Hi Bladeweaver,
Just a few suggestions from a neighborhood friendly magus.
I would not take the vital strike feats, as you cannot use them in conjunction with spellstrike, which is its own separate action. You cannot use it with spell combat, because that is its own full round action.
I would not pick up enduring blade, because in my experience, even if it lasts 14 minutes per augmentation (at level 14), usually at least 14 minutes seem to go by in between encounters. Draining the resources of a party is a good way for GM's to make encounters memorable, in my experience, and I believe they do so with good reason.
One of my favorite magus tricks is to take the Pool Strike feats, but only if you are able to add the magic weapon property Conductive to your sword. This will give you incredible bang-for-your-buck if used in conjunction with a spell combat/spell strike. I've not seen an official ruling on whether you can enchant a black blade, and I'd rather not spark the discussion.
If you are going for a dex-based build, why not give Dervish Dance a peep and use a scimitar? You're already halfway there, since you have Weapon Finesse, and you will then be adding Dex to damage. Plus, I believe a dueling sword is a 19-20 threat range, whereas a scimitar would net you an 18-20 range... crit is king, since you have the unique ability to spell-crit with your weapon's crit range.
I have seen the merit of playing both Dex based and Strength based Magus builds, and I much prefer the Strength based... here is why!
- As a Kensai Magus, you are adding your Int to your AC and later, to your initiative. You will almost always go first, and getting hit... well. Let's talk about...
-Spell Shield. This is the first arcana I picked up as a magus and I still use it like crazy. Since you will not be able to use a shield, this is money.
-Improved Unarmed Strike/Crane Style/Crane Wing (UC). These feats were made for magi, duelists, and monks! If that one wayward shot gets through, you have an instant deflection. If you want to build a truly unstoppable destructive force, consider Deflect Arrows at some point!
-Ghost Blade and Bane Blade are awesome choices.
-If you are considering a dip, Barbarian would net you a rage (which I would later use in conjunction with Transformation) that will increase your strength even further. I dipped into Alchemist with my magus, and I adore it... but of course you can modify your mutagen to whichever stat you please.
-Consider: Arcane Accuracy (UM10) and Accurate Strike (UC54) arcanas. Your BAB is working against you here, and an opponent's AC is like another form of spell resistance you have to bypass when using Spellstrike. I rely on them both heavily in varying circumstances, and they are both excellent to have.
-Prescient Attack is pretty good. Here is why: eventually, you will add your Int mod to damage when an opponent is flat-footed. If you ever obtain sneak attack, this becomes even nicer. I would not go with Prescient Defense, especially if you are dex based, since your reflex saves will be good.
If you are planning on staying Kensai Magus forever, and just love the melee aspect the archetype brings, consider looking into the Critical feats. You qualify for these using your Kensai level as a BAB, and they can be quite fun.
Arcanas and Feats are a precious commodity! Find what you love about the class and build yourself around it.
You can be damage, support, or even 'tank.' Each job has its merits, but you won't be happy until your find the one you enjoy most.
Happy Spellstriking!
-Abs
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You are recommending an aweful lot of Swift/Immediate Action powers there. I find Swift Action economy to be something a Magus has to keep a close eye on, though YMMV depending on the exact build.
I think DEX based is smarter for Kensai since they don't want to really wear anything more than Silken Cermonial Armor. Though going Blade Bound also would pretty much require Dervish Dance for a Dex based build since you can't put Agile on a Blackblade.
I've not seen an official ruling on whether you can enchant a black blade, and I'd rather not spark the discussion.
-Improved Unarmed Strike/Crane Style/Crane Wing (UC). These feats were made for magi, duelists, and monks! If that one wayward shot gets through, you have an instant deflection....
As a Kensai, I prefer the Snake Style tree. With Snake Fang every opponent that misses provokes an AoO. With an 18 int 18 dex, you have 9 AoOs a round. You won't get that one deflect, but they will probably already be dead.
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Under current rules, a magus cannot fight defensively while using spell combat. Crane style requires the user to fight defensively.
The developers have stated they are discussing this issue, but have not posted a resolution.l
Don't bother with enduring blade: combat should not be lasting 2 minutes.
You won't be dealing much for damage until you hit 3rd level and take Dervish Dance. With a Bladebound Kensai, this is the earliest option for Dexterity to damage. The only other option is a 1 level dip into Aldori Swordlord at 6th level.
Don't bother with vital strike, you cannot combine it with Spell Combat.
What do the rest of your stats look like. If you dump everything else for Dex/Int, you'll find you are a one-trick pony.
The one flaw I see with the Snake style is that all my AOOs it grants need to be unarmed strikes.
True, but it makes Chill Touch and Frostbite significantly more interesting. All touch spells can be delivered by an unarmed attack.
@ Artoo:
Have you an official ruling to support vital strike + spellstrike? I have seen many arguments, but no facts. I personally believe that the only way this would work is it you cast the touch spell (standard action), held the charge, and waited for your next turn to vital strike, thereby bypassing the 'two' standard actions needed in one round to do this.
OF COURSE, you could always cast a swift action Shocking Grasp...I don't see why that wouldn't work.
See context: "...whenever a magus casts a spell with a range of "touch" from the magus spell list, he can deliver the spell through any weapon he is wielding as part of a melee attack. Instead of the free melee touch attack normally allowed to deliver the spell, a magus can make one free melee attack with his weapon as part of casting this spell...
It is not the spell cast that is free. That is still a standard action. The attack is a free action.
Also, a conductive weapon would allow you to spellstrike a shocking grasp (or other spell) AND discharge your pool strike by spending two uses of it, hence why I referred to it as a 'trick' and not the status quo. But just in case... let me go reread spellstrike as you suggested. Nope, hasn't changed. ;)
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You won't be dealing much for damage until you hit 3rd level and take Dervish Dance. With a Bladebound Kensai, this is the earliest option for Dexterity to damage. The only other option is a 1 level dip into Aldori Swordlord at 6th level.
Or a 1 level dip into Dawnflower Dervish. But it sounds like the OP wants to go Strength based anyway.
XMorsX: I dont think you can combine sohei and MoMS monk, they both do somthing to Flurry.
I see no problem with the sword lord PC.
But from a pure mechanical POW the sicmetar and derwish dance feat is better because of the extra crit range.
Arcane strike wont see alot of use since you often will use the swifts for somthing better. same goes with the dueling mastery feat +2 shield looks good but it wont stack with a shield spell
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Arcane strike wont see alot of use since you often will use the swifts for somthing better. same goes with the dueling mastery feat +2 shield looks good but it wont stack with a shield spell
As a bladebound kensai, you only receive 1 Arcana before 12th level and do not receive spell recall. Arcane strike is something that will see heavy usage.
This is not theory crafting, this is my in-game experience playing more than one bladebound kensai.
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Arcane strike wont see alot of use since you often will use the swifts for somthing better. same goes with the dueling mastery feat +2 shield looks good but it wont stack with a shield spellAs a bladebound kensai, you only receive 1 Arcana before 12th level and do not receive spell recall. Arcane strike is something that will see heavy usage.
This is not theory crafting, this is my in-game experience playing more than one bladebound kensai.
And my in-game experience with my Bladebound Kensai contradicts that. I chose not to go with Arcane Strike because I seldom have a Swift Action available until at least the third round of combat and I have several useful Interrupts I would never get to use if I kept hogging up my Swift Actions with Arcane Strike. Obviously, whether or not Arcane Strike is viable will depend a lot on the build and tactics.
Also, with Elven Favored Class bonus and the Extra Arcana feat he could easily have 5 Arcana before 12th level.
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Bladebound Kensai huh? Well, if you start late enough in the game to have magical Haramaki (or if you prefer the flavor, silken ceremonial robes) and all of your Int to AC, you can easily make a viable Str build. However, starting at level 1, you probably want to go with a Dex build instead so you can have some real AC (unless you decide to pump your Str, Con AND Int). If you want to blow the feats to qualify for Swordlord Prestige, you should be fine (I have not met a single GM who would say being proficient with a weapon=/=having the proficiency feat), It seems actualy rather Optimal (Minus the loss of an 18-20 crit. You only lose out on a 10% crit chance though, and you get dex to damage with a bigger base die, so it seems like a fair trade).
XMorsX: I dont think you can combine sohei and MoMS monk, they both do somthing to Flurry.
I see no problem with the sword lord PC.
But from a pure mechanical POW the sicmetar and derwish dance feat is better because of the extra crit range.
Arcane strike wont see alot of use since you often will use the swifts for somthing better. same goes with the dueling mastery feat +2 shield looks good but it wont stack with a shield spellYou can combine them just fine, check it in the d20PFSRD...
Isent the fact that they both change flurry a reason for them not to combine?
"A character can take more than one archetype and garner additional alternate class features, but none of the alternate class features can replace or alter the same class feature from the core class as another alternate class feature."is what the D20PFSDR says and my books agree.
I would highly recommend Toughness as an early feat as well. Small HD and only a +1 CON modifier mean that you won't be able to take many solid blows, sure, your high DEX will avoid a lot of that, but one good smash and you're really hurt. Maybe even one shot. Toughness can maybe avoid that for you..
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Also, with Elven Favored Class bonus and the Extra Arcana feat he could easily have 5 Arcana before 12th level.
Your going to spend two feats and 12 hit points on Arcana?
Your going to tank your damage and your ability to stand on the front line so you have the option to burn your very limited arcane pool up the the first two encounters.
Had I used favored class option for anything other than hp, my character would have died last weekend, followed by a party wipe (another AoE would have killed at least two party members besides me).
Instead, he survived and stood, delivered a shocking grasp to the caster and as the group tank for the scenario.
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Your going to spend two feats and 12 hit points on Arcana?
Also, with Elven Favored Class bonus and the Extra Arcana feat he could easily have 5 Arcana before 12th level.
I made no such statement. I was only correcting you fallacious assumption that they would have only 1. BTW, it would be 3 feats & 6 HP before 12th. At 12th they could have 7 arcana with 3 feats & 12 HP. I am not actually recommending that, just stating it is a possible build option.
Had I used favored class option for anything other than hp, my character would have died last weekend, followed by a party wipe (another AoE would have killed at least two party members besides me).
Instead, he survived and stood, delivered a shocking grasp to the caster and as the group tank for the scenario.
And if, for example, you had missed with that attack because you didn't have Arcane Accuracy? We could argue this point indefinitely.
Don't get me wrong. HP are very crucial to a Magus and I think Toughness is almost a requirement. But 6 HP for an extra Arcana for an Archtype combo that normally only gets 1 before 12th level is likely worth it. And if you look at the Magus guides, I am not the only one to think so.
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Your going to spend two feats and 12 hit points on Arcana?
Also, with Elven Favored Class bonus and the Extra Arcana feat he could easily have 5 Arcana before 12th level.I made no such statement. I was only correcting you fallacious assumption that they would have only 1. BTW, it would be 3 feats & 6 HP before 12th. At 12th they could have 7 arcana with 3 feats & 12 HP. I am not actually recommending that, just stating it is a possible build option.
Had I used favored class option for anything other than hp, my character would have died last weekend, followed by a party wipe (another AoE would have killed at least two party members besides me).
Instead, he survived and stood, delivered a shocking grasp to the caster and as the group tank for the scenario.
And if, for example, you had missed with that attack because you didn't have Arcane Accuracy? We could argue this point indefinitely.
Don't get me wrong. HP are very crucial to a Magus and I think Toughness is almost a requirement. But 6 HP for an extra Arcana for an Archtype combo that normally only gets 1 before 12th level is likely worth it. And if you look at the Magus guides, I am not the only one to think so.
Arcane Accuracy is 2 arcane points per round. You have a diminished arcane pool due to being Bladebound. How many times per day are you going to use it before Arcane Strike is all you have left?
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Arcane Accuracy is 2 arcane points per round. You have a diminished arcane pool due to being Bladebound. How many times per day are you going to use it before Arcane Strike is all you have left?Your going to spend two feats and 12 hit points on Arcana?
Also, with Elven Favored Class bonus and the Extra Arcana feat he could easily have 5 Arcana before 12th level.I made no such statement. I was only correcting you fallacious assumption that they would have only 1. BTW, it would be 3 feats & 6 HP before 12th. At 12th they could have 7 arcana with 3 feats & 12 HP. I am not actually recommending that, just stating it is a possible build option.
Had I used favored class option for anything other than hp, my character would have died last weekend, followed by a party wipe (another AoE would have killed at least two party members besides me).
Instead, he survived and stood, delivered a shocking grasp to the caster and as the group tank for the scenario.
And if, for example, you had missed with that attack because you didn't have Arcane Accuracy? We could argue this point indefinitely.
Don't get me wrong. HP are very crucial to a Magus and I think Toughness is almost a requirement. But 6 HP for an extra Arcana for an Archtype combo that normally only gets 1 before 12th level is likely worth it. And if you look at the Magus guides, I am not the only one to think so.
So I guess the answer is you DO wish to argue this point indefinitely. Sorry, not interested. Please continue to pick nits as much as you want, but I have made my point, and you have made yours. If you cannot accept that, that is not my problem.
FYI, Arcane Accuracy is only 1 point.
Under current rules, a magus cannot fight defensively while using spell combat. Crane style requires the user to fight defensively.
Wow that sucks, I just went and looked it up and your right. So all of the above combos with MoMS is kind of pointless.
What I meant about the prc is that you never gain the feat Exoticweapon prof (aldori sword), you just begin proficient with it. I believe that by RAW this does not grants you access to the PrC, I may be mistaken though.
The wording 'are proficient with' refers to a class-given feat of Martial Weapon Proficiency and Exotic Weapon Proficiency (which are in the Core Rulebook) granting proficiency with one weapon of choice from their particular category. One of these two is what you gain with Kensai at level 1.
-Ghost Blade and Bane Blade are awesome choices.
Does anyone have good experiance with this? An arcana to do what a weapon blanch does? Unless your using it for Brilliant energy. I haven't really found a use for Brilliant energy. At +4 enchant, when you can get this most of what you fight isn't wearing armor. Its big monsters with lost of Natural armor. Does anyone use Brillant?
Disclaimer: I realize some campaigns will be vs mostly humanoids so this could be good but it would be very campaign specific.
An arcana to do what a weapon blanch does?
Can't use it in PFS, but there is the Philosopher's Alloy arcana (and 3 others) in the "Of Magic and Mettle" article in Wayfinder #7 (free).
Well, the thing about the Bane Blade arcana is it's flexible. The weapon enchant locks you in to the type. So I can see it being useful..Ghost Blade is situationally useful. I wouldn't think anyone wants Brilliant 100% of the time, which is the great thing about having these as arcana. They're there when you need them and you use something else when they're not needed.
-Ghost Blade and Bane Blade are awesome choices.Does anyone have good experiance with this? An arcana to do what a weapon blanch does? Unless your using it for Brilliant energy. I haven't really found a use for Brilliant energy. At +4 enchant, when you can get this most of what you fight isn't wearing armor. Its big monsters with lost of Natural armor. Does anyone use Brillant?
Disclaimer: I realize some campaigns will be vs mostly humanoids so this could be good but it would be very campaign specific.
They're not the same. Weapon blanch sucks. :) A full round action to get the effect on your weapon for 1 hit only. The arcana makes it an option you can spend your sword bonus on, so it lasts for every swing for the duration of that pool power. As for brilliant energy, when you spellstrike you're trying to hit with the weapon, not just land a touch. Being able to ignore their armor and shield is a decent bonus to have (as long as you're fighting a living opponent).
Could you link the reference to the FAQ?
Read up Spell combat, requires Full round action. FAQ states this is not a full attack action.
Read up Fighting defensively, it requires you use Full attack action.
Easy to miss, I never caught it until Arthanthos pointed it out.
As I recall, they have FAQd that you can use Haste with Spell Combat, despite the different wording. Am I right? If so, isn't Crane Style a similar case?
Anyway, this probably means that the monk dip in PFS play is invalid. But I consider it legitimate for home-made games, what do you think?
You can make a case that because haste works with full round action like Spell Combat that you should be able to fight defensively. But haste is the exception they made not the norm. RAW or PFS it would not work.
That being said, I was thinking of taking levels in MoMS as my magus in a home game. I'm know my DM wouldn't mind. He is fairly lenient about that stuff. But he is one of those DMs that say, if you can do it, so can I. It doesn't surprise me at all if we run into a BBEG and his two bodyguards using natural attacks that have taking 2 level dip in MoMS for this and saves.
I also run a game, being im fairly new to DM'ing I made everything in my game follow the PFS rules. But in the future I would probably allow things like this. Talk to your DM and present your case and see what he says. I personally dont think its over power, you setting yourself back 1 BAB and 2 levels of progression and your already a half caster. So your gonna hurt your spell progressing and other magus abilities, but you get increased Defense.
Spell combat is basically a full attack action, that trades a -2 on all your attacks for the ability to also cast a spell. As a full attack action, haste of course gives you its bonus attack.