Duelling Spear - Common in any Culture


Rules Discussion

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My grasp on Golarion lore is not the best. Is there any culture in Golarion where the dueling spear from the grand bazaar might pop up, making it a valid choice for selecting unconventional weaponry?


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Well, it certainly seems like there should be but the online resources aren't I'm looking at aren't saying who.

If you are playing a martial class (one that has martial weapon proficiency) the biggest thing you're getting is assured access to the item. Which you can also just negotiate with your GM. If your playing a class with simple weapon proficiency, it's a much bigger deal because it lets you treat the weapon as simple.


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Unconventional Weaponry is one of those things where "what it does" is ultimately left up to the GM. There's probably not a culture where, like, the bladed hoop is common but letting humans get the proficiency bump in any advanced weapon with an ancestry feat is a little too good.

So my advice would be to ask the GM about "if I wanted to use a dueling spear, is there a particular culture that my character could hail from?"

If you already have martial proficiency and you just want access you can skip unconventional weaponry and say "I'm from Absalom originally" since they canonically sell those there.


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PossibleCabbage wrote:
Unconventional Weaponry is one of those things where "what it does" is ultimately left up to the GM. There's probably not a culture where, like, the bladed hoop is common but letting humans get the proficiency bump in any advanced weapon with an ancestry feat is a little too good.

The the gnome flickmace comes to mind.


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PossibleCabbage wrote:
If you already have martial proficiency and you just want access you can skip unconventional weaponry and say "I'm from Absalom originally" since they canonically sell those there.

Yeah, sounds about right: all the uncommon weapons from The Unscathed Blade can be found there. Only Dueling spear and Tonfa from that book are uncommon with no mention of access and Tian Xia seems like a good guess for the Tonfa.

PossibleCabbage wrote:
There's probably not a culture where, like, the bladed hoop is common but letting humans get the proficiency bump in any advanced weapon with an ancestry feat is a little too good.

I think Circus would work for culture or if a country/nationality is needed, the Varisian Wanderer background nets you Circus Lore for "wandering the lands of Varisia and beyond among the brightly painted wagons of a Varisian caravan" so Varisia seems like a fit.


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Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
graystone wrote:
PossibleCabbage wrote:
If you already have martial proficiency and you just want access you can skip unconventional weaponry and say "I'm from Absalom originally" since they canonically sell those there.
Yeah, sounds about right: all the uncommon weapons from The Unscathed Blade can be found there. Only Dueling spear and Tonfa from that book are uncommon with no mention of access and Tian Xia seems like a good guess for the Tonfa.

It also works for Dueling Spear, as the physical description given is literally just the Monk's Spade with a different name attached.


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HenshinFanatic wrote:
graystone wrote:
PossibleCabbage wrote:
If you already have martial proficiency and you just want access you can skip unconventional weaponry and say "I'm from Absalom originally" since they canonically sell those there.
Yeah, sounds about right: all the uncommon weapons from The Unscathed Blade can be found there. Only Dueling spear and Tonfa from that book are uncommon with no mention of access and Tian Xia seems like a good guess for the Tonfa.
It also works for Dueling Spear, as the physical description given is literally just the Monk's Spade with a different name attached.

Not quite, but its easy to see the region create something like the dueling blade given they created the monk spade.

For reference, the monk spade is a crescent that's designed to keep animals at bay, while the dueling spear is a fork designed to disarm opponents. Yes there is a difference between crescent and fork.


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Red Griffyn wrote:
My grasp on Golarion lore is not the best. Is there any culture in Golarion where the dueling spear from the grand bazaar might pop up, making it a valid choice for selecting unconventional weaponry?

Just play an Absolimian. just about every Uncommon item is available in Absalom. It's clearly stated in the rules.

Sczarni

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Red Griffyn wrote:
the dueling spear from the grand bazaar

In case you're asking for a Pathfinder Society character, you can actually just gain Access to items from the individual shops of the Bazaar via their respective downloadable Boons, including the Dueling Spear ^_^


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Temperans wrote:


Not quite, but its easy to see the region create something like the dueling blade given they created the monk spade.

For reference, the monk spade is a crescent that's designed to keep animals at bay, while the dueling spear is a fork designed to disarm opponents. Yes there is a difference between crescent and fork.

Actually, that's not exactly what it says, and I quote:
The Grand Bazaar pg. 105 wrote:
this spear has a spade-like blade at one end and a forked blade at the other

(emphasis mine).

Now for anyone who hasn't seen what a monk's spade looks like here's a wiki link, the image should be on the right. I'd call that blade at the bottom a forked blade personally, and it certainly would be

The Grand Bazaar pg. 105 wrote:
effective at wrenching a weapon from an enemy's grasp.

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Ravingdork wrote:
just about every Uncommon item is available in Absalom. It's clearly stated in the rules.

Reference? Saying it's stated clearly, but not mentioning where is a little unhelpful.

Sovereign Court

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I think he's referring to this bit from the Absalom book:

P 6 wrote:

City at the Center of the World Absalom is the largest city in the Inner Sea region

and is strategically placed to be an ideal staging point for trade. Imports from
all over the world, and even from the bottom of the oceans, can be found in
Absalom’s many markets and bazaars. Items that would normally be considered
uncommon are instead considered common while within the city walls. Some
uncommon items, such as those created by specific organizations or hailing from
remote regions, might still remain uncommon at the GM’s discretion.

Should be noted that this doesn't apply in PFS.


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Ascalaphus wrote:

I think he's referring to this bit from the Absalom book:

P 6 wrote:

City at the Center of the World Absalom is the largest city in the Inner Sea region

and is strategically placed to be an ideal staging point for trade. Imports from
all over the world, and even from the bottom of the oceans, can be found in
Absalom’s many markets and bazaars. Items that would normally be considered
uncommon are instead considered common while within the city walls. Some
uncommon items, such as those created by specific organizations or hailing from
remote regions, might still remain uncommon at the GM’s discretion.
Should be noted that this doesn't apply in PFS.

That's the one.

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Aha - and availability inside Absalom is not necessarily the same as availability to a person from Absalom.


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HenshinFanatic wrote:
Temperans wrote:


Not quite, but its easy to see the region create something like the dueling blade given they created the monk spade.

For reference, the monk spade is a crescent that's designed to keep animals at bay, while the dueling spear is a fork designed to disarm opponents. Yes there is a difference between crescent and fork.

Actually, that's not exactly what it says, and I quote:
The Grand Bazaar pg. 105 wrote:
this spear has a spade-like blade at one end and a forked blade at the other

(emphasis mine).

Now for anyone who hasn't seen what a monk's spade looks like here's a wiki link, the image should be on the right. I'd call that blade at the bottom a forked blade personally, and it certainly would be

The Grand Bazaar pg. 105 wrote:
effective at wrenching a weapon from an enemy's grasp.

That's a crescent blade not a forked blade. I know they look similar because of the crescent having 2 points. But its like calling a ranseur a trident because the ranseur has a crescent hilt giving it three points.


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YogoZuno wrote:
Aha - and availability inside Absalom is not necessarily the same as availability to a person from Absalom.

Fair point.


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YogoZuno wrote:
Aha - and availability inside Absalom is not necessarily the same as availability to a person from Absalom.

You could say the same thing about the katana. Availability of uncommon items becomes meaningless if you're splitting hairs that closely.

Sovereign Court

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Well it's always been the idea of uncommon items that they may require you to travel to a place that has them, instead of being able to get them anywhere. Absalom happens to be a place that has almost anything.

For katanas, it's actually the weird thing that someone from Tian Xia still has easy access to katanas deep in the Mwangi. It's more a rule of convenience than that it really makes sense.


Ascalaphus wrote:

Well it's always been the idea of uncommon items that they may require you to travel to a place that has them, instead of being able to get them anywhere. Absalom happens to be a place that has almost anything.

For katanas, it's actually the weird thing that someone from Tian Xia still has easy access to katanas deep in the Mwangi. It's more a rule of convenience than that it really makes sense.

It makes more sense at character creation than purchasing items midway through the game. Midway through, it might be easier to flavor if the character in question has crafting or a teammate they could share the formula with. The formula access rules are weird but handwaving the feat as granting the formula makes it easy enough, and you could even comission a local smith to make the weapon for you if you give them the specs.

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