Druid or Wizard?


Advice


Hi guys,

I can't decide between a druid and a wizard.
The other members are: a cavalier, life oracle and a alchemist/barbarian melee. Sometimes a ranger (Trapper archetype), a rogue or a monk joins the party.

level 8
25 point buy
standard wealth per level
Most paizo products allowed

Since it will be my 5th character in this campaign it should have some staying power.
There were a few bad choices and bad luck :(

Augment summoning is a must and I need some sort of battlefield control as well as hp and good saves. Maybe I take Summon Good Monster too.

What would you suggest?


Ronin3058 wrote:

Hi guys,

I can't decide between a druid and a wizard.
The other members are: a cavalier, life oracle and a alchemist/barbarian melee. Sometimes a ranger (Trapper archetype), a rogue or a monk joins the party.

level 8
25 point buy
standard wealth per level
Most paizo products allowed

Since it will be my 5th character in this campaign it should have some staying power.
There were a few bad choices and bad luck :(

Augment summoning is a must and I need some sort of battlefield control as well as hp and good saves. Maybe I take Summon Good Monster too.

What would you suggest?

Both are great. I'd go druid. You'll need the utility of wild shape a reasonable amount when your rogue/monk isn't there, and druids are awesome. It's tough to screw up a druid.

All druid builds that do any summoning look pretty much like this:

1: SF: Conj
3: Augment Summoning
5: Natural Spell
7: Superior Summons

And whatever you darned well please after that.

If you want to go vanilla-ish druid, go Menhir Savant (the trades are great).

-Cross


I'd say Druid also. The 25 point buy will really help your Druid shine. You can have the high STR and CON for Shapeshifting and still have a high WIS for spell casting... In all fairness, I should tell you Druids are probably my favorite class.


Wizards are fun. Druids are fun. Though if you want to summon a lot, sounds like Druid is the way to go.

Sovereign Court

There are 3 main reasons you might want to go wizard instead of druid.

1. The spell list. Wizards get, by and large, a better and more versatile spell list than Druids. This includes unconditional versions of stuff druids can do in a forest (e.g., Teleport instead of Tree Stride) and some spells that Druids simply can't replicate well (e.g., Fireball).

2. Wizard school powers. Some of these can be really potent - Divination, Conjuration (teleportation), and Evocation (admixture) being good examples.

3. Bonus Feats/Crafting. Wizards get 4 bonus feats over their lifetime, and Druids essentially have -1 feats since almost every druid takes Natural Spell at level 5. As a result, wizards tend to have an easier time taking metamagic and item crafting feats; in addition, their main casting stat being Int means their spellcraft goes through the roof, which is important for crafting.

However, unless you particularly need one of the above to make a build viable, you're likely better off with Druid. D8 hit dice, wildshape (which replaces half the spells a wizard would be using, and is more spontaneous), 3/4 BAB, and an animal companion (which is way more potent than a familiar) mean you can actually contribute in melee. And if you want to be a summoner, having spontaneous Summon Nature's Ally spells is awesomesauce, even if SNA is maybe a little less potent than SM.

I love wizards with all my heart, but for you I'd recommend a druid. Consider Toughness if you want staying power. Also consider Scribe Scroll - it makes you much, much more versatile, especially since you have access to your entire spell list unlike a wizard.

Grand Lodge

Both are obviously good classes when in the hands of a skilled player. Thus, I suggest you consider flavor. Which would you connect with more and be more inclined to roleplay? Also consider your setting. Druids make a lot of sense for a wilderness campaign, but would they be the most likely outside this? You decide ;)


Thanks for the help
I think I'll go with the druid. I think I can easier roleplay a druid than a smart, squishy wizard :)
So if a druid is also mechanically a good idea I will go for it.

It should be a caster druid, because we already have two melee classes.

Any suggestions how to handle a druid in combat?
Wildshape into an air elemental, stay out of reach of the bad guys and support the party?
Let them do the work together with my AC and the summonings?


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If you want staying power, dwarven druid with steel soul. With your starting wealth, get a +1 wild dragonhide breastplate. Then add the extra AC of a small earth or air elemtal (and the +1 size bonus!), cast barkskin and your AC and saves will be great.

If you go summoner, consider a blight druid with the darkness domain. Summoning 1d3+1 shadows as level 5 domain spell is awesome. There's a ridiculous amount of high level creatures that can't even hit the shadows and they will drain the strength out of anything within a few rounds.

Also, Miasma and Plaguebearer are great debuffs and will provide additional protection as most things won't risk coming near you to attack.


If you truly want to focus on summoning above all else, then the spell focus, augment summoning approach is the best way to go.

If you want to be a more generalist druid there are many, many more options to pursue with your feats than the standard summoning approach. Especially if you expect to do much wild shaping in combat. You do have to be judicious with druid feat choices since druids don't get bonus feats. Summoning is still a powerful option even without the summoning feat tree.

I like wizards and druids about equally. In fact my two favorite characters I've ever built and played are a wizard and a druid.

Druids are generally more survivable than wizards at low levels and animal companions are more robust than familiars.


Well, he isn't talking about low level (at least I don't consider 8th to be low). But it still seems that survivability has been a problem for him. So I would still suggest a druid. Armor, d8, wild shape, and good fort save really help survivability.

Wild shaping into something that is hard to hurt, doesn't look like a threat, or hides well can really help you to stay alive and keep casting.

I usually don't like human for race, but since you can wildshape into something else anyway, it is ok. I would probably go human for the extra feat. Though Blave's suggestion is also very good.


Since druids are feat starved, and they can wild shape into forms with better abilities, human is a very good choice for druids.


My druid:
AC is the good old big cat (with light armor, improved bite, iron will and toughness)

I wanted a little bit more strength than a caster druid needs

Should I change combat casting to heavy armor proficiency?

Spoiler:

Druid
Human Druid 8
NG Medium Humanoid (human)
Init +3; Senses Perception +17
--------------------
Defense
--------------------
AC 18, touch 11, flat-footed 17 (+7 armor, +1 Dex)
hp 72 (8d8+32)
Fort +11, Ref +5, Will +14; +4 vs. spell-like and supernatural abilities of Fey and against effects that target plants
--------------------
Offense
--------------------
Speed 20 ft.
Druid Spells Prepared (CL 8):
--------------------
Statistics
--------------------
Str 12, Dex 12, Con 16, Int 12, Wis 22, Cha 9
Base Atk +6; CMB +7; CMD 18
Feats Augment Summoning, Combat Casting, Natural Spell, Spell Focus (Conjuration), Superior Summoning
Traits Focused Mind, Reactionary
Skills Acrobatics -2 (-6 jump), Climb +2, Escape Artist -2, Fly +9, Handle Animal +10, Heal +10, Knowledge (nature) +11, Perception +17, Ride -2, Spellcraft +12, Stealth -2, Survival +19, Swim +2
Languages Common, Draconic, Druidic
SQ animal companion link, nature bond abilities (animal companion, tiger), resist nature's lure, share spells with companion, spontaneous casting, trackless step, wild, wild empathy, wild shape (3/day), wild shape (animal), wild shape (elemental), wild shape (plant), woodland stride
Other Gear +1 Wild Ironwood Breastplate, Cloak of resistance +2, Headband of inspired wisdom +2, 100 GP

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Consider one other option if you want to make use of Summon Nature spells with an arcane focus.

First World Summoner.


No Menhir Savant?

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber; Pathfinder Maps Subscriber

It may sound a bit um cheesy but go Dragonhide Full Plate +1 Wild but don't get proficiency. Prof only means you have a penalty to attack and dex/str skill checks and this goes away with wild shape. If its worth it to you get the prof feat, if not, stick with something else.

Also if you really like summoning you could go one of the animal shaman routes. Saurian Shaman may limit your AC and alter your wild shapes once you hit 6th level but it lets you summon dinosurs and reptiles with certain templates and as a standard action.

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