Cowabunga_bro's page

At level 5, our fighter is master with bows, and has +1 striking composite longbow. So they are rolling a +16/+11/+6 against a level 5 high AC creature (22) meaning they hit on a 6/11/16 respectively for 2d8+2 (4.5 x 2 + 2= 11).

11 x .50 + (11 x 2 + 5.5) x .25 = 12.375
11 x .45 + (11 x 2 + 5.5) x .05 = 6.775
11 x .20 + (11 x 2 + 5.5) x .05 = 3.575
Average per round of 22.725

Our kineticis has hit his second heightened on the impulse, meaning it deals 6d4 damage per hit. They are still only trained, but have a gate attenuator, so they are rolling a +12, Meaning they hit on a 10.

2.4 x 6 x .5 + 2.4 x 12 x .05 = 8.64 x 3 = 25.92 on average per round.

Meaning the Kineticis is still out damaging the Fighter at maybe the widest spot they have in proficiency before level 13 (fighter legendary), all with a level 1 impulse. Which they can do all day long (if only every other round).

You can only use Magnetic Pinions every other round and its only piercing and bludgeoning damage. A level 1 Barbarian out damages this every round. True that +7 on every attack is great, but it doesn't outdo a martial. Here's my math on it.

To compare its damage to single targets, let's consider max damage output against a barbarian, king of single target damage. At level 1 assuming all attacks hit, Magnetic Pinions (3 Actions) can do 24 damage (6d4). Barbarian can do 60 damage (3*1d10+10) in 3 actions. Next turn, Barbarian does another 60 damage. Kineticist activates aura and does 11 damage Elemental Blast (weapon infusion for added STR = 1d8+3) plus thrown 2 action Elemental Blast for 15 damage (weapon infusion for STR and CON = 1d8+7) totalling 26 damage.

Two turns has Barbarian at 120 damage to single target. Kineticist with Magnetic Pinions does 50 damage. Even on third turn, Barbarian is at 180 damage and Kineticist is at 74, a 106 damage difference. If both crit each of those with max damage, you see that Barbarian is exponentially better at dealing the damage. Kineticist is more likely to hit but isn't going to deal as much damage.

I'd also add that not all classes are equal and saying one can't be stronger than another isn't realistic as shown above.

Am I blind or I'm seeing a very obvious plural on the text?

Quote:

Make ranged impulse attack rolls against up to three creatures within 60 feet of you;

Three attacks, against 1, 2 or 3 targets. No mystery.

Unlike Magic Missile, this is not autohit, it does physical damage, which is easier to resist and you do not combine them for the purposes of resistances and weaknesses. It's also a three actions overflow.

Seems decently balanced to me.

Agreed! Good points.

The issue is that doesn’t say you make up to 3 attacks, it says creatures. Then says all three attacks afterwards. I believe if it was restricting it to 1 attack per target, you’d see that specifically mentioned like Slashing Gust or Scorching Ray do. Comparing its ability to another spell/cantrip is a double edged sword. Just because it is similar doesn’t mean it’s the same. It’s similar to Scorching Ray and Magic Missile which have opposite rulings on targets. Magnetic Pinions is always three actions so I believe it’s always 3 attacks, or else why would it always cost three actions instead of 1 action per pinion. It would rarely be useable and when it is, the damage doesn’t compare other classes abilities or even it’s own elemental blasts.

I will wait to see if there’s an errata on this and in the meantime, rule it for the fun of the game. 24 damage for three actions isn’t game breaking, so far our martials did 20 in a single action, so I’d rather the player have fun.

Hmm… I think I’ll keep with the ruling I’ve made. Up to 3 doesn’t explicitly mean one attack per target. It says immediately after yo make ranged attack rolls (plural) then later “All three attacks” implying you always make three. Magic missile allows 1 action per missile but magnetic pinions is always three actions. I think that’s intentional.

Hello, we have a player in our game who is a metal gate Kineticist. They are attempting to use all three magnetic pinion attacks against one target instead of three separate ones. Ability text:

"Small pieces of metal fly from you, propelled with magnetism at great velocity. Make ranged impulse attack rolls against up to three creatures within 60 feet of you; you gain a +1 circumstance bonus to your attack roll against any target wearing metal armor or made of metal. All three attacks count toward your multiple attack penalty, but it doesn't increase until after all the attacks. The metal pieces deal 1d4 bludgeoning damage and 1d4 piercing damage on a hit (or double damage on a critical hit)."

There isn't language preventing this. On the contrary, it states "up to three creatures" and then afterwards says "All three attacks".

I will add that this ability is not only 3 actions, but is also Overflow meaning it takes your entire turn with no movement and you lose your Kinetic Aura, using an action to recast next turn. This means this ability is only available every other turn.

I've ruled that this CAN target the same enemy with all three pinions as other cantrips/spells in other classes have very specific wording to note if the player can/cannot target the same enemy more than once.

First example is Slashing Gust: "You slash your hand through the air, channeling miniature ripples of air from each finger to slice your enemy. If you have two hands free, you can target two creatures with this spell; otherwise, you target one."

It clearly states it targets one creature per free hand and NOT two gusts against the same enemy.

Second example is Magic Missile: "You send a dart of force streaking toward a creature that you can see. It automatically hits and deals 1d4+1 force damage. For each additional action you use when Casting the Spell, increase the number of missiles you shoot by one, to a maximum of three missiles for 3 actions. You choose the target for each missile individually. If you shoot more than one missile at the same target, combine the damage before applying bonuses or penalties to damage, resistances, weaknesses, and so forth."

This clearly says that you CAN target the same target and adds no confusion.

Can we get an official ruling on Magnetic Pinions whether the wording means that it is meant for 3 separate targets or can all 3 attacks be used similar to magic missile against 1, 2, or 3 targets. Help is appreciated!

Additional Note: Metal Kineticist has so far been received in the community as the lowest tier of Single Gate with low damage or too niche abilities which gives me the belief that this early (level 1) ability was intended to help beef the Metal gate up to match where it lacks punch. If not, in my opinion, there isn't a good reason to take it at all. The composite feats for metal are even lacking.

Thanks!