you to fall, but if I were the GM your abilities would fail as a warning. Ok, i guess i have to give the background anyway. My character doesn't care about the local laws or even those of the country. It is an orc/goblin/ogre country that we entered just to find an important dwarf prisoner being held by the ogres. My deity certainly does not care about being honorable to ogres. My deity is Iomedae, god of glory, sun, truth maybe, and some other irrelevant things. The paladins of this god send crusades on "innocent" evil races, monsters, and other groups. I have a phylactery of faithfulness, so as long as I contemplate something I can't really fall. Keep in mind that only evil acts and breaking the code of conduct make a paladin fall, not breaking laws(I have to say, most of the time breaking the code of conduct would mean breaking the law, but not in this particular case). The only reasons I am concerned with the rules of this fight are: 1. We could fail to get the dwarf. 2. I could lose an important finger, like a thumb or something!
In the campaign I am playing right now, I am a 4th level paladin. It is a very, very, very long story so I won't go into the details of how this happened, but I was chosen by my party to fight an ogre in a pit fight. It is a friendly naked pit fight: no armor, no weapons, not even any clothing at all; loser loses an ear or a finger, chosen and consumed by the winner. Magic is not allowed and ogre clerics will be detecting it everywhere. We figured I had the best chance of winning due to my smite and lay on hands, but I'm not sure if I would be able to use them. Smite is magic, but is it detectable? My GM said it would probably leave scorch marks or something, so even if it's not detectable people would notice. I argued that it didn't do energy damage, so it wouldn't leave any kind of energy damage marks, only bleeding and bruises. That lead me to another question: Smite Evil is a magic ability, but does it do magic damage and/or do "magical effects"? Lay on Hands is definitely magic, and it may be detectable. It's a swift action, it requires somatic components (need one free hand), probably requires verbal components, and it is noticeable healing. If you could somehow find a way for me to be safe using Lay on Hands, I would love that because it would give me a ton of extra health, but I won't be disappointed nor surprised if i can't use it. I could argue against mundane ways of detecting the use of Lay on Hands by me just finding a way to touch my body without people noticing, such as putting my hand over my cheek after i just got punched in the face. We left off the session the in-game day before the fight, so it's still debatable whether i can use Smite Evil or not. If I can't, I will certainly lose due to the 29 Str of the ogre and possibly a brawler level the GM will give him. Recap of my questions: 1. Is Smite Evil detectable by Detect Magic? 2. Does Smite Evil leave any strange markings or create any visual effects such as light that would cause people to realize I am using magic? 3. Is Lay on Hands detectable by Detect Magic?
Melvin the Mediocre wrote:
I just looked it up, the imp's light load is 16.5 lbs. The staff of evocation, which is the one I am using, is 5 lbs.
I started a level 11 wizard and I chose the Imp from the list of Improved Familiars. I was wondering about the Inevitable Arbiter for the near-invincibility that is regeneration(chaotic)(the serious downside is that when it is unconscious it can't fly and it weighs like 60 lbs, which is too much for 8 str wizard to carry around) and the cacao daemon for its resistances, but I finally decided on the imp because it seemed useful in and out of combat. An at-will invisibility flying creature with DR, SR, and fast healing to deliver touch spells for me? yes please! It was the best for roleplaying as well because I am a tiefling. It also has all my skill ranks, which means I get 2 tries on knowledges, spellcraft, etc., and can speak(both verbally and telepathically), but above all: it has hands! This seems like a pretty useful creature, but it is really limited by its 40 health. This leads me to these 2 questions: 1. Since it has hands, can it use a staff? If I invest enough points into UMD, it could have a decent chance of succeeding. 2. Can it learn different languages than me if I invest in Linguistics? It was our rogue's job to learn a lot of languages, but she will be leaving to college. If it could learn different languages, then I would get 2 languages per rank. It would also be an amazing translator because it can tell me everything through telepathy!
I've heard that sorcerers are better casters than wizards, but from what I've seen it's almost the opposite in every way possible. Wizards get access to higher level spells earlier than sorcerers (this really hurts sorcerers at low levels, a 3rd level sorcerer can still only cast 1st level spells), wizards can get more spells by paying a very small amount of gold, the Int stat is much more useful than Cha in my opinion, and due to that the wizard will almost always have better skills than the sorcerer. A high intelligence is super important for spellcraft and knowledges, especially at low levels. The extra known spells for a wizard also makes him better at making magical items than a sorcerer. The only thing I've seen that makes a sorcerer better in any way is the extra damage on certain energy spells from the draconic bloodline, but in order to really make that ability useful, you need to pick a lot of damaging spells...which aren't as useful as types of spells like buff, debuff, summon, or battlefield control. Is there any reason to pick sorcerer over wizard? Separate question: My brother is GMing a campaign and he wanted to create a group of enemies that would mimic the party (in class choice as well as personality of each player) that would consistently be causing conflicts for the party. The enemies would probably be exactly the same level, so how would a GM keep one party from completely killing off the other after one fight? He wants to do it at around 5th to 10th level, so super high level magic is out.
Castilonium wrote: One alternative is to be a Sacred Servant of a god with the Travel domain. Your base speed will increase by 10, and you'll have Longstrider in a bonus domain spell slot. That's 40 speed in full plate. Your divine bond will boost your spellcasting or healing. That sounds interesting, but I think I want to focus more on damage output than healing. The horse would have 50ft speed and allow me to do three times damage on a charge. We have an oracle that helps with the healing.
I just started a new character and I chose paladin. Right now, it's a level 2 Nagaji (mostly for the +2 str and cha, but the +1 nat armor is good, too). My GM said Sulis is too overpowered with the resistances. The stats are: 19 str
23 HP
I plan on getting enlarged so my dex will fit nicely in full plate. I will put the 4th level ability increase in str, i might put 8th and 12th in cha. I am having a difficult time deciding between the weapon bond and the animal bond. If I choose the animal bond, I will pick the Shining Knight archetype. I want the animal bond because it seems more fun than the boring sword and board fighter I had in another campaign (also because I want to avoid the painful 20ft movement speed I am experiencing right now), but I don't know what mounted combat feats I should take other than spirited charge. Are there any low cost magical items (10k gp or less) that compliment a mounted paladin? Also, what mount options are there for a large paladin? Would I have to apply the giant template to a horse? |