Question on Witch Hexes...


Rules Questions


Just want to clarify...

The Slumber Hex (as one example) is noted as (Su) which means it is a Supernatural Ability.

According to Su abilities, they can not be dispelled, counter-spelled and ignore any spell resistance. Is this correct?


Yes, that is correct. Also qualifies for Ability Focus.


RigaMortus wrote:

Just want to clarify...

The Slumber Hex (as one example) is noted as (Su) which means it is a Supernatural Ability.

According to Su abilities, they can not be dispelled, counter-spelled and ignore any spell resistance. Is this correct?

Correct.

Work with your GM or player if it's causing issues.

Sovereign Court

Yup! Works really well with the hex evil eye and/or accursed hex. Can push it further with a party member that's free to coupe de grace.

Sczarni

Keep in mind that Slumber is still a magical sleep effect. If you're immune to sleep, like an elf, or have bonuses to saves vs. enchantment effects, you have less to fear from Slumber. And many hexes are mind-affecting, as well. I see people forget that all the time.

Silver Crusade

They also don't provoke AoOs.

And only evil eye is mind-affecting, at least in the APG.


Anzyr wrote:
Yes, that is correct. Also qualifies for Ability Focus.

Uh-oh. This again.

Just do yourself a favor and have a little chat with your GM before taking ability focus... and make sure you both read the feat.


Why would it be an issue?


Because "special attack", the prerequisite for Ability Focus, is ill-defined outside of monster stat blocks. So this remains a point of contention inless and until an official definition of "special attack" is written that definitively categorizes (N)PCs.

Basically, there are no specific published rules for translating a character to a monster stat block. This despite the fact that there are obviously jillions of such stat blocks published.

My advice: Find a witch stat block in some Paizo module and see whether offensive hexes are listed in the Special Attacks field. If so, they're Ability Focus-able. And try not to think about the fact that monster stat blocks for NPCs have errors all the time.

Or just make a call and move on.

Sczarni

blahpers wrote:
My advice: Find a witch stat block in some Paizo module and see whether offensive hexes are listed in the Special Attacks field. If so, they're Ability Focus-able. And try not to think about the fact that monster stat blocks for NPCs have errors all the time.

Spoiler:
In The Haunting of Hinojai you face a witch, and in her statblock, under "Special Attacks", she has her hexes listed. She also has Ability Focus listed amongst her feats.

Granted, I totally accept that statblocks have errors all the time, but I'd think that's pretty strong evidence regardless.


I agree. It would be much simpler if there was a definition for such a vague term.

For my table (house rule time): Ability Focus works on any ability that (a) isn't a spell, spell-like ability or a weapon attack (iterative or natural) and (b) imparts a saving throw to its target. This would include channeling energy, hexes, and various supernatural and extraordinary abilities. It excludes spell-like abilities because there already exist other monster feats to improve those, and these place some restrictions on their use. Since there is no way to increase general spell-like ability DCs with a feat, I use a custom Heighten Spell-Like Ability feat that works the way you'd expect by extrapolating from the Empower and Quicken Spell-Like Ability feats.


If hexes are consistently under special attacks (there are two specific examples plus all of Reign of Winter), isn't that a clear indication of what they are?

Sczarni

Hence why I said, "pretty strong evidence".


Many players and GMs don't own any published adventure paths or modules with NPC witches. They ought to be able to figure out whether hexes are special attacks without such things.

Sczarni

Gee, too bad there isn't some sort of online forum where they could go to ask questions about such things...


: )

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