Irradiated Haggis's page

Irradiated Haggis wrote:

I'd originally considered barbarian, but it's not on the approved class list if you want to play a native of the eastern lands. Neither is fighter - everyone who's a fighter-type in the eastern lands is either a samurai, monk, or ninja, with the bulk of people in the army being warrior NPCs.

Well that's unfortunate and carries some unfortunate implications with it.

Irradiated Haggis wrote:

Also what the heck is a 'mounted combat' feat anyways?

Good question! No exact definition so you have to ask your GM. You can still take your regular bonus feats and it doesn't replace anything. At least as far as I know, unless there's been a recent clarification.

Yeah - it's a shame about fighter, since you can make so many neat things with them. But I totally see where flavor often trumps utility.

So you can still take the regular feats in addition to 'mounted combat feats'. Do you know if the line about not having to meet prerequisites applies to them?

Also I'm pretty sure this got clarified in recent errata/FAQ, but last I read a Sohei DID lose his AC bonus and AC to wisdom in light armor, but COULD flurry in light armor. Stop me if I'm wrong?

The whole Alluring + Arcane Strike thing seems pretty neat, if that's legal.

Well, the samurai's weapon expertise also supports the use of the naginata. Take advantage of a reach build, which allows you to pull off the roles of both a "move and swing" warrior and a 25' wide circle of pain (made all the sweeter when you occasionally get off those x4 crits).

Really, acting as a living obstacle for creatures that want to go after the squishier party members allows you to act as a much more effective deterrent. And what you miss out on crit fishing, you might more than make up for through attacks of opportunity.

So not to practice thread necromancy or anything, but I'm finally back from vacation.

I've spoken with my DM, and he has a list of approved classes which Shou (native Kara-tur-ians) may take in the campaign (Jade Regent, but transported to Faerun via word substitutions, ala Faerun = Golarion).

I'd originally considered barbarian, but it's not on the approved class list if you want to play a native of the eastern lands. Neither is fighter - everyone who's a fighter-type in the eastern lands is either a samurai, monk, or ninja, with the bulk of people in the army being warrior NPCs.

Also Samurai must take the Sword Saint archetype - you can't just be a basic Samurai.

Given that, it seems like if I want to be mounted, my best (aka only) option is the Sohei, where I could totally get an Animal Companion by 5th level, and Boon Companion him up to awesomeness by level 7, using the Nature's Soul / Animal Ally / Boon Companion line. The mount would get my Evasion and stuff, he can take the Bodyguard and In Harm's Way feats, and with Narrow Body could even come into most dungeons.

Credit where credit's due: this idea of Sohei w/ animal companion was totally ripped off from:
http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qfbe?Possible-Monk-Build-Sohei-Animal-Ally-nee d
AndIMustAsk's thread.

Given all of that, is a Sohei playable before level 5 when I'd get my first Animal Companion mount at -3 levels (level 2), or level 6 when I'd get to flurry with a spear? Is the Sohei even any good/fun to play as a class, and is being mounted a good/terrible investment in Jade Regent (please no spoilers).

Lemeres, I don't know much about the reach weapon options, but this 25 foot circle of pain thing sounds interesting. I am intrigued by your ideas and wish to subscribe to your newsletter!

Kaazan, I checked with my DM, and you're right, a Samurai can take other orders! Imagine! So I ended up for my first attempt (we can change anything on our sheets including race and class for the first three sessions we play a character), being a Two-Handed Katana swinger from teh Order of the Dragon, using Bodyguard and In Harm's Way to give allies a scaling bonus to armor against the next attack, then soaking it if they get hit. Probably not the most efficient way to do things, but still... we'll know how it works by tomorrow night.

Williamoak, I looked at a Dex based Wakizashi Samurai, and I couldn't manage to fit all the feats in to make non-challenge damage seem really worth it compared to a two-handed samurai. The best I could come up with is:

1 TWF 1 Weapon Finesse
3 Double Slice
5 Piranha Strike
6 Improved Two-Weapon Fighting
7 Weapon Focus: Wakizashi
9 Improved Critical: Wakizashi
11 Greater Two-Weapon Fighting
12 Two-Weapon Rend
13 Critical Focus
15 Penetrating Strike
17 Greater Penetrating Strike
19 SOMETHING

Without Weapon Specialization or a Fighters Weapon Training / Gloves of Duelling, it looks as though I'm missing out some damage and postponing Penetrating Strike until way down the line. Am I missing something here?

Edit: http://www.d20pfsrd.com/traits/religion-traits/alluring-bolka
If the Alluring trait which gives you Daze as a spell-like ability qualifies as the "Ability to cast arcane spells.", then everyone now qualifies for Arcane Strike... which seems crazy to me, and more than a little cheesy. Is this RAW legal, and how much would I be pushing it by using it if it is?

Also, the Sohei indicates that:

"Bonus Feats
A sohei may select Mounted Combat feats as bonus feats."

It doesn't say that replaces normal bonus feat options. It also doesn't say what levels the different Mounted Combat feats unlock, i.e. 6th, 10th. And this line from the normal monk bonus feats section makes me wonder:

"Bonus Feat
At 1st level, 2nd level, and every 4 levels thereafter, a monk may select a bonus feat. These feats must be taken from the following list:
.......
A monk need not have any of the prerequisites normally required for these feats to select them."

It seems like a question of intended reading and emphasis. Does this mean that:

A. A sohei can take any Mounted Combat feat any time they could take a bonus feat, without meeting the prerequisites?

B. A sohei can take the monk bonus feats listed in the normal monk section without prerequisites, but must meet prerequisites for Mounted Combat feats?

C. A sohei can take ONLY mounted combat feats, and not the normal compliment of feats listed in the monk entry?

Also what the heck is a 'mounted combat' feat anyways? Anything with Mounted Combat feat as a normal prerequisite I presume.

Thanks for your help everyone.

Many of you were helpful the last time I posted here, and I ended up making a very successful Gold Dwarf Cave Druid. Until he died.

I was one of two people in the party doing major damage, and other party members requested someone who could take a few hits, actually hit with something that wasn't a sling at range, and do damage, maybe even lock down enemies.

Since it's an oriental campaign, I thought about making a Samurai in particular, and I looked at the class, and picked out some feats, but I have two points of concern:
1) Samurai, especially with the edicts of Order of the Warrior seems like a worse version of Paladin in almost every respect.
2) What looks like the optimal build at first glance, Two-Handed Crit-Fisher with a Katana or Nodachi, also seems to fall into a category of character that I hate: "I move, and boldly attack, followed by nothing but full-round-attacks." I'm sure this is a great way to deal tons of damage, and since my game plays with a Critical Hit Effects Deck - this might even be entertaining with an eventual crit range of 15-20 with +6 to confirm by level 9. However - there must be a better, or at least more varied way to do things.

I've also considered a ZAM Monk, a Sohei Monk, and a Weapon Adept, Maneuver Master Monk.

To further complicate things, my DM wants to restrict Shou (the asian culture for Jade Empire) to oriental themed classes and archetypes. Here's what he suggested:

Classes: Most Shou choose a class as bushi (fighter), geisha (bard), gunslinger, kensai (magus), monk, ninja, samurai, shugenja (oracle), sohei (monk), yakuza (thug rogue), yokai hunter (ranger), or wu jen (elementalist wizard). The other classes of Faerûn are foreign to their culture.

And here's the feat progression I thought of for the human Samurai.

1 Power Attack 1 Mounted Combat
3 Weapon Focus: Katana
5 Indomitable Mount
6 Furious Focus
7 Weapon Specialization: Katana (or LEADERSHIP)
9 Improved Critical
11 Critical Focus
12 Penetrating Strike
13 Trick Riding
15 Mounted Skirmisher
17 Greater Penetrating Strike
18 Staggering Critical
19 Stunning Critical

I realize that a Rurouni Kenshin style samurai can easily be made with Kensai (Magus), but I'm hoping for a more real-world samurai, one who can fight decently in and out of armor, one who isn't awful at archery, and who can fight while mounted, and use a katana. I realize that's asking a lot in a game where specialization yields superior results - but there's got to be something better than "Move and swing" round after round, right?

I had thought that a 1-2 level dip into Maneuver Master Monk might be nice for the Flurry of Maneuvers ability combined with the Blind feature of Dirty Trick - until I went back and re-read the ability.

"The maneuver master uses his monk level in place of his base attack bonus to determine his CMB for the bonus maneuvers, though all combat maneuver checks suffer a –2 penalty when using a flurry."

So by RAW if you take only one level of monk, your BAB for that extra maneuver is... +1. Pretty awful. However I think you could probably get most sensible DMs to rule that you'd use your monk level or your normal BAB, whichever is higher.

Blinded enemies lose their DEX bonus and are eligible for Sneak Attack independent of any flanking. In theory a TWF build could use this to turn someone into swiss-cheese.

@Jessie. That's completely true, and I hadn't noticed until you pointed it out. The Summoner has his Summon I-VIIII ability that lasts minutes per level instead of rounds/level specifically for when his Eidolon is out of commission. Hunter has NO such ability. I'd probably describe Hunter as unplayable, since the first time the Companion gets hit by Glitterdust or a Pit spell that gets rid of the hunters primary ability, and on his own he's far weaker than a druid or ranger of equal level.

@Irradiated Haggis: Not sure what your AF: wolf would accomplish-- you can only have AF up on one target at a time. So unless there is more than one hunter... :P

I do agree that Animal focus, as what is supposed to be the unique aspects of the class, should be more than a just stat/skill bonus (and if it remains that then at least allow it to stack-- make it morale like a Barbarian rage; uninspired is one thing, uninspired and dysfunctional is inexcusable).

It'd be nice if the Devs would update us on what they plan to do with this class going forward. The thread has been dead for the last couple days since the current class is unexciting and the Devs have been quiet about possible changes.

Good catch on my Aspect Wolf idea - I hadn't considered that. I wasn't intending for that to be the final ability or anything, but I've always found active abilities more fun than passive ones.

Whenever I look at a class I immediately ask 'what does this class allow me to DO that I couldn't otherwise have done?'. In the case of Hunter... the answer is currently nothing. You lose the best tiers of druid spells (7-9), give up Wild Shape, plus some other tasty flavor abilities. From the ranger you lose full BAB, Favored Terrain, Favored Enemy, and Combat Styles.

In return you get... Animal Focus, which really amount to little more in current form than weak temporary buffs which are obsolete the instant you and your party come into any moderate amount of wealth or magic items. It's hard to get excited about having a core class ability that adds +10 to speed or +2 to Dexterity. About as exciting as if the monk's main ability were the enhanced running speed. Oh, also after level 10... no more new abilities for Hunter.

Letting Hunter draw from both ranger and druid spell lists at the appropriate levels would be a start, as would spontaneous casting.

But I don't think the spellcasting is really the problem for me. The Hunter doesn't -feel- like it has any identity of its own.

Some options then:

1) Give Hunter the Trapper Ranger toolkit. It's underused, thematically appropriate, and in light of the Hunters otherwise mediocre ability set, unlikely to unbalance the class.
2) Give the Hunter a limited pool of evolution points (yes you read that correctly) to spend on enhancing the animal companion. Right now the Hunter's animal companion isn't actually any better than the druids, or even the rangers if he took Boon Companion.
3) The animal focuses are at once unappealing and underpowered. None of them let the player DO anything, they're just passive buffs that sit there. You might consider rewriting them into active abilities.

Animal Focus: Wolf -could- read:

"When a creature under the effect of Animal Focus: Wolf scores a critical hit, another creature also under the effect of AF: Wolf may take a 10 foot step. At level 8 this bonus increases to 20 feet. At level 15 it increases to 30 feet."

Animal Focus: Bull -could- read:

"A creature under the effects of Animal Focus: Bull receives the effect of the Endurance feat, and once per day may roll twice on any Will Save and take the better of the two rolls. This ability must be used before the result of the roll has been seen. At level 8 the creature also receives Die Hard, and at level 15, Toughness."

Just my two cents. My DM allows us to change anything about our characters including class for the first three sessions - so I might playtest one at our campaign level (2nd) - but in current form I find even that idea unappealing.

Investigator pretty much obsoletes the Rogue class, I think.

Personally, I think this is a good thing. Paizo isn't going to rewrite a Core class to make it better in any significant way. Having a solid replacement is a good idea, especially since it incorporates many of the things people wanted to toss into the Rogue to fix it.

I'll second this. The rogue class has long suffered from what I call 'Anything You Can Do I Can Do Better'. If your definition of 'rogue' is someone who's stealthy, can open locks, disarm most traps, and deal decent damage rather than being defined by class, then just about anything OTHER than the Rogue class can do it. I would argue that possibly the least competent 'rogue' is the Rogue class. Ninja, Ranger, Alchemist, Bard, Slayer, Investigator, or frankly anyone with decent skill points willing to spend an extra talent to pick up Disable Device and Stealth as in class will probably be more successful. Rogue either needs a complete rewrite and rebalancing with current classes, or should be left in a bin somewhere. The easiest way to do this would probably be to come out with a bunch of Rogue Only (non Ninja, ROGUE ONLY) Talents - and frankly they'd have to be far better than what's currently available.

I'm sure there's lots of people who disagree with me, and I respect your opinions, but when I first downloaded this handbook I took one look at Investigator and thought 'well that's it then'.

Why not straight inquisitor? Ranged inquisitors are quite common, and they can be quite effective at both healing / ranged damage / utility.

Wow! I never even thought about Inquisitor. I usually gloss right over them! I'll check that out. Is there any way for one of them to Reincarnate/Raise dead later? I worry about the high mortality rate I've seen so far.

(Yes it's another <is this a terrible character> thread).

So I recently joined a game of Jade Regent, starting from the beginning (level 1). It's 20 point buy. I volunteered to be a zen archer / healbot.

How can I effectively fill the rolls of primary caster, healing, and ranged damage (anti-air), enough beefiness to take a few hits if (when) the AC monk goes down, with a little left over for utility magics?

Other party members are: a ranger/bard melee mix, an AC monk, and either an eidolon focussed summoner, or an internal alchemist.

So we have arcane casting 'technically' through the summoner, we have utility (bard/ranger), but aside from the eidolon don't have a tank except maybe the monk, and I'm the only ranged.

The DM would rather I didn't use the Cleric class without a kit in combination with Zen Archer (like Shugenja or whatever) since it's not oriental enough to jive with Zen Archer, but I think I can convince him otherwise. He's offered instead to let me use Oracle with Wisdom as a casting stat.

I was thinking Zen Archer 3 / Cleric 17, or ZA 3 / Druid 17 for flavor and a pet tank with Boon Companion and Shaping Focus to make up for the lost druid levels (World Walker or Menhir Savant possibly). It could also be that with Wildshape at 4th level, and a Roc Animal Companion I could skip archery altogether and just fly up to meet the enemy as a straight druid Menhir Savant. I had also seen gnarrrg's Oradin build - and thought that might be nice, but without another primary caster in the party, I think we'd miss the utility spells. It's getting away from Zen Archer, but Hedge Witch with Cauldron would seem to provide adequate healing and arcane utility.

Magic items are randomly generated, and while I don't have much experience with this DM, I don't think we can just go out and buy Wands of Cure Light Wounds off the rack in Ye Olde Magicke Shopppe.

(Gnarrg's Oradin build - http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=13120545#post13120545)

(The title does have Divine in it, but I'm open to all ideas).

(We nearly died in the one-shot when attacked at night by a Chimera - being all human, no one had any bows, or night vision).