Archangel 77's page

Archangel 77 wrote:

Maxximilius wrote:

It's a bit more complicated actually : you begin a surprise round by attacking, but unless you have the Deft Palm talent, drawing a concealed weapon is at best a move action (and a surprise round only allows for a standard or move action), so without Deft Palm, the only way to simulate this is : I attack => Surprise round, drawing the concealed weapon => rolling initiative, hoping to go first as to catch the enemy flat-footed (before he can act, otherwise you're doomed). There is also the Underhanded talent and Betrayer feats, with the Bandit archetype. I suggest you to search "underhanded talent" on the forums to find the three different ways you may sneak someone with a concealed weapon through the rules, with and without some talents/feats.

No need to mention Surprise round. Every disscusion I see about hidden weapons people mention surprise round. You don't even need a concealed weapon in the surprise round. It's moot.

Ninja with hidden weapon trick plus quick draw equals a free action to draw a concealed weapon.

So with a free action to draw a concealed weapon can you sneak attack with it? This is in the middle of combat, not the surprise round.

The answer is no. Pathfinder does not have a way of surprising an enemy with a weapon without surprising them entirely. If they know you're there and can see you, it doesn't matter what you attack them with it is not considered surprising enough to catch them flat-footed. All weapons or no weapons, in other words.

However, you could use a Feint action to make them flat-footed in this case (and since you're attempting to misdirect them by attacking with a previously hidden weapon, I'm imagining that this is what you'd be doing). At best you could house-rule that you can do Feint with a sleight of hand check to feint if attacking with a hidden weapon (using their perception mod to set DC instead of sense motive). But house rules are house rules and not RAW.

Okay that was my fear. I looked everywhere and couldn't find anything on it. Thought it would be cool for a ninja but i guess that would be overpowered for the ninja.

It's a bit more complicated actually : you begin a surprise round by attacking, but unless you have the Deft Palm talent, drawing a concealed weapon is at best a move action (and a surprise round only allows for a standard or move action), so without Deft Palm, the only way to simulate this is : I attack => Surprise round, drawing the concealed weapon => rolling initiative, hoping to go first as to catch the enemy flat-footed (before he can act, otherwise you're doomed). There is also the Underhanded talent and Betrayer feats, with the Bandit archetype. I suggest you to search "underhanded talent" on the forums to find the three different ways you may sneak someone with a concealed weapon through the rules, with and without some talents/feats.

No need to mention Surprise round. Every disscusion I see about hidden weapons people mention surprise round. You don't even need a concealed weapon in the surprise round. It's moot.

Ninja with hidden weapon trick plus quick draw equals a free action to draw a concealed weapon.

So with a free action to draw a concealed weapon can you sneak attack with it? This is in the middle of combat, not the surprise round.

If you have the sneak attack ability and attack a foe with a concealed weapon (sucessful sleight of hand check) are they considered flat-footed and you get sneak attack damage?

I know it was like this in 3.5 but can not find it exactly mentioned in Pathfinder.