Yet Another PFS Question

[Selter Sago de'Morcaine PFS]

I was going to buy a few durable adamantine sling stones for my druid and durable adamantine arrows for my inquisitor.

However, I’ve been told that in PFS specifically I have to buy a stack of 50 of them. I really have no desire for and certainly can’t afford 50 of them. Is this true?

If I can purchase a small number:
Anyone know how to get it to work in herolabs?
How many would you suggest I purchase? I was thinking just 3-4 but I’m not sure that is enough.

[Ascalaphus]

I'm not aware of any such rule.

[Richard D Webb]

Must be purchased in full lots, 20 for mundane, 50 for magical.

[Selter Sago de'Morcaine PFS]

So does durable adamantine count as mundane or magical?

Not that I really wanted to buy 20 of them but I suppose that is better than 50.

[GM Lamplighter]

EDIT: Basically, you have to buy it in the amounts listed in the rules for the item you are buying, you can't just do the math and work out individual costs unless they are listed that way.

BUT - don't ever buy adamantine ammunition! Adamantine weapon sheen is much more economical. (IMHO)

[Jeff Merola]

Durable arrows have a lot size of one, so you buy them one at a time.

GM Lamplighter wrote:

EDIT: Basically, you have to buy it in the amounts listed in the rules for the item you are buying, you can't just do the math and work out individual costs unless they are listed that way.

BUT - don't ever buy adamantine ammunition! Adamantine weapon sheen is much more economical. (IMHO)

Not true. Adamantine Durable Arrows cost 61 GP each, bypass DR AND hardness (blanch doesn't touch hardness) and are reusable. You only have to fire them 7 times each for them to be more economical than weapon blanched ones, and that's ignoring the hardness difference.

[Selter Sago de'Morcaine PFS]

Jeff Merola wrote:

Durable arrows have a lot size of one, so you buy them one at a time. ...

How do I confirm that statement?

The hardness is the main reason I was considering it. I haven't run any of the tech scenarios yet, but was planning on it for the near future.
As I understand it most of my spells won't harm them and I will have a hard time doing enough damage to consistently get through.

My other characters are high enough level that they have plenty of options.

Anyone know how to buy just one in Herolabs?

[Jeff Merola]

I can't help you with hero labs, but for the other bit:

Alchemy Manual, Page 20 wrote:

The listed costs are for one non-masterwork alchemical arrow; a masterwork version costs 6 gp more than the listed price. Unless otherwise noted, 20 arrows weigh 3 pounds.

Elves of Golarion contains the same language, if you're using that as your source instead.

[wmullen]

Selter Sago de'Morcaine PFS wrote:

Jeff Merola wrote:

Durable arrows have a lot size of one, so you buy them one at a time. ...

Anyone know how to buy just one in Herolabs?

You can't buy just one in Hero Labs, but the whole lot.

However, you can "Split Stack" into two stacks. Make one stack with the number of arrows you want. then sell the other stack. The Split Stack function is under the Move to New Congtainer button.

Will

[Selter Sago de'Morcaine PFS]

wmullen wrote:

Selter Sago de'Morcaine PFS wrote:

Jeff Merola wrote:

Durable arrows have a lot size of one, so you buy them one at a time. ...

Anyone know how to buy just one in Herolabs?

You can't buy just one in Hero Labs, but the whole lot.

However, you can "Split Stack" into two stacks. Make one stack with the number of arrows you want. then sell the other stack. The Split Stack function is under the Move to New Congtainer button.

Will

Aha! Thanks muchly.

[Woran]

Hey, that is actually a smart thing to remember. You have to buy a full stack, but I dont think there is anything keeping you from selling a certain amount for 50%.

[GM Lamplighter]

Thanks, Jeff - with Season 6 and the greater use of adamantine, I think the math has changed since I did my calculations (which I think were also done before durable arrows were legal).

[BartonOliver]

GM Lamplighter wrote:

Thanks, Jeff - with Season 6 and the greater use of adamantine, I think the math has changed since I did my calculations (which I think were also done before durable arrows were legal).

In general terms, you were correct that blanches are more cost effective for archers (or gunslingers), the only problems is that adamantine blanches only work for DR. As an archer DR is probably not a concern (depending on level), whereas hardness is/can be due to clustered shots. That being said the addition of durable is really what makes the adamantine arrows shine.

[kinevon]

BartonOliver wrote:

GM Lamplighter wrote:

Thanks, Jeff - with Season 6 and the greater use of adamantine, I think the math has changed since I did my calculations (which I think were also done before durable arrows were legal).

In general terms, you were correct that blanches are more cost effective for archers (or gunslingers), the only problems is that adamantine blanches only work for DR. As an archer DR is probably not a concern (depending on level), whereas hardness is/can be due to clustered shots. That being said the addition of durable is really what makes the adamantine arrows shine.

Well, it is the main thing that makes them affordable.

61 gold apiece, buying, say, 10 of them, is 610 gp, but they can be used, pretty much, over and over.

60 gold apiece, in addition to the cost, runs you 1201 gp for 20 that are, mostly, single use. If it hits, it is destroyed. If it misses, you have a 50% chance of recovering it.

Which is why adamantine blanch is a "better" choice for limited usage.

[MeriDoc-]

There is also a boon for buying 10 round lots.

[LazarX]

Selter Sago de'Morcaine PFS wrote:

Jeff Merola wrote:

Durable arrows have a lot size of one, so you buy them one at a time. ...

How do I confirm that statement?

The hardness is the main reason I was considering it. I haven't run any of the tech scenarios yet, but was planning on it for the near future.
As I understand it most of my spells won't harm them and I will have a hard time doing enough damage to consistently get through.

My other characters are high enough level that they have plenty of options.

Anyone know how to buy just one in Herolabs?

Buy the stack and then sell down.

[Selter Sago de'Morcaine PFS]

Thanks guys.
I never considered buying the whole bunch then selling most of them.

Any suggestions on how many I should buy?

[Ascalaphus]

Just buy 20 and keep them. Sometimes you'll need to loan them to less-prepared fellow PCs.

[LazarX]

Selter Sago de'Morcaine PFS wrote:

Thanks guys.

I never considered buying the whole bunch then selling most of them.

Any suggestions on how many I should buy?

Enough for at least 5 rounds of shooting.

[Nefreet]

There is no such thing as a "Durable" sling stone, though.

Durable Arrows are a specific item.

There is no "Durable" quality that can be applied to other ammunition.

[Jeff Merola]

Nefreet wrote:

There is no such thing as a "Durable" sling stone, though.

Durable Arrows are a specific item.

There is no "Durable" quality that can be applied to other ammunition.

Eh, not quite. You're correct that you can't have a Durable sling stone, you can apply it to any non-gun ammo that does piercing damage.

Alchemy Manual wrote:

Other Types of Ammunition: While Kyonin archers prefer alchemical arrows to other missile weapons, characters can infuse other ammunition and thrown weapons that deal piercing damage (such as crossbow bolts, darts, and shuriken) with alchemical effects. Aside from differing base statistics, these alternative types of alchemical ammunition have effects identical to the alchemical arrows listed here. However, firearm ammunition can’t be imbued with alchemical ingredients, nor can ammunition types that don’t deal piercing damage.

[Selter Sago de'Morcaine PFS]

Carp!

Ok, my druid is rapidly running out of options.

[Nefreet]

Ah. Was that text in Elves of Golarion?

That's the source I've been using thus far.

[Jeff Merola]

Nefreet wrote:

Ah. Was that text in Elves of Golarion?

That's the source I've been using thus far.

Partially. Elves of Golarion has text that allows for arrows and crossbow bolts, but not anything else. So you'd need the Alchemy Manual for things like shuriken.

[WilliamD763]

Jeff Merola wrote:

[Eh, not quite. You're correct that you can't have a Durable sling stone, you can apply it to any non-gun ammo that does piercing damage.

Alchemy Manual wrote:

Other Types of Ammunition: While Kyonin archers prefer alchemical arrows to other missile weapons, characters can infuse other ammunition and thrown weapons that deal piercing damage (such as crossbow bolts, darts, and shuriken) with alchemical effects. Aside from differing base statistics, these alternative types of alchemical ammunition have effects identical to the alchemical arrows listed here. However, firearm ammunition can’t be imbued with alchemical ingredients, nor can ammunition types that don’t deal piercing damage.

Interesting, so do you think it would be possible to apply this to:

Halflings of Galorion wrote:

Sharpstones: A thin layer of baked clay covers the spikes and jagged ridges covering this specially designed bullet. A proficient user knows how to crack the clay (a free action) so that it peels off from either the spikes or ridges when fired, dealing either piercing or slashing damage..

Although from the description you might have to put more clay on it before trying to fire again without shredding your sling.

[BigNorseWolf]

Eyup Its ammo.