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*Grumbling, looking for a wallet*LOL! Pay up! :)Dash it all, I've lost my bet with that traitorous knave Aurelius. Bah.Might not matter now anyway.It most certainly doesn't lol. I'm gutted by our poor performance. But I measured up the strengths through the qualifying rounds. So I'm not surprised. Where the heck was our midfield today?
No way dude! It's "Doodle doodle dee! Wubba, wubba, wubba. At least, that's the way Downtown Julie Brown used to say it.Wibble wubble...I'm very sorry if my mention of "crazy talk" hit so close to home.Ouch! I'm soo offended! ;)Aye. It's pretty clear to me that what's in the product description is what's in the book. No more, no less. It seems to me that some of the reviewers haven't actually read the blurb on the product page. LMAO! I guess I sit corrected!
I'm very sorry if my mention of "crazy talk" hit so close to home.Ouch! I'm soo offended! ;)Aye. It's pretty clear to me that what's in the product description is what's in the book. No more, no less. It seems to me that some of the reviewers haven't actually read the blurb on the product page. Wibble wubble...
You can only post here if you mean it! Seriously! If you have any intention of offering up some kind of lame joke, just leave now! Ok? Yes. Damn those redcoats!! ;) Still England has a s!@&ty side this time round so I'm a guessing "Go Germany" may not be required. So who'll take my wager Germany 4-England 1?
Aye. It's pretty clear to me that what's in the product description is what's in the book. No more, no less. It seems to me that some of the reviewers haven't actually read the blurb on the product page. Ouch! I'm soo offended! ;)
I hear ya!
Oh, noes! You don't believe I'm being sincere!?! Whatever shall I do! Just go back to being an arrogant and ignorant American I guess. Way to show your prejudice against America, by the way....LOL! Very amusing, but not convincing methinks ;)Look man, we all get it - you are not a soccer fan. A few billion others are, including the people in this Off Topic thread. Seriously, can you please give it a rest?Ah dude, I'm just having a bit of fun with ya. It's cool that the US team did so well this year. I didn't watch a single game, but the news was all over the place this year. Which, I guess, means that one day, here in the states, soccer mat actually be more popular than womens basketball. :) So. You can be as offensive as you wish to everyone on this thread, and if someone calls you on it then I'm prejudiced against Americans just because I happen to be English LMAO! I'm very sure that a lot of the posters here who are Americans getting irritated by you. Nice try but no cigar.
Look man, we all get it - you are not a soccer fan. A few billion others are, including the people in this Off Topic thread. Seriously, can you please give it a rest?Ah dude, I'm just having a bit of fun with ya. It's cool that the US team did so well this year. I didn't watch a single game, but the news was all over the place this year. Which, I guess, means that one day, here in the states, soccer mat actually be more popular than womens basketball. :) LOL! Very amusing, but not convincing methinks ;)
It's people like this guy that promulgates the myth in the rest of the world that Americans are arrogant and ignorant about the beautiful game. I cannot begin to tell you how many kids here in Virginia are enjoying the tournament. To do as well as the USA have done in this World Cup without the major payouts from big time sponsors and fans that other countries have stands testament to how great America will be in the future as more and more young people play it. I'm English and I don't think the England side is anywhere near as good this time round. Predict tomorrow's match Germany 4-England 1. ;)
You could always just stay out of this thread if it bothers you - just a thought.I could, if it weren't for the fact that it keeps getting in the way of more interesting stuff. For goodness sake man. If you can't go elsewhere on these threads for interesting stuff instead of being a humbug on this one then I'm sorry for you.
Wasn't the Anti-Paladin suppost to be in the Gamemastery Guide?No, but there is a picture of Seelah as an Anti-Paladin in the section on evil characters. Yes. Very bad taste that ;) I was hoping it wasn't Seelah. I hope she was just doing the pose as a fundraiser for the destitute children's home. LOL.
I think that high level play is such a different axiom for players and GMs that it deserves its own text. Personally I would prefer publications built from the bottom up because I rarely run games where players really want to push beyond 20th level. I have played high level games but they are so much different in flavor and feel that I've had groups that have just said "Let's start out a new game at 1st level". Don't get me wrong I'm not knocking high level play. I possess the 3.5 Ed. Epic Level Handbook and it is rather useful, but I know that being a player the challenges are fresher in role playing terms when you're early to mid-level in advancement. Just my take.
After having a couple of days now to peruse the pdf, I have to say, as a 20 year + DM, experienced with all the previous editions of the game, this has got to be one of the best, if not THE best DM/GM Guides I've ever had the pleasure of reading. I'm completely with you. I started playing in 1978 or so and this has to be the greatest GM work I've bought. Strangely, I still love the quirks and tables in Ed.1 DMG by Gary Gygax, but that text was a little idiosyncratic and ad hoc. I don't possess a library of Rulebooks to rival Lisa's but its not inconsiderable either. I just hope Paizo brings out more GM oriented guides like this. Well done everyone at Paizo - or as we sometimes say in Blighty "Jolly good show all round chaps (and chapesses)".
Just one sample haunt (bleeding walls) and the rules to create your own haunts. No new traps. I'd buy that ;)
Only a Brit could be that mean. I thought I knew lots of words! Now I am humbled. :(
It may be, but what started this exchange was my reference to bible literalists who throw about "it was a day, but not really a day" so as not to be seen as flat-earthers. If they're taking the bible literally, then they need to use the literal length of time as described in genesis...not pick and choose what parts they're going to be literal about.Have you ever considered that this passage in Genesis might be metaphor. After all the days of Creation are not exactly in order as we would expect?Did you even read the article? It talks more about difficulties and issues with translation than about "apologetics". I guess that you will read into it what you will. What gets me is that you ask for a response and when you get one, you dismiss it. Seems like you are little better than the Christians you have a problem with.Yes, I do dismiss it because, simply put, genesis refers to a day in very specific terms: A day is a cycle of light and dark. Period. While god may exist outside of time, the timeframe that god used when creating was very explicit. 6 units of time consisting of 6 cycles between day and night. Even taking into account the later passages that tell about god's time, genesis is explicit in what time was used. I kind of agree with you there. As a geologist I know for a fact that the Earth is 4.5 billion years old. Absolute dating using certain isotopes we can measure when rocks first solidified and started isotope decay. These things are clocks and they are accurate within certain time ranges. Quite a lot of the bible is metaphor, some of it is the viewpoint of the translator during translation, some of it is prophecy, some of it is beholden on the understandings of things at the times they were written down, especially the very early stuff. I believe it is Divinely inspired, and it requires the Christian to use both study (i.e. knowing about the past contexts, language etc.) and prayer. It cannot be held up as a text about science, because that wasn't what it was intended for. It does not dismiss the Age of the Earth or Evolution or anything else scientific, because it was not supposed to be scientific. When it is intended to be precise then units of measure are mentioned (in the Torah for example). So, as a Christian, to me it is a book about God and his interaction with man. It is the best text we have on God as Christians which is why it is very important to us. The use of it as a tool to attack good science has come about because those people who are told the bible is literally true cannot handle anything that might jeopardize their beliefs. This is the problem when ill-educated people with no understanding of science become pastors and their own ignorance and fears are passed on to their flock. The Roman Church learned its lesson about this kind of thing during the Enlightenment when they accused Galileo of heresy. They didn't make the same mistake again with evolution thankfully, they left that to the Protestants.
Did you even read the article? It talks more about difficulties and issues with translation than about "apologetics". I guess that you will read into it what you will. What gets me is that you ask for a response and when you get one, you dismiss it. Seems like you are little better than the Christians you have a problem with.Yes, I do dismiss it because, simply put, genesis refers to a day in very specific terms: A day is a cycle of light and dark. Period. While god may exist outside of time, the timeframe that god used when creating was very explicit. 6 units of time consisting of 6 cycles between day and night. Even taking into account the later passages that tell about god's time, genesis is explicit in what time was used. Have you ever considered that this passage in Genesis might be metaphor. After all the days of Creation are not exactly in order as we would expect?
I'm sure you recall Jesus calling Peter a Satan. Does that mean he's THE SATAN? Or was Jesus just calling him an epithet using it as a descriptive adjective? I'm not entirely sure what he means either because I seem to have missed that bit somewhere in my research.
Interesting. I guessed at first because you weren't willing to force your beliefs on a child. What I don't follow is why you say you meant it.
Placing the blame is bad exegesis and too neat from a literal point of view by applying it to an influencing daemon. Jesus simply called Peter out.Actually Satan was giving the idea to Peter who said it to Jesus. It was not Peter Jesus was referring to. He just recognized that Satan was behind it. Remember that Jesus was a man and was tempted like a man just as any of us are.I'm sure you recall Jesus calling Peter a Satan. Does that mean he's THE SATAN? Or was Jesus just calling him an epithet using it as a descriptive adjective? You might be right. Just giving my reading of it. :)
I'm sure you recall Jesus calling Peter a Satan. Does that mean he's THE SATAN? Or was Jesus just calling him an epithet using it as a descriptive adjective? Actually Satan was giving the idea to Peter who said it to Jesus. It was not Peter Jesus was referring to. He just recognized that Satan was behind it. Remember that Jesus was a man and was tempted like a man just as any of us are.
Not true. I respect your curiosity and questioning nature. It's kind of where I come from. I am not a humanist but I respect that living well is crucial. I will share with you that God spoke very directly to me and showed me things that helped me get through a lot of trouble. I will tell you that I was not a particularly good or nice person once upon a time . I also could not accept that God could love one such as me. One night He took me bodily and allowed me to fall into the pit (utter despair) I would gladly have committed suicide. I cried out to Him though I no longer had the capacity to believe He would listen. Then I felt arms (physical arms) placed under my own arms and bodily lifted out of the pit to a place so beautiful and so much peace that I did not want to ever leave it. Then I was brought back to the cold night in tears of joy and sad I could not remain where I was. In prayer Jesus told me that now I have been where He had been, and that just as He raised Himself from the Pit there was no-one He couldn't lose and no-one He wouldn't love or raise from death. I was born again in Spirit (I don't much like the term born again because a lot of today's Christians use it as a badge and I'm unsure how many of them fully realize the true significance of it. Now I could not not believe were I even to want to. I have given you that part of it because you persisted, and I think it was right I did. I don't think Court Fool would accept that, however. He seems to wear his heart on his collar. :P He appears very honest though.
Its very strange but very true and you have said exactly what I would say as a Christian. I do not do good to win brownie points, I do it as I would do for anyone I loved.
I remember. They are personal and I'm not particularly comfortable about posting them on an Internet forum. This is not because I'm afraid that people will trash them either. It's just that there are a lot of specific things I can tell you and I will do it if you email my website through my Profile. For some reason I don't think it should be written here.
I'm sorry to hear that. We all have our rough days, we just have to remember to do what is good for one another. Just want to throw this last bit out too since I saw it:
Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but will welcome you based on the virtues you have lived by. If there are gods, but unjust, then you should not want to worship them. If there are no gods, then you will be gone, but will have lived a noble life that will live on in the memories of your loved ones. Thanks for that. Kind of why I love Marcus Aurelius(not me or my avatar) the real one. I just wish I was even an iota of the man he was.
Also, Popeye said it first.A classic tautology: I am what I am. It's at the core of cyclical logic. It also tells you absolutely nothing about God. I am who I am regardless of how much I change, because in present terms I am always me at this exact moment. That doesn't mean that will remain a constant, that tautology is in the moment. Actually I thought Popeye said "I YAM whats I YAM" ;)
A classic tautology: I am what I am. It's at the core of cyclical logic. It also tells you absolutely nothing about God. I am who I am regardless of how much I change, because in present terms I am always me at this exact moment. That doesn't mean that will remain a constant, that tautology is in the moment. Yet it is a truthful paradox when it comes to faith. But perhaps the cyclical logic we are talking about here is because we trapped inside it and unable to get off. Kind of like dad standing in the same place on the Carousel watching your child go round and round. I know I mentioned Quantum Mechanics a while back and I don't know how familiar you are with it, but there is another conundrum that John Gribben makes in his book "In Search of Shroedinger's Cat" where he mentions that the position from where we observe things may not be helpful to making calculations about it. Maybe light doesn't move and is static but we see it move because from our position of observation and locked within the framework of time space we see things only through a slit, and in the universe our position is moving though we still feeling (being caught in time)that we are stationary when in fact we are not. But it's not easy to get your noodle around because it gets a little weird.
I never said I wouldn't tell you. I was just interested why you wanted to know what God says when you tell me you don't believe He exists and He's just something we make up. A being who is cruel and unfair and causes suffering and is not worth the time of day.Why do you wish to know? I didn't think it mattered to you?If I don't know, you aren't going to tell me? Classic. I'm not entirely with you here. What won't I share? I agree it never hurts to learn and if you followed what else I wrote I gave him an answer. I promise anyone here if I can answer something I will, but we often get into areas where explanations become so difficult they almost seem trite when you write them, and I've unintentionally pissed of a lot of people here already. Sometimes we just don't know the answers. I am honest enough to tell you because I DO respect all of you who have talked to me on this thread. But I seem to make enemies left right and centre. I guess I have -30 ranks in Diplomacy ;) So now you're free to tear me apart.
Just being silly. Guess I'm a bit bruised and tired from yesterday. A lot of other stuff happened apart from forums and I wasn't my best.
That still explain why you think that just what you think. There is a difference between why (the reason you think something) and what (that which you think). I asked why, you mask a simple question in a mysti-systematic dodge. :(Why?I don't think God is bound by time.I'm of the opinion that if predestination was true it must affect God as well. If he's omniscient, then he has to know what he's going to be doing in one year (therefore he cannot be omnipotent because he has no power to stop himself from doing that action). Sadly what I just wrote came to me out of the blue, and it was not supposed to be a dodge or whatever else. I respect your intelligence more than that. But I do know that Christ says He is the Alpha and the Omega, the beginning and the end. When Moses(or was it Abram?) talked to God he simply said I AM who I AM. So I guess eternity is a place where things never change and God states throughout the bible that He doesn't change but we do. I'm still wondering why I wrote the last message to you that way. I don't know I guess it is just a thought picture because it's so difficult to understand eternity when you're stuck in time. In fairness WHY is a pretty big question to answer.
Why do you wish to know? I didn't think it mattered to you?If I don't know, you aren't going to tell me? Classic. I never said I wouldn't tell you. I was just interested why you wanted to know what God says when you tell me you don't believe He exists and He's just something we make up. A being who is cruel and unfair and causes suffering and is not worth the time of day. But I will tell you since you asked. He gives me what I need to live through the day, and He helps me to notice when His work needs attending to and He tells me that He loves me. For the life of me I do not know why He does, but I have no right to question why He loves me and why He loves any one of us. So now you're free to tear me apart.
Why?I don't think God is bound by time.I'm of the opinion that if predestination was true it must affect God as well. If he's omniscient, then he has to know what he's going to be doing in one year (therefore he cannot be omnipotent because he has no power to stop himself from doing that action). Because I think the concept of eternity is timeless. Time is a concept it is a changing of the weather, the forward movement of the seasons, the growing from childhood to old age. But to me God just IS. He IS always with us He does not change. He is eternal. But being a child caught within this concept of time I am a prisoner to its workings, and I am a prisoner to thoughts that do not mean anything beyond the utterance of them on this thread, for example. God is so far beyond us and yet He is with us always and He never hates, does not need anything but is truly and utterly at peace. He will not lose a single iota of His creation because it is always with Him and loves it for His own reasons. To ourselves it is like being caught on the crests of waves on a storm tossed ocean, where nothing seems real, but it is often painful to be threshed across the decks and smashed headfirst into the masts and blinded by the rains. One day this storm will end for each one of us and we will awaken on the beach and the skies will be bright and we will see God standing there smiling. Then we will say why did you leave us in the Storm so long? God will reply I left you out there for as long as you wished to remain there.
I don't know about Moff but I kind of think: I think we CAN understand what God desires of us and persevere to do what is right and trust in his Love and everything will end up alright. But we will only see this when all things are completed as God intends.
I'm of the opinion that if predestination was true it must affect God as well. If he's omniscient, then he has to know what he's going to be doing in one year (therefore he cannot be omnipotent because he has no power to stop himself from doing that action). I don't think God is bound by time.
What is the actual rebellion that he's done? Aside from the apocrypha... It is my understanding that he continues his adversarial role from Job in the Gospels. From my understanding of the reading i've done, he has no free will and does his job diligently (until revelation that is).Or if you hold a slanted view of predestination and the omniscient of God, technically he's doing exactly what he's supposed to be doing in the context of Revelation. Essentially, he's the scapegoat being sent to Azazel. I thought it was as Calvinist thing that figured since God knows the beginning and the end of things then He knows who's saved or not. But whatever it ain't for the likes of us to know.
Strangely enough I spend more time on religious forums knocking the bigotry and stupidity that so many fundamentalist Christians spout out of sheer ignorance of God or his teachings.And how are you so sure you are right and they are all wrong? Nope, but I can sense stupidity and bigotry a mile off. So whatever heh :)
I think the ouija board loses a whole bunch of supernatural flavour when you find out is "Oui" and "ja" as in from French and German respectively. Which means the name is literally yes-yes board.They do however look for conduits to where they can manifest in people, that is why I say to avoid the occult and ouija boards especially. Ouija boards are like a megaphone to these entities outside your house saying "Party here all invited". Actually when I was a kid I thought it was spelled weejee :)
Ummm..... as a psychologist I really don't like the term "loopy". One disturbing trend is that fundamentalist christian religions have an incredibly high rate of untreated mental disorders. Mainly because they don't see these disorders as physical but spiritual. I agree with you that there is a lot of mental illness and disorders that fundamentalist Christians are untreated for. I've seen the whole gamut of seriously disturbed people being "delivered" of demons when they were simply nutso. I have seen all kind of things attributed by the ignorant in our churches to spiritual attacks or evil influences. I have seen charlatans pretending all kinds of miracles too. However, I have encountered people who are demoniacally possessed too, but they are extremely rare and often don't seem mentally ill at all, except for certain manifestations that I will not mention because it's anecdotal and unprovable by physical science ;)
Actually I don't see atheists as fools or anything, because I'm not willing to judge another person's state of mind as I am not equipped. It makes no difference to me what you think of my beliefs either, I certainly won't be offended. I've been told beyond count by various fundamentalist Christians who disagree with me that I'll burn in Hell too. So I'm kind of caught between a rock and a hard place :) My life's journey has been one that has led me to faith in God and I answer to Him alone. The one thing He has taught me over the years is to use rational thought as much as is possible, but not to dismiss everything because I am unable to produce or give physical proof. It's faith pure and simple. Strangely enough I spend more time on religious forums knocking the bigotry and stupidity that so many fundamentalist Christians spout out of sheer ignorance of God or his teachings. Talking with atheists has been an education to say the least.
They do however look for conduits to where they can manifest in people, that is why I say to avoid the occult and ouija boards especially. Ouija boards are like a megaphone to these entities outside your house saying "Party here all invited". Strangely enough it was a Wiccan priestess that told me about this a few days ago, but I've known at lot of cases where people have been seriously scared and some went right off their heads. For the atheists, it's probably our minds playing tricks on us, but you have to admit that things that cause certain people to go loopy should be avoided. I'm waiting for "People with Faith are Loopy" ;)
Unfortunately I do not have the time nor the inclination to give you a step by step, list by list on every detail that you have incorrect. Maybe it is your opinion, fine so be it. It is however only your opinions and not the absolute truth, which is, despite your protests, is exactly how you seem to post them. If you do in fact think that Catholics are "fire and Brimstone" preaching then I suggest you stop reading about it and maybe come to Mass one Sunday. I am sure you will be very surprised.Still waiting to hear what I said that was so rude to you. Passive aggressive comments to others about me is even more rude. I didn't mean to upset you, but it's hard to apologize unless I know what it was I said that was so offensive. But sorry anyway. I didn't mean to offend you.Fair enough, I'm rude. So are you.I rarely agree with you Samnell. Thank you. Now I understand. Actually I don't think Catholics use fire and brimstone preaching in today's RC church, well I haven't witnessed any of this in the RC churches I have visited recently. I've told you the reason why I refuse to attend Mass there, as they forbid me to take the Eucharist. What I was alluding to was where all the mythology of Hell being the underworld of fire and brimstone and the depiction of the Devil as we see him today in popular culture comes from the medieval period literature and there were no other major churches around at that point in Western Europe but the Roman Catholic one. I do not equate the modern RC church of that period today, and in fact it is rather certain Protestant denominations that perpetuate these myths now. Hence why I am non-denominational. I am very sorry about giving you offense as it was most certainly unintentional, and if it makes you feel better I am truly sorry that I did it. I respect members of the RC faith and know that a lot of good is done through this Church for God's work in the world. I hope you can accept my sincerest apologies. Mark.
Fair enough, I'm rude. So are you.I rarely agree with you Samnell. Still waiting to hear what I said that was so rude to you. Passive aggressive comments to others about me is even more rude. I didn't mean to upset you, but it's hard to apologize unless I know what it was I said that was so offensive. But sorry anyway. I didn't mean to offend you.
Actually it's a very interesting question. From my take of the Devil he was around in the OT especially in the book of Job. Here we see the Devil as a kind of malicious puppet where he has to get God's permission before he is allowed to visit strife on Job. The Devil's basic argument is simply that if Job wasn't so favored in the first place and wasn't doing so well for himself he probably would curse God and die. God allows the Devil to visit strife on poor Job to prove that the Devil is actually wrong about Job's love for God and so it goes. Poor Job is reduced to sitting with nothing scratching at wounds in sackcloth wondering why God has allowed such a thing to happen to him. But he refuses to curse God and die, yet at the same time he is angry with God. Why because a group of supposed friends who were by no means the equal of Job in faith and love for God were telling him that he has done something wrong and should repent. Job refuses. He has done no more and certainly much less evil than his comforters and they are doing OK. Job just doesn't believe their arguments against him. Eventually Job cries out to God and in anger accuses God of being unfair and unjust, and receives an answer in thunder and lightning. That God can do whatever He wishes with his Creation, but that He doesn't do anything that is evil. He knew Job would cope with this situation or he wouldn't have allowed it. But God chides the friends more for doubting Job's righteousness before God and assuming He had sinned and this had caused his suffering, which was untrue. Then God restores Job to an even greater position on Earth than he possessed before. The Devil's point is disproved and away he goes. The upshot of this tale (many biblical scholars think its far older than first believed) is that just because somebody suffers a calamity it does not mean God was responsible or that God was angry with someone. Now it's not a test anyone would enjoy, but God knew Job's heart well enough to know that Job would remain faithful even though he felt he'd had a raw deal. The Devil's fall to the Earth is quoted in I think Isaiah somewhere and is referred to as the morning star (lucifer) cast down from on high. In the NT Jesus mentions witnessing this fall, along with a third of the rebellious angels. Though the world belongs to the Devil, he cannot do everything he would like so I don't believe he has total free will anymore. He lost that in Heaven when he rebelled and was cast out. But these powers and principalities (former angels) now formless and malicious spirits go hither and thither in the world posing as gods or generally trying to get man to do evil. But they can only tempt, not force. However, man himself is able to do evil without their prompting, and they themselves generally keep a low profile. Why? Because they know that if they manifested themselves too much they might actually cause men and women to cry out to God and be saved. They do their best work by deluding men and women into believing there is no God. They do however look for conduits to where they can manifest in people, that is why I say to avoid the occult and ouija boards especially. Ouija boards are like a megaphone to these entities outside your house saying "Party here all invited". Spiritualism is another conduit where they actually take possession of a medium and use their knowledge to bring "comfort" to grieving folks where they take on the personas of departed loved ones. Now they know a little and if you get a clever spirit it can give a lot of information that seems highly credible (BTW there are a lot of charlatan mediums too but I'm not talking about them here). When the spirit runs out of knowledge it just makes stuff up. Now the biggest danger to these foul entities are Christians because we are inhabited by God's Holy Spirit and they cannot abide being near Him. With Christians they work to try and scare the off, by taking form of whatever they can, often balls of energy that flit around and occasionally monstrous manifestations of themselves through possessed folk. Exorcists do exist but they keep a low profile (especially since that film came out which did great injustice to true Exorcists and scared people into thinking that God didn't have the power to drive these creatures out, when he certainly can and does), but are essentially Christians who are specially called to help people in such states. By commanding these entities to leave the person in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit. Such people are available if you ever find yourself in dangerous hauntings. They can be removed from people fairly easily, though exorcists have less luck getting them to leave a places where they have been bound. But from what I understand these entities do not have free will like we do and can only work within boundaries of God's decision. When they are allowed to do things it's usually so God can be glorified and souls can be saved. I've experienced Spirits like this and have been attacked on numerous occasions, usually at times when they are scared that they might see another soul saved for God and lost to them. They are evil malicious and should not be messed about with because they can be very dangerous especially when they are called by people who often play about with the occult because they don't really believe these things exist really, only to regret it later. This is my take. I wonder what other Christians think.
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