Inevitable

Man in the Iron Mask's page

49 posts. Alias of The Cube of Rubix.


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Would Kasatha be considered monster enough for a section in here?


shroudb wrote:

I would argue that "forgo the EFFECT" seems to imply that you forgo everything about the critical, not only damage.

P.e. critical feats effects, panache regain and etc are all effects tied to the crit.

I think the term specific over general comes into play here.

Let's break it down shall we?
Text from Butterfly's Sting "When you confirm a critical hit against a creature, you can choose to forgo the effect of the critical hit and grant a critical hit to the next ally who hits the creature with a melee attack before the start of your next turn. Your attack only deals normal damage, and the next ally automatically confirms the hit as a critical." Emphasis Mine.

Now from Swashbuckler
" Each time the swashbuckler confirms a critical hit with a light or one-handed piercing melee weapon, she regains 1 panache point. Confirming a critical hit on a helpless or unaware creature or a creature that has fewer Hit Dice than half the swashbuckler's character level doesn't restore panache." again Emphasis mine.

The way those are worded, all you need to do is roll the crit, and confirm it then you regain panache. Now because this triggers two opposite effects they would not interact further. You confirmed the crit and that is all the swashbuckler needs is the confirmation. The feat needs the confirmation to trigger its continued effect which is to grant the critical HIT to the next ally. So they trigger off the same effect but do not interact beyond that.

zza ni wrote:
in a way Shroudb is also right. as this might lead into 2 or more swashbucklers filling up each other's pananch by all having this feat and forgoing their critical for each other. so yea rulling that forgoing the effect include forgoing the regain pananch effect that comes with the critical is reasnable. this way one swashbuckler actuly let the other gain a pannach and not both keep getting it again and again as long as they hit.

How do you even figure that happens?

If I have this feat and so does my buddy... and I confirm my crit and pass off the extra damage to him... he does not regain panache as he did not confirm a critical he is benefiting from the critical damage but not from the Crit confirmation. Same would happen if he crit and passed it to you. All it would do is play out the exact same as if the two of you crit and didn't have the feat in the first place.

Jeff Clem wrote:
I would agree with shroudb. If you for go the critical you for go everything the critical triggers. I don't think you can be your own ally lol.

I believe in the FAQ they have stated you are your own ally.

So Paizo at least does not agree with you.


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Charon's Little Helper wrote:

Everyone keeps bringing up Tiefling / Aasimar as proof that Androids aren't overpowered. The OP didn't ask to compare them to Tiefling / Aasimar - he asked in comparison to the core races.

In comparison to the core races all three are overpowered. As I said in my previous post - they're not game-breakingly overpowered, but they are more powerful than the core races.

Humans still are more powerful due to their opinions alone. Virtually any good feat is a human exclusive or something you can pick up through Adopted Trait or Racial Heritage. It costs sure but its simply the only option in most cases.


Ok so in some of the feats Prerequisite(s) section we have a lay out that goes X, X; X

Now I was always told that the ; indicated a break in Prerequisite(s) allowing for more then one way to skin the cat as it were. So either you had the X, X or you had the X after the ; is that correct?


BadBird wrote:
Man in the Iron Mask wrote:
Well the ; in the Divine Protection means either or either get the 5 ranks one or have a blessing.

I'm pretty sure that the point of the ; is to indicate a break before the 'or' list begins. Otherwise Pummeling Charge is a very easy feat to grab.

Anyways it's a cool Cayden concept. I've looked at doing the same kind of thing with an Evangelist/Monk1 or Sacred Fist/Swashbuckler1.

Well that is what I mean

Either you have the Cha 13, Knowledge (religion) 5 ranks, ability to cast 2nd-level divine spells
or you have blessings, domains, or mystery class feature

Though I admit that makes some feats silly to pick up because well
you mentioned Pummeling Charge, it requires you to have Pummeling Style whos prereqs are ( Improved Unarmed Strike; base attack bonus +6, brawler's flurry class feature, or flurry of blows class feature.) Which seems really silly if you just need IUS to pick it up.. or 6 BAB.. unless the person who put it up on the 3rd Party SRD misplaced the ; which to logic should come after the +6.

I think the Sacred Fist and Swashbuckler do well together, it gives you the awesome flurry with the rapier, but also the IUS for the fist fights in the bar you will get into.


Well the ; in the Divine Protection means either or either get the 5 ranks one or have a blessing.

Wis would be fine but when you can get decent Mithril Armor and a Buckler its not a bad trade off, especially to boost the required skills.

Btw no Crusader's Flurry was always there.


That is what the Swash: was suppose to indicate that it was given through Swashbuckler. The near one was just the bonus feat from the class.

Divine Protection makes Charmed Life useless as it adds Cha to Saves full time so it frees up that particular swift action. Though I admit I know this build is a bottle neck of swift actions.


I was looking into a gestalt idea and while this is purely for fun now I may actually use this guy in an upcoming game.

Sacred Fist//Inspired Blade
This nets a Full BAB, Good Saves, 4+Int, d10 HD which is a pretty good character over all.

Now of course I was looking at this and yeah Wis on a character who needs Cha is MAD.

But with a feat from Dragonlance Dynamic Priest I can shift my casting stat to Cha which makes me a more Cha focused character.

So currently I think the feats should look like
Human: Dynamic Priest
Swash: Swashbuckler Finesse
Swash: Weapon Focus (Rapier)
1rst Level Feat: Divine Protection
3rd Level: Fencer's Grace
War: Agile Maneuvers
Swash: Combat Reflexes
5th Level Feat: Crusader's Flurry

So at level 5 he has a +3/+3 to attack on a Full BAB so an additional 5. The rapier does 1d6 at 15-20/x2 adding Dex and his Level to Dmg.

I thought I saw a feat somewhere that makes a weapon count as an unarmed strike during a flurry but I don't know if thats true.


The feat is Brutal Throw from 3.5, Power Throw is also very good for throwing weapons.


LazarX wrote:
Dustyboy wrote:

So paladins culling the helpless children of evil races, Is this a catch 22?

if the only reason this comes up in your campaign as a DM because some unfortunate snot makes the mistake of rolling a Paladin, this is what certifies you as a Dick GM.

Excuse me why do you consider it a mistake to roll a Paladin? I am left to only guess you play as or play a lot of Murder Hobos right?


While in a state of serenity, a barbarian cannot cast spells, use Intelligence-based skills, or communicate.

Unfortunately it seems like the 3pp just copied and pasted the Rage ability and changed names. Though I think my DM would allow for that to be changed (After all if you are all zen why wouldn't you be calm enough for spell casting)


I was talking to a few people and it seems we might get a game going either tonight or monday, likely monday but tonight is possible so I wanted to make up a character for this game. It could be a one shot, but I don't know yet.

I selected Barbarian//Monk
Using the Adopted Trait to pick up the Aasimar's Enlightened Warrior Trait to get out of LG monk.

The Archetypes are:
Barbarian: Serene (3pp) and Invulnerable Rager
Monk: Kata Master and Master of Many Styles, Qinggong is a possibility to trade out off things.

Race is a Kasatha, taking flaws to gain Multiweapon fighting for his unarmed strikes.

Now this is likely going to be level 5, due to us starting most at level 5 games.

If I didn't go monk and instead went Sacred Fist, which is possible how much would change really? I wouldn't gain access to master of many styles bonus feats for sure, but I would have access to spells.

Which is better?
Barbarian//Monk
or
Barbarian//Warpriest (Sacred Fist)


Pistolero is great overall. Boltace is not bad if you can use a gun due to gm setting issues.
Anyway for a warpriest to help load a dual wielder faster?


Well its for the claws and bite. The scent ability and the increases in ability scores.


I was wondering how a Gunpriest would work out?
A Gunpriest is a Gestalt or less likely a multiclassing of a Gunslinder and a Warpriest with their Weapon Focus going to Firearms specifically their weapon of choice.

Both seem to key best off Wis and Dex. So how well would the build go?


Here is what I want, a Monkey King like character.
This is a Gestalt build
Vanara as the Base Race

I have 12,000 GP to start
Level 5

I was thinking of taking the Half-Troll Temple to gain claws and bite, as well as that lovely Rend ability, plus the enhanced NA and FH5.
Probably take flaws to pick up Toughness and Troll-Blooded
So total Stat adjust would be - Str +6, Dex +4, Con +6, Int -1, Wis +2, Cha -4

Now as for classes I am not sure. I would love to add Monk just due to the flavor but thats not bond in stone yet. I am curious how a Shaman might go for this, as it allows lots of magic, hexes for even further fun.

So would a CR 2/Monk 3//Shaman 5 be any good?

For his weapon I was thinking the Rod of Surprises from MIC which that book labels at 6,000 GP. It can extend to 60 feet, lift 800 lbs, shift into a Quarterstaff (As well as a Scythe, Kama, Spear, Shortsword, etc)

Any suggestions?
Flaws are also up for debate, as I don't think this will be much of a character for ranged attacks like Arrows or Shurikens. Not sure if Shaky penalizes Spell Ranged attacks.


Pity I will let them know.


Ok so I was over at my friends house last night and they where gaming (I do not have a character in their campaign) and I was just Bsing with them. One of them asked a question and I honestly was not sure what the answer would be.

If his character has a Klar in each hand and is using TWF, as well as shield focus feat, would he gain the Shield Bonus from both weapons and would Shield Focus add an additional +2 to that number.

I think the way he imagines it is using it like a basket katar were the skull is basically like a armored gauntlet that lets him deflect an attack off the skull before striking with the spike like blade.


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So apparently Catch Off Guard allows a weapon with reach to be used as a improvised weapon without the penalty to attack it normally would have.

So I think I could make this world with the Tower Shield Specialist, Effortless Lace Longspear (for Reach) or just Spear (With the Lunge feat later), and pick up Catch Off Guard as a fighter feat to allow for the use of the Longspear in melee as a quarterstaff or Bo staff 1d6 x2


Dotting this for interest.


to be fair most of the ancient greeks would have sex with other men and not consider themselves gay.

Arcane Duelist might do well due to the ability to lead an army into battle. With Phalanx I can reduce the Armor Check for a Tower shield to something like -2 or -3 but I will still take the -2 to Attack rolls while having the shield in hand. Tower Shield Specialist however gains even a +2 Max dex on his armor. And he is a so a Dexterous fighter.

Since this build will likely be at level 5 so next level pick up Lunge, then take Monkey Lunge later to remove the penalties.

Also Effortless Lace allows me to take a two handed weapon and use it as a one handed weapon for just 2,500 GP.


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To be fair Achilles is Greek but not Spartan, in fact he is from a different part of Greece.

But yes the spear is held in one hand and is able to reach, use the shield for bashing to knock back and get an AoO from it.

But yeah Tower Shield is interesting, to bad you cannot use it for Shield Bash.

True but I selected those without really planning on throwing my spears much. But I will change those likely. I also want to add Pilums to his equipment to take down shields.


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Phalanx Fighter would be pretty good as a spear and shield combo, using the sword when the fight required him to drop his spear or when he has to throw it.

I seriously have no clue what to set alongside Phalanx Fighter, which gives Full BAB, Fort Save, and some nice use with feats.


There was a quote from the movie where someone is talking to him amd says "they say your mother is an immortal goddess, they say you cannot die." And he just looks at him amd says "then i wouldn't be needing a shield would I?"

I thought to use at least a few levels of phalanx soldier to get spear with one hand when using a shield. Thr tower shield specialist actually gets really close to 0 acp and losss the -2

Bloodrager's spelleater gets fast healing 1 and can burn spell lots to heal himself.


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Someone recommended Kensai Magus (gives the prof for Falcata anyway) and boosts AC.

However a 8000 GP investment for a +1 Keen Falcata is a little much.


arcanine wrote:
Man in the Iron Mask wrote:

Someone just pointed out a potential build.

Barbarian(invulnerable Rager) 2/Bloodrager(Untouchable Rager & Spelleater) X//Swashbuckler 5/?X

This gives him DR equal to half his Level, at 4th level of bloodrager (6 ECL) he gains SR of 8+Level and of course when he gains spell slots he can consume them to heal himself so even when hit he doesn't go down easily. For swashbuckler it gives good deeds, Weapon focus is nice and of course Improved Critcal which would make that Falcata crit at 15-20 which makes him doing one shots a lot easier.

Though not sure how to run him after level 5 on that side, Wondering if picking up Fighter for the rest to use the Mobile or Phalanx Archetype for shield and sword fun, or maybe the shielded archetype though the shield will need to be a buckler due to the Swashbuckler unless I can find a good replacement for Precise Strike.

I'm pretty sure invulnerable rager DR dose not stack with other classes as far as level progression.

You're right I swear I thought Bloodrager had a thing that allowed it to count as a Barbarian for effects.


Someone just pointed out a potential build.
Barbarian(invulnerable Rager) 2/Bloodrager(Untouchable Rager & Spelleater) X//Swashbuckler 5/?X

This gives him DR equal to half his Level, at 4th level of bloodrager (6 ECL) he gains SR of 8+Level and of course when he gains spell slots he can consume them to heal himself so even when hit he doesn't go down easily. For swashbuckler it gives good deeds, Weapon focus is nice and of course Improved Critcal which would make that Falcata crit at 15-20 which makes him doing one shots a lot easier.

Though not sure how to run him after level 5 on that side, Wondering if picking up Fighter for the rest to use the Mobile or Phalanx Archetype for shield and sword fun, or maybe the shielded archetype though the shield will need to be a buckler due to the Swashbuckler unless I can find a good replacement for Precise Strike.


Very true, Polearm master seems more his style. I will give him the intel.


Alright so now that we were talking about my friends build I am kind of wanting to work on a build for a Achilles style character (from the movie Troy especially) maybe throw in some Leonidas style shield and weapon focus.

This is a Gestalt Character
Level 5 maybe
Stats are Here

Weapons & Gear:
Light Steel Shield (Perhaps Quickdraw)
Falcata
Spear
Pilum (x3)

Two Flaws
Shaky -2 to ranged attacks
Murky-Eyed In combat, every time you attack an opponent that has concealment, roll your miss chance twice. If either or both results indicate that you miss, your attack fails.

We use a mix of 3.X
AEG's mercenaries for example is another book we use.
So Laminated Serrated Steel (+1 to damage, +1 to threat range and multiplier) So the Falcata would deal 1d8+1 18-20/x4.
This would simulate his one shotting foes, even if the blade is not perfect.

So a human bonus feat is used for the Weapon Prof for the Falcata

So that means me with 5 feats (3 from Fighter and 2 from flaws)
I was thinking Mobile Fighter would be great on one side. But I am not sure what would go well on the other. I was thinking Ranger which would give a good reflex, and good skills, as well as bonus feats for Shield and weapon style.

Edit: thinking Mithral Breastplate with Armored Kilt would work for theme and style, as well as keeping it at medium armor. With AEG's stuff I can boost the AC bonus of both for just 1800 GP.


Alright, it really limits what you can do with a Swashbuckler, basically cliche or gtho


Dragoon is good for this as well, Dorne did have the best horses in the seven.


Honestly I would have loved to see the Qinggong's ability to be selected each day, or maybe even encounter rather then once and done.


I was looking at the fighter//Investigator build up and I actually think it would work well.

However, I am curious which one to suggest for the fighter side. Phalanx (One Handed + Shield) or Polearm Master (Two-Handed). Investigator.. would any archetype fit better?


Indeed, but not as a shield in the other hand which is what I think the text is meant to imply. Meaning that you cannot have a heavy shield and a rapier and use the rapier to deal damage that turn. After all Heavy Spiked Shield is a weapon not being used as a shield, its being used as a weapon.


I am sorry I know there are tons.

Ok so we are all familiar with "To use this deed, a swashbuckler cannot attack with a weapon in her other hand or use a shield other than a buckler." But my question is... what if I am using a shield bigger then a buckler in the other hand, as my one hand piercing weapon?

I mean to say, say I am fighting with a Shield and Sword combo, and my shield is a heavy spiked shield, it is a one handed piercing weapon. If I shield bashed with this weapon, would I be allowed to add precise strike damage to it so long as I didn't use my sword?


Apparently the vision he gets of this guy is using the Syringe spear and using the shaft and butt of the spear to fight opponents who get in close.

But he could get into the idea of Achilles from the movie Troy. Using Shield, Spear, and Sword.


Well remember he wants to stick to the theme of the fast and agile spearmen.
I think he wants yo be able to cover range and close with the spear because its more iconic and reduces the need for multiple weapons.

Though I might be able to talk him into the shield and spear fellow with a sword for when it gets close. Is that better?


Reach I think the Polearm Master can as a swift action change any reach weapon to be able to fight at normal range for a weapon.


Well Iaijutsu Focus or Iaijutsu Strikes are meant to be a quick sword drawing attack against a foe you are facing off with. In fact Iaijutsu focus comes with full rules on how to duel someone using Iaijutsu Focus as your initiative.

This was another reason I wanted to use this for a build that actually involved the Challenge ability as it could be reworked as a duel. (For them it would be an untrained skill check.)


Alright my friend heard about me posting here and he asked if I could post something to help him get around this block he is hitting.

He wants to play a character that uses Spears or at least Polearms. So he is looking at Polearm Master for one of the sides of this Gestalt Build.

He is basing this character off the character Oberyn Martell at least an influence of that character (Who used a spear in combat.)

But he is not sure what else should be added on the other side. He also considered taking the Phalanx Soldier to make it a spear and shield style fighter, which allows him to one hand a spear or polearm.

He considered taking Swashbuckler so his spear would take benefit of Precise Strike since he would not be two handing the spear and thus losing the benefit of the 1.5x Str.

I jokingly suggested him taking Kasatha as the race and having two arms using long spears, and one shortspear for those who get close. But that would likely not work for his desired build.

Any advice for me to give him?


No real inspiration just this idea of a one armed Samurai.

Ninja just seems odd because of the sneak attack, it doesn't fit the theme since thats not really a straight honorable tactic, though totally useful. I could see it maybe but it just requires a few tweeks in the idea.


Samurai gets the Katana and such as well, and Samurai also gets the Cavalier stuff too. Challenges and the like.

But I will look into that build, and yes I confirmed with the DM.


Imbicatus wrote:
Jeff Merola wrote:
Imbicatus wrote:
Man in the Iron Mask wrote:
I would like to point out if you take the feat Weapon Versatility that any Light or One-handed weapon becomes a option for Swashbucklers, at least according to this thread James Jacob has were he said this.

While I have nothing but respect for JJ, anything he posts rules-wise is not an indication of what the rules are, but just an example of how he would run it in his own game.

In this case, if you use weapon versatility to change the damage type from piercing to slashing, the weapon is not a piercing weapon for the duration of the attack.

JJ was talking about changing to piercing, actually.
In that case, it would work with all the deeds, yes. But you aren't then bypassing any DR/Slashing, so it's a wash.

No but it lets you choose, you come against a foe who has Slashing DR and you switch to it and fight them, it makes sense as it is forcing you to fight outside of your normal style so you would be less efficient.


Flaws not Drawbacks, 3.5 rule.

Flaws

And yes I know it is a bit odd.

Iaijutsu Focus
These seem to be multiplied on Critical hit.

I think I am sort of forced to take
Weapon Focus (Katana)
Slashing Grace (To use deeds)

I am thinking of taking Power Attack to help offset damage with only one hand. Maybe take Quickdraw to give that quick kill and then sheath mechanic
And Maybe Combat Expertise to set up for Improved Fient and the like.

My DM is considering House ruling Iaijutsu focus to work on foes denied their Dex rather then Flat-Footed.


Ok this was a thought I had early this morning. A Samurai or at least Swordsmen with only one arm.

It would be a Gestalt build because I simply prefer that style of game.

Samurai//Swashbuckler seems to be the best idea currently.
Sword Saint Archetype on the Samurai half.

As I said in my other thread we use 3.5 when it works. Hermean's blood is generic enough to allow to add any skills so long as they both relay on the same ability. So I was thinking of adding Iaijutsu focus, as it fits with the Sword Saint archetypes theme.

I may give him the flaw to -2 to hit with a melee weapon or enhance Shaky's -2 to a inability to use ranged weapons period (As he cannot use a bow or the like, and shuriken will likely never come up.)

But suffice it to say I will take two flaws and so thus have more feats.

He would be a human so a total of 4 feats at level one. Which feats should these be if I am focusing on a Samurai using a Katana in one hand.

Edit: Also I need a way to get people Flat-Footed as often as possible.


I would like to point out if you take the feat Weapon Versatility that any Light or One-handed weapon becomes a option for Swashbucklers, at least according to this thread James Jacob has were he said this.


Deadly Agility allows you used Dex in place of Str for weapons that can be finessed via weapon finesse.


It can be. In fact the only thing this character uses of 3.5 is Flaws and the Pounce from Barbarian ACF.


Hello People of the Forums,

I am worried I have poured a lot of effort into a build and idea, but I am concerned I have focused perhaps a little to much on Melee Damage and AC bonuses.

The race of the character is a Kasatha, an alien on a foreign world is always kind of fun to play.

My character is a gestalt build of a Monk and Barbarian. Monk is a Martial Artist and Barbarian is a 3pp Archetype known as the Serene Barbarian.

Serene replaces rage, and acts like a Zen or Combat Trance that allows you to add a +4 Dex and Wis instead of the Str and Con of a normal Rager.

Now as you can guess for a Monk thats a godsend right there.
Wis and Dex is a 20 so +5 to each of those plus the +2 Dodge bonus means at level 1 I have a AC of 22 (Touch AC mind you) that while in serenity goes to 26.

Now we use 3.5 material so long as we can provide were the stuff comes from and its from a book the DM agrees to use. So for example Spirit Lion Totem Barbarian replacement of Fast Movement to allow for Pounce.

As my first level feat I took Multiweapon fighting which according to James Jacob allows me to drop the penalty of using the four arms to a -2 for his main and three ofhands. He confirmed Kasatha use 4 arms and get four attacks.

Well with four arms and four attacks a turn I can honestly say damage output is not an issue for this monk build. As I took two flaws (Shaky and Murky-eyed) to gain Weapon Finesse, and Deadly Agility for his unarmed strikes (Deadly Agility is from Dreamscarred Press's PoW books)

So at level 1 I currently have three feats, Multiweapon fighting, Weapon Finesse, and Deadly Agility. Not including bonus feats like Improved Unarmed Strike and Stunning Fist.

So when Serenity is activated he gains a +2 bonus to hit and damage. Currently he has a 1d6+5 with Serenity this is a 1d6+7. But even with the +5 I can throw four punches as a full attack at level 1.

Am I focusing to much on Damage output and Defensive AC and not yet enough to skills and other abilities and aspects he might have open to him. (I do not want to gimp him)

For the Purpose of this argument assume perfect score of all 18s because at this point it is still theorycrafting as I have yet to use him In Character yet. And I may or may not have a banked score or blackmail on the DM (Kidding)