Hello, just trying to get a grasp on how these rules work together. I have a character who can pretty reliably stealth under some extreme circumstances, along with a player in a similar situation. Trying to get a better grasp on these now before they may come up. These are my thoughts,writing this to get them down and solidified, but also to make sure they are rightish:) Let me know what you think.
1) Glitterdust & Invisibility - My reading of this says that you still get the +20/40 from invisibility, but then you take a -40 to stealth. So, My character with greater invisibility, glitterdust and +40 to stealth will have a total of +20 to stealth while under both effects. Glitterdust and my score effectively cancel each other out and the +20 from invisibility kicks in. This of course assuming you are in a situation to stealth (such as hellcats, hips, concealment)
2) Faerie Fire & Invisibility - I read this as it cancels invisibility and adds a -20. So the character above would be at a straight 0 on his stealth. This seems like the worst spell for a stealth character to be hit with.
3) Faerie Fire, Darkness, HIPS, Hellcats Stealth - So obviously, faerie fire and darkness is a no go on stealth. I believe it also cancels out HIPS. But it should still work with hellcat's stealth, albeit at a -20.
4) See invisibility while stealthing & invisible - I have had a few GM's rule this against my thinking, but my belief is see invisible doesn't see you if a) you can stealth normally in the situation your in (such as HIPS in darkness) and B) your stealth score (not including invisibility) beats their perception. This could also go for invisibility purge.
I thought there was more but thats all I can think of. Any thoughts/opinions would be appreciated.
I think the short answer is if you're hit with these you're not stealthing anywhere.
1) Glitterdust & Invisibility - My reading of this says that you still get the +20/40 from invisibility, but then you take a -40 to stealth.
This part makes me think you're not gaining anything from invisibility anymore.
visibly outlining invisible things for the duration of the spell.
If you have a visible outline I don't think you're all that invisible anymore.
2) Faerie Fire & Invisibility - I read this as it cancels invisibility and adds a -20. So the character above would be at a straight 0 on his stealth. This seems like the worst spell for a stealth character to be hit with.
Druids get a LOT of anti stealth abilities.
3) Faerie Fire, Darkness, HIPS, Hellcats Stealth - So obviously, faerie fire and darkness is a no go on stealth. I believe it also cancels out HIPS. But it should still work with hellcat's stealth, albeit at a -20.
From farie fire: A pale glow surrounds and outlines the subjects. Outlined subjects shed light as candles.
In a dark room I don't see how you could hide with a light source, much less if you are the light source.
In a lit room you'd be at a -30: 20 from the farie fire and 10 from the hellcat stealth. Farie fire also gets rid of blur, displacement, invisibility, or similar effects. The "similar effects" could include whatever mechanism it is that hellcat stealth uses, because hellcats use the light to make themselves blurry.
4) See invisibility while stealthing & invisible - I have had a few GM's rule this against my thinking, but my belief is see invisible doesn't see you if a) you can stealth normally in the situation your in (such as HIPS in darkness) and B) your stealth score (not including invisibility) beats their perception. This could also go for invisibility purge.
I think you'd be ok hiding from the see invisibility spell but i can see the other wording.
There are two components to stealth. First, you must have concealment or cover; if you don't have those things, you cannot make a stealth check. Once you have concealment or cover, then you can make a stealth check against any observer's perception check.
1) Invisibility grants you concealment, so you can always make stealth checks even without cover. Glitterdust "visibly outlines" creatures; this is unfortunately quite vague and different GM's will have different interpretations of what it means. I would interpret to mean that it removes the concealment bonus of invisibility. This would not prevent you from making a stealth check if you had cover, nor would it prevent you from benefitting from the stealth bonus from invisibility.
2) Faerie Fire prevents you from benefitting from concealment provided by non-magical darkness, blur, displacement, or invisibility. However, if you can otherwise meet the prerequisites to make a stealth check then faerie fire will not stop it (you just take a -20). You would still benefit from the stealth bonus on invisibility, since faerie fire doesn't negate that.
3) Magical darkness would trump faerie fire, but the concealment from non-magical darkness would indeed be cancelled by the spell. Hide in Plain Sight would not be affected by faerie fire, as it does not require you to have concealment to function. Hellcat Stealth would be unaffected. You would still take the stealth penalty of faerie fire in all cases in all cases above.
4) See Invisibility cancels all the effects of your invisibility spell, but you're still free to use regular old non-magical stealth. Of course, you require either cover or concealment so an invisible character who is unaware of the see invisibility spell is probably going to step out in the open and reveal themselves.
Alright, two totally different perspectives:) I guess the rules are not very well spelled out in this area.