Does Arcane Armor Penalty apply to Divine spellusers?


Rules Questions

Liberty's Edge

Why or why not? And please provide references?


No, because it's arcane spell failure chance, not divine.

PRD wrote:

Arcane Spell Failure Chance: Armor interferes with the gestures that a spellcaster must make to cast an arcane spell that has a somatic component. Arcane spellcasters face the possibility of arcane spell failure if they're wearing armor. Bards can wear light armor and use shields without incurring any arcane spell failure chance for their bard spells.

Casting an Arcane Spell in Armor: A character who casts an arcane spell while wearing armor must usually make an arcane spell failure check. The number in the Arcane Spell Failure Chance column on Table: Armor and Shields is the percentage chance that the spell fails and is ruined. If the spell lacks a somatic component, however, it can be cast with no chance of arcane spell failure.

Shields: If a character is wearing armor and using a shield, add the two numbers together to get a single arcane spell failure chance.

PRD/Magic wrote:

Wizards, sorcerers, and bards cast arcane spells. Compared to divine spells, arcane spells are more likely to produce dramatic results.

....
Clerics, druids, experienced paladins, and experienced rangers can cast divine spells. Unlike arcane spells, divine spells draw power from a divine source. Clerics gain spell power from deities or from divine forces. The divine force of nature powers druid and ranger spells, and the divine forces of law and good power paladin spells. Divine spells tend to focus on healing and protection and are less flashy, destructive, and disruptive than arcane spells.


3rdclass wrote:
Why or why not? And please provide references?

There is no arcane armor penalty.

There is arcane spell failure chance which only mentions arcane spells. In order for it to affect divine spells it has to say so, but it doesn't.

prd wrote:


Arcane Spell Failure Chance: Armor interferes with the gestures that a spellcaster must make to cast an arcane spell that has a somatic component. Arcane spellcasters face the possibility of arcane spell failure if they're wearing armor. Bards can wear light armor and use shields without incurring any arcane spell failure chance for their bard spells.

Casting an Arcane Spell in Armor: A character who casts an arcane spell while wearing armor must usually make an arcane spell failure check. The number in the Arcane Spell Failure Chance column on Table: Armor and Shields is the percentage chance that the spell fails and is ruined. If the spell lacks a somatic component, however, it can be cast with no chance of arcane spell failure.

Shields: If a character is wearing armor and using a shield, add the two numbers together to get a single arcane spell failure chance.

edit:Darn I was ninja'd.


concerro wrote:


edit:Darn I was ninja'd.

Usually, I'm the one getting ninja'd, what with the copying and pasting and bolding. I must have recently leveled up. ;)

Liberty's Edge

Playing Asmodeus' advocate: Since Divine spells also have somatic components, why are they not encumbered by the armor as well, just like the arcane spellcasters?

Silver Crusade

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Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
3rdclass wrote:
Playing Asmodeus' advocate: Since Divine spells also have somatic components, why are they not encumbered by the armor as well, just like the arcane spellcasters?

You want us to fetch Monte Cook, Jonathan Tweet or Skip Williams? Because Gary Gygax and Dave Arneson are momentarily unavailable, I'm afraid.


3rdclass wrote:
Playing Asmodeus' advocate: Since Divine spells also have somatic components, why are they not encumbered by the armor as well, just like the arcane spellcasters?

Because the rules say they aren't. There's really no other reason than that, but the rules are very clear. Arcane, not divine spell failure chance. Clerics have worn armor and wizards haven't back to the very beginning of the game.


3rdclass wrote:
Playing Asmodeus' advocate: Since Divine spells also have somatic components, why are they not encumbered by the armor as well, just like the arcane spellcasters?

Because the rules say so if you only want a rules answer.

If you want a metagame answer then arcane spells generally do things that outstrip divine spells so that is a way to keep arcane types in check, while still allowing for the holy men that can fight.
Now some people will disagree that arcane spells are better but the makers of the game seem to have disagreed the results of the wizard being hailed as the most powerful class by most gamers seems to hold that statement to be true also.


3rdclass wrote:
Why or why not? And please provide references?

Yes, Arcane Spell Failure definitely applies to Divine Casters... if they're casting an Arcane Spell. Sorry, no reference.


Pathfinder Adventure, Rulebook Subscriber

A cleric X/Wiz 1, that casts Burning hands is still affected by arcane spell failure. But a Cleric X that has the fire domain and casts Burning Hands does [b]NOT[b/] worry about arcane spell failure.

A spell is arcane if that character gained access to teh spell from an arcane spell caster's spell list (Wiz, Sorc, Witch, Summ, Magus, Bard). If a spell is a bonus spell, like one from a Sorcerer's bloodline spells, Witches patron, Cleric domain, or Oracle Mystery spell, it is considered to be from that classes spell list for purposes of determining if it is arcane or divine.

The short version is: If the player casts Divine spells then no, if they cast arcane then yes, if they can cast both then it depends on where access to the spell comes from.


Joana wrote:
3rdclass wrote:
Playing Asmodeus' advocate: Since Divine spells also have somatic components, why are they not encumbered by the armor as well, just like the arcane spellcasters?
Because the rules say they aren't. There's really no other reason than that, but the rules are very clear. Arcane, not divine spell failure chance. Clerics have worn armor and wizards haven't back to the very beginning of the game.

Unless they were Elves. Elves had ability to ignore armor (whether through Elven Chain) or innate back in old days (depending on edition).


3rdclass wrote:
Playing Asmodeus' advocate: Since Divine spells also have somatic components, why are they not encumbered by the armor as well, just like the arcane spellcasters?

Because arcane casters form their spells using precise incantations and symbols, allowing them to alter the laws of nature through deeper understanding of the laws of magic.

Divine casters act as a conduit for divine magic, divine spells are EASIER to cast than arcane spells because they don't require precise understanding of the magical arts as their powers are summoned through the will of their patron entity instead of mortal study.


Hmmm...

I just realized that using the Still Spell metamagic feat allows an arcane caster to cast spells while wearing heavy armor. It only takes up a slot one level higher. Certainly not an optimized solution, but I could see this allowing for some pretty cool character concepts.

Dark Archive

Uninvited Ghost wrote:
3rdclass wrote:
Why or why not? And please provide references?
Yes, Arcane Spell Failure definitely applies to Divine Casters... if they're casting an Arcane Spell. Sorry, no reference.

so funny the irony

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