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Whisperknives wrote:

On the topic of Zen Archer:

What is the point of them getting Ki Focus as a class feature for their weapon when they do not get stunning fist or it's variants to use it with?

As pointed out by Porpentine a couple of days ago...

"Lyu gains stunning fist arrows at 17th level, courtesy of the zen archer class ability, Ki Focus Bow. As laid out in this thread, he doesn't have it at 15th - but he will soon, and it's a stonking ability when he finally gets it."

Meaning, you take the feat Stunning Fist at level 15. When you pick up Ki Focus Bow at level 17 you then possess 21 stunning fist attempts.


porpentine wrote:
Gr'Rakt wrote:
Can anyone point out to me how this archer Porpentine showed us is able to use Stunning Fist attacks with a bow?

Gr'Rakt, apologies for not getting back to your private message.

Lyu gains stunning fist arrows at 17th level, courtesy of the zen archer class ability, Ki Focus Bow. As laid out in this thread, he doesn't have it at 15th - but he will soon, and it's a stonking ability when he finally gets it.

I'll also repeat for Gr'Rakt and anyone else who sent me a private message, that I did post a full zen archer guide on these boards. It's around here somewhere, though I'm afraid you might have to dig for it.

It's not a problem, porpentine. Thanks for addressing it for me! It makes complete sense now. Kudos. Sadly, the campaigns I'm involved in usually come to an end around 14-15th level. :(


porpentine wrote:

The best archer, at almost any level you care to mention, is the zen archer.

15th level isn't particularly favourable, but Ravingdork posts a solid fighter archer at that level way up above (Dayer) - and presents him beautifully too - so here's a zen archer at that level for direct comparison. Note that Lyu is built with 20pb, Dayer with (as far as I can tell) 26pb.

Name: Lyu. Race: Human. Class/Level: Qinggong Zen Monk 15. Favoured Bonus: H∞. Age: 30. Height: 5’. Weight: 130lbs.
Pointbuy: 14/14/14/7/17/7 = 20

Can anyone point out to me how this archer Porpentine showed us is able to use Stunning Fist attacks with a bow?


Ah hah!! It was Tiger Pounce. Good call! Now my mind can stop whirling around trying to remember this. Thanks!


No, it is not Panther Style. The effect was quite literally being able to convert your attack penalty from Power Attack to an Armor Class penalty instead. Maybe I imagined it. :\


No, I am confident it was not Reckless Abandon. I have been reading a lot of orc and half-orc material, in an attempt to make a brutish rogue. It is not under the half-orc rogue favored class Skulking Slayer or the orc fighter favored class Dirty Fighter.

This is driving me crazy!


I cannot help but think I have seen a Power Attack variant, in which allows you to convert your attack roll penalty into an Armor Class penalty instead. For the life of me, though, I cannot seem to recall where I have read that. It might have been a racial feat, an archetype ability, or something along those lines.

If anyone knows if what I'm talking about is PF material, or not, please chime in. Thanks a lot!


Glutton wrote:
1Unarmed Fighter 1 Power Attack, Improved Unarmed, Dragon Style

Dragon Style has a prerequisite of 3 ranks in Acrobatics, thus rendering this feat not available until a minimum level of 3rd.


The Chort wrote:
Glutton wrote:

EDIT: An Oracle of Life can heal as a free action (Life Bond) a standard action (What healers normally do) a move action (Quick Channel Energy) a swift action (Combat Healer) and your friends move action, moving through your square (Energy Body)

Life Link (Su): As a standard action, you may create a bond between yourself and another creature. Each round at the start of your turn, if the bonded creature is wounded for 5 or more hit points below its maximum hit points, it heals 5 hit points and you take 5 hit points of damage.

Life link doesn't allow you to heal as a free action. It simply heals the linked target for 5HP while you take 5 damage. Also, I'm not sure you were implying that all of actions could take place in the same round, but if you were then you'll have to remember healing with Energy Body by walking through can only effect one target a round.


Glutton wrote:
or infernal healing on wands.

Did they remove the requirement of "worshipper of Asmodeus" for Infernal Healing?


From my experiences, I've noticed being the healer paints a giant neon kill-on-sight arrow above your head. Usually that means the party's survivability heavily relies on the healer's survivability. I'd drop all the "blaster" related ideas and focus on staying alive. +1 Will/Fort save traits are a great pick up, considering they're the most predominant of the "suck or save" saves. That being said, compliment them with Iron Will and Great Fortitude. Also, don't underestimate Toughness. It'll help you breach the Power Word susceptibility.

As far as utility spells goes, I'd highly recommend picking up Remove Fear, Remove Sickness, Status, Delay Poison, Prayer, and Stone Shape. Status will ensure you know who needs healing, when they need healing, and how much they need healing as well as any conditions you need to remove. Delay Poison is just awesome. 1 hour per level, it essentially nullifies poison during your combats. Remove Fear is great, too. Nothing worse than your low Will save big melee running off, leaving you to take damage straight to your face. That's his job! Stone Shape is super handy for battlefield control. That being said, so is Obscuring Mist.

Life Link is an awesome revelation. It's extra out of combat healing and it gives you the elemental subtype, granting you all kinds of damage/condition mitigation.

Picking up Craft Wondrous Item can save you some gold, too.


nighttree wrote:


I'm still undecided as to taking cure or inflict spells.

He's not evil....but he's not really concerned with helping other either....(LN)
His mentallity is more along the lines of a Hellknight, but a little less strict.

he is very much a "HELL serves Chelax" type.

I see. This is what I'd suggest for level 1-10. (* indicates your favored class bonus spell, which reminds me... I'd just take the +1 hp for levels 1-3)

L1: Create Water(0), Detect Magic(0), Guidance(0), Light(0), Bless(1), Obscuring Mist(1)
L2: Read Magic(0)
L3: Cause Fear(1)
L4: Stabilize(0), *Bane(1), Summon Monster II(2)
L5: *Command(1), Doom(1), Hold Person(2)
L6: Purify Food and Drink(0), *Resist Energy(2), Summon Monster III(3)
L7: Protection from Evil(1), *Delay Poison(2), Spiritual Weapon(2), Animate Dead(3)
L8: Mending(0), *Dispel Magic(3), Summon Monster IV(4)
L9: Lesser Restoration(2), *Invisibility Purge(3), Stone Shape(3), Summon Accuser(4)
L10: Spark(0), *Freedom of Movement(4), Greater Command(5)


That one seems decent enough, Ganryu. I'd change the details on how the players receive the hint. I'd make it an audible message, via Magic Mouth or something similar. Then you speak the hint slowly to them. Let THEM make the assumption it's "stairs" and not "stares".


I see your point, Tri. It's hard for me to imagine that. I guess I'm lucky. My group is a buncha natural born jokesters. :)


I'm not quite so sure why there's so much hostility regarding this topic. My group ranges 28-48 in age. We've got all sides of the spectrum in our group; teacher, vendor, web developer, construction worker, art student, and a vagabond of sorts. We all appreciate being able to laugh while gaming. I guess even though we've got a few power gamers amongst us, it still boils down to just hanging out with friends and having a good time. If you're in a group so uptight and without humor that they can't have a good laugh, then I'm very sorry for that. :(


Your list will also vary tremendously depending on if your group has a dedicated healer, or if everyone is assuming "well, nighttree is playing an oracle, which has access to cures." and then assume you're rationing your divine reserves for combat healing and debuffing.


As far as summoning spells go Summon Accuser is ridiculously good.

Summon Accuser

School conjuration (summoning) [evil, lawful]; Level bard 4, cleric/oracle 4, sorcerer/wizard 4, summoner 4, witch 4

Casting Time 1 round
Components V, S, F/DF (chunk of rotten meat)
Range close (25 ft. + 5 ft./2 levels)
Effect one accuser devil
Duration 10 minutes/level

See that duration? Ridiculous! Then take a look at the Accuser Devil's SLA's. Invis (self) at will. Greater Teleport (self) at will. This guy makes an insanely good scout!!


Oh, I forgot the "dollop of Sovereign Glue on the doorknob" routine. That one can work for nearly any item. It just takes a good read on the other character, and being able to predict their next move.


I had a lot of fun pranking our party rogue with my oracle for a while. At almost any request of "removing" something (them implying spell debuffs, ability damage, etc), I'd try with Create Water first, because you never know what a little soap and water can do. 20 gallons of water plummeting down on your entire body tends to encourage you to be a little more cautious and stop treating your oracle as merely a traveling first aid kit.

I had also thought about casting Continual Light on something inside of his backpack so when he was off doing sneaky rogue things and opened it up to grab his picks, a potion, or whatever rogue tools he might need, he'd be in the middle of an untimely spotlight.

I've also thought about swapping out one of his many potions with an elixir of love.

There's also the idea of popping out one of the lenses in his Eyes of the Eagle with a plain lens. I figured that one wouldn't be too dangerous (the stun) considering I assume he'd put them on just before we set out for the day's adventure, then we could always replace the correct lens after we've all laughed at him.

That all being said, it's way easier to pull off the prankster character if you're the "designated healer" character. Just use the "hey, all I do is heal, I hafta have my fun somehow" line. :)