Too bad SJ games doesn't appear to keep up with the times and implement tools like 4E. With templates, and a decent character generator, you could cover some serious ground to make it easier. Add some monster supplements on the top as gravy.
You should check it out again, as I think you missed out on the full offerings of GURPS. The system makes heavy use of templates and there is a computerized character generator available for GURPS 4E (as there was for 3rd).
The Dungeon Fantasy supplements for 4th edition provide templates for all of the major D&D class types, magic items, spells, creatures, and traps, as well as advice for running D&D-style fantasy adventures ranging from wahoo-save-vs-DM 1E-type things to the more "serious" styles of later editions.
That said I'm never going to run a fantasy game in GURPS, despite having bought all of the materials! :)
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There are even archetypes available in GURPS that can not be done in PFrpg or DND. Johnny One-shots. the magician who knows a very limited selection of spells or even just a single spell really, really well. yeah you can make that PrC and do Force Missile Mage at 5th level. I can do a flame jet Character or force bolt PC to begin with.
Speaking of magic GURPS can allow you to use lower level spells to emulate, and sometimes improve upon a higher level spell function.
Not better or worse, just different.
I thoroughly recommend OpenQuest by d101 Games.
Right now I'm leaning towards FATE (possibly using Dresden files for my magic rules), Dragon Age or Warhammer 3E.
FATE: I think looks like a really fun game, but I haven't seen a magic system for it that I really love. The Dresden Files one looks the best, but it is pretty detailed, so it would take some work to get used to it and adapt it to a D&D style game.
Seems you are looking for Legends of Anglerre
The OP already has Legends of Anglerre.
The OP already has Legends of Anglerre.
Oups, I should not start reading a thread in the middle :-P
Even though it sounds as if you're not leaning toward GURPS I'm going to post some links for those who might consider it:
GURPS Character Builder - Program for building characters for GURPS.
Dungeon Fantasy - For D&D-like fantasy games.
Fantasy - Generic fantasy toolbook for campaigns ranging from high fantasy to gritty fantasy.
If you click around from those pages you can find the magic book and additional grimoires, bestiaries of various kinds, and so forth. Of course the core books are there as well.
Again, it's a good system but I'll probably stick with PFRPG unless I ever run something tending toward realistic fantasy.
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I almost forgot D6 Fantasy.Well worth a look. You 'll like itI haven't seen anything more on the D6 Fantasy mentioned, so I'll second it and throw it back in. The system has both arcane and divine capabilities, and is overall quite flexible while being very intuitive. The best thing is that you can get through game after game with barely a glance into the rulebook.
Oh, and new copies of the hardcover are selling for $3.99 on Amazon...
Not to mention that D6 Fantasy, D6 Fantasy Creatures, and D6 Fantasy Locations are all free to download from DriveThruStuff.
If you don't need the physical books that is.
Too bad SJ games doesn't appear to keep up with the times and implement tools like 4E. With templates, and a decent character generator, you could cover some serious ground to make it easier. Add some monster supplements on the top as gravy.You should check it out again, as I think you missed out on the full offerings of GURPS. The system makes heavy use of templates and there is a computerized character generator available for GURPS 4E (as there was for 3rd).
The Dungeon Fantasy supplements for 4th edition provide templates for all of the major D&D class types, magic items, spells, creatures, and traps, as well as advice for running D&D-style fantasy adventures ranging from wahoo-save-vs-DM 1E-type things to the more "serious" styles of later editions.
That said I'm never going to run a fantasy game in GURPS, despite having bought all of the materials! :)
M
Having done my fair share of GURPS GM'ing I can say that GURPS (and by extension its parent system HERO) are actually the easiest by far for me to run totally improvised.
All I need are 3d6 and my rules of thumb. The rest is up to the players. If I wanna have a Really Big Cthulhu Critter tramp overhead, I can. If I want a horde o' flesh-rending kittens glowing with their horrible daemonic possession descending on them, I can. If my vampires are different from mythology, guess what - the players get to find out the hard way.
For me, GURPS/HERO are the second-easiest game systems to GM, with TFOS being the easiest. Peruse the rules, get an idea of what you are comfortable with (starting points based on how you view nublet characters, set your disadvantage/quirks limits, cherry pick the combat stuff you wanna deal with and take off running), keep XP awards on the 1-3 per session side and have a good time.
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I myself am looking for a new system to play my fantasy games with. I am a huge fan of Warhammer and own everything for 1st 2nd and 3rd editions and that is probably what I will use as I love the setting and gritty dirty feel of the world. But I am always up for a new system and have been toying with Savage worlds when the new edition is released soon.But hearing of the recommendations of GURPS I'm a little curious about the system now. My questions are since I am basically looking for a simpler or less rulsey game with less options for players and GM's alike.
Is GURPS a rules heavy system with a ton of rules and ways to over maximize the characters? IMO Pathfinder concentrates to much on that aspect of the game to much and that becomes the main focus.
I get the impression that GURPs is pretty crunchy. You might end up liking Savage Worlds quite a bit. I like it. I'm just not that big on how magic is done, and how the health system works.
I was looking at DragonAge and it looks like a pretty fun ruleslite system, but I'm not that big fan of the setting. I'm playing in a 3E warhammer game right now, which I'm enjoying, though I'm not sure if I'd want to dm it.
I downloaded the d6 stuff from drivethrurpg for free (nice), but I haven't had much time to go through it yet.
I myself am looking for a new system to play my fantasy games with. I am a huge fan of Warhammer and own everything for 1st 2nd and 3rd editions and that is probably what I will use as I love the setting and gritty dirty feel of the world. But I am always up for a new system and have been toying with Savage worlds when the new edition is released soon.But hearing of the recommendations of GURPS I'm a little curious about the system now. My questions are since I am basically looking for a simpler or less rulsey game with less options for players and GM's alike.
Is GURPS a rules heavy system with a ton of rules and ways to over maximize the characters? IMO Pathfinder concentrates to much on that aspect of the game to much and that becomes the main focus.
I myself am looking for a new system to play my fantasy games with. I am a huge fan of Warhammer and own everything for 1st 2nd and 3rd editions and that is probably what I will use as I love the setting and gritty dirty feel of the world. But I am always up for a new system and have been toying with Savage worlds when the new edition is released soon.But hearing of the recommendations of GURPS I'm a little curious about the system now. My questions are since I am basically looking for a simpler or less rulsey game with less options for players and GM's alike.
Is GURPS a rules heavy system with a ton of rules and ways to over maximize the characters? IMO Pathfinder concentrates to much on that aspect of the game to much and that becomes the main focus.
GURPS is only as rules-heavy as you let it be. That's its stength and its curse. The GM has to invest some time into figuring out what they want to monkey around with. That having been said, there is a GURPS Lite that used to be a free PDF. (Don't know if it is now.)
Bad guys can be as simple as Perception 12, DR 3 armor, dodge 5, parry 9, shield block 9, stabby skill 12, shooty skill 12, 12 HP, disads: code of honor (loyal minion), minion of Da Boss #2, adv: alchohol tolerance, knows stuff heroes need to find out about 9; quirk: macks on hawt wimmen PCs 15. Loot: 15 gp. Done.
Da Boss #2 might be Perception 15, DR 7 magic bling, dodge 12, boot to the head skill 15, shooty spell 18 (2d6 impaling), 15 HP plus High Pain Threshold, disads: megalomaniac, can be tricked in monologuing once, allergic to eggs; adv: extra life, big golem critter buddy, other bad guy stuff 13, quirk: wants to capture heroes, maim them and toss 'em into his newest deathtrap - if they escape, he shoots to kill; other quirk: overly fond of Guiness and [insert hawt / studly PCs hair color here] eye candy; Loot: DR 7 magic bling, legal title to the Duchy of Studly, one Wealth level increase for all PCs, one level Status increase for all PCs, "action" for a month for free from grateful peons.
The actual rules read more complex than this, but this is a prime example of how simple you can make it if you choose.
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Anyone thinking about GURPS 4e should look at "GURPS Lite", a free PDF that introduces the basics of GURPS. Link here: http://e23.sjgames.com/item.html?id=SJG31-0004
You could also try d20 Threshold (just Threshold for short, and formerly known as d20OpenRPG.) Its still in beta, but is free and 100% open game content.
You can find its current incarnation at http://www.d20openrpg.com/
So which system did you chose after all?
If you haven't picked a system might I suggest Becoming Heroes.
It is a lot less crunchy than d20 but is quite fun.
If you haven't picked a system might I suggest Becoming Heroes.
It is a lot less crunchy than d20 but is quite fun.
Hmm..how does the system work exactly?
I haven't yet started a new fantasy campaign. I ended up starting a Shadowrun campaign, and I'm in the midst of that. I'm also currently playing in a warhammer 3E campaign, which I'm quite liking. I'm still looking at getting a fantasy campaign going soon (likely October), and I'll probably alternate between that and Shadowrun for a while. I had been thinking I wold make it a 2E warhammer campaign, but I think since most of the players that I gm for now play in the warhammer game that I play in I'm going to find something else (for variety).
I've got a one shot of Barbarians of Lemuria lined up that I'm going to run in the next couple of weeks. I've taken the stunt system from Dragonage and merged it with the Barbarians of Lemuria rules (and it fits pretty seamlessly since both systems use only d6s) in order to add a little more tactical crunch to the game. I've also taken a bunch of stuff from the Conan rpg and made Conan regional backgrounds for BoL. So the current plan is to try some slightly modified BoL set in Hyboria. I'll see how that goes. I think it will be fun (and easy to run), but I'm not sure if it will provide enough crunchy options to keep my players excited over the long haul.
I was also reading up on the campaign outline for Skulls and Shackles AP due out in February, and that's caught my interest. I'm not sure what I'll do with that one if I try to run it. I've generally been doing homebrew stuff, but I think I might be ready to try another AP soon. I ran the Savage Tide AP in 3.5, and I loved the campaign, but running a high level 3.5 game was really doing me in by the end. I then switched to 4E and ran the Second Darkness AP. We really enjoyed that campaign, though the actual story wasn't quite as good as Savage Tide. Since then I've run another campaign in 4E that was homebrew and for the most part was a blast. It got up to about 16-17th level before I managed to TPK the party in a fight with a dracolich (a fight which shouldn't have really been a TPK). Unfortunately, by the end of the campaign I was getting kind of sick of the whole 4E thing, though I still think it's a decent enough game. That was back in March, I haven't run any fantasy rpg since then.
I would like to throw my hat into the ring and suggest checking out Hackmaster Basic on kenzerco.com. If you are a fan of Knights of the Dinner Table or that old school DnD feel with a few new surprises, this might be worth a look.
Legends of Anglerre is currently my fantasy game of choice, so it semi-obviously gets my vote of approval ;)
GURPS and HERO are both incredibly crunch heavy, especially HERO. While in D&D you'd, say, buy a shortsword, in HERO you'd give your character a close range attack that's piercing and does x damage and call it "attack with a shortsword."
I personally found Strands of Fate to be too crunchy for my tastes for a FATE game. It's designed to be a sort of half-way point between crunchier games and FATE, and thus has things like...*shudders* attributes.
There also the Old School Hack which is very effective at being a basic and more simplistic old school dungeon crawl style game.
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I know you're leaning away from d20, but Green Ronin's True20 is a much more rules-lite, archetype strong version of the game and monster conversion is pretty simple for Paizo APs.
... in HERO you'd give your character a close range attack that's piercing and does x damage and call it "attack with a shortsword."...
Or, alternatively, you just buy a shortsword
A new game, Dungeon World, just had a starter book released. $5 gets you the PDF, it's a hack of the Apocalypse World game and it's very cool. The basic premise of the rules is that the game is a conversation, when it makes sense in the conversation to roll the dice, you roll them. The game isn't finished, but the $5 preview edition is definitely worth the time. The authors have day jobs, and they're still writing the higher level content.
Anyone played the Amazing System Engine fantasy rules?
I have a feeling those might work actually(maybe with a minimum tampering)
Or, alternatively, you just buy a shortsword... in HERO you'd give your character a close range attack that's piercing and does x damage and call it "attack with a shortsword."...
I'm not familiar with HERO but in GURPS you *could* do either of these things. For a normal fighter 'person' you should buy a shortsword. For a creature with a built-in weapon that worked like a shortsword you'd give it the Innate Attack advantage tuned to shortsword parameters (as in Prof. Cirno's post). Both approaches yield the same results...it just depends how you want to 'model' it in the build. If I was just doing something for a home game I'd probably just give the creature a shortsword and say it's built-in...just simpler that way.
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ok, not trying to be a smart... allek.. are you talking about the Amazing Engine system from tsr? or is this something new i don't know about? :)
Anyone played the Amazing System Engine fantasy rules?
I have a feeling those might work actually(maybe with a minimum tampering)
Yes I am
Yes I amok, not trying to be a smart... allek.. are you talking about the Amazing Engine system from tsr? or is this something new i don't know about? :)
Anyone played the Amazing System Engine fantasy rules?
I have a feeling those might work actually(maybe with a minimum tampering)
But I haven't actually used it that's why I'm asking for other peoples previous experience
I ran my first session of Barbarians of Lemuria today (incorporating the stunt system from the Dragon Age rpg). We had a really fun session. I found that it played really fast. Combat was quick, but the stunt system helped keep it interesting. It was a pretty blood soaked, hack and slash session, but that was mainly due to the storyline I set up. I'd say we were able to get through as much story as would have taken 2-3 sessions of D&D.
My only main concern is that mechanically the characters end up feeling pretty similar. Though this is a lot because it's a low magic game, so all the characters are to some extent fighters. I'm not sure how great this system would be for really long term play, but I could definitely see running a mini campaign with it. It may have the potential to keep us interested for longer than that, but I can't tell as of yet.
Stay tuned. I'm working on something that sounds like what you're after. Once it reaches beta, I'll post a link to the website so you (and anyone else who visits the Other RPGs section) can check it out and even contribute content if you wish. It'll probably be a 3-5 months before this happens though.
So the plan is to get a more long term fantasy game going again in the next couple of weeks. Unfortunately, I still haven't figured out what system to go with. I've checked out a ton of them. There's things I like and dislike about all of them.
I had been thinking Savage Worlds, but one of my players is gm every other week, and he's just started running a Savage Worlds game right. We've played a session and enjoyed it, but the players think that one Savage Worlds game is enough, and they'd prefer to play a different system for the other game.
Despite all the options out there, it's come back to d20. We've voted on a break from 4E and I'm now trying to decide between Pathfinder and True20. Does anyone have any thoughts about which is the better system? Both have pros and cons, so it's a tough call.
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why not try out Pathfinder but to toss in some difference, try adapting E6 rules to it?
E6 rules
It would be a way to play a known system with a limiter to high-end magical "arms races" and the stresses of high level gameplay and math.
why not try out Pathfinder but to toss in some difference, try adapting E6 rules to it?
E6 rulesIt would be a way to play a known system with a limiter to high-end magical "arms races" and the stresses of high level gameplay and math.
Because some people want to play high end epic fantasy.
Because some games actually let you fight adult dragons without needing 45 minutes to look at all his buff vs all your buffs. Because some games are designed so that the flow of the story means you can do a movies worth of action beats in the same time it takes to watch a movie.
Pathfinder doesnt do this and then to limit it to 6 levels means you loose out on some variable X where X is the numbers of levels between 7-20 that you might otherwise play. For a lot of the folks I know that's around 12-13 so 6-7 levels.
If you are up for a swashbuckling style campaign, Swashbucklers of the 7 Skies is a good system. It uses the PDQ mechanic which is heavy on roleplaying and easier on crunchy. If you like things clearly defined, this is NOT the system for you though.
Do you have a good suggestion for a game that does?
QUOTE="Dragonsong"]
why not try out Pathfinder but to toss in some difference, try adapting E6 rules to it?
E6 rulesIt would be a way to play a known system with a limiter to high-end magical "arms races" and the stresses of high level gameplay and math.
Because some people want to play high end epic fantasy.
Because some games actually let you fight adult dragons without needing 45 minutes to look at all his buff vs all your buffs. Because some games are designed so that the flow of the story means you can do a movies worth of action beats in the same time it takes to watch a movie.
Pathfinder doesnt do this and then to limit it to 6 levels means you loose out on some variable X where X is the numbers of levels between 7-20 that you might otherwise play. For a lot of the folks I know that's around 12-13 so 6-7 levels.
Do you have a good suggestion for a game that does?
QUOTE="Dragonsong"]
why not try out Pathfinder but to toss in some difference, try adapting E6 rules to it?
E6 rulesIt would be a way to play a known system with a limiter to high-end magical "arms races" and the stresses of high level gameplay and math.
Because some people want to play high end epic fantasy.
Because some games actually let you fight adult dragons without needing 45 minutes to look at all his buff vs all your buffs. Because some games are designed so that the flow of the story means you can do a movies worth of action beats in the same time it takes to watch a movie.
Pathfinder doesnt do this and then to limit it to 6 levels means you loose out on some variable X where X is the numbers of levels between 7-20 that you might otherwise play. For a lot of the folks I know that's around 12-13 so 6-7 levels.
Becoming Heroes. One of the core mechanics, in fact, the main advancement mechanic requires you to fulfill your destiny (path) to become an epic hero. The developers are quite willing to engage and provide encouragement and feedback as well as receive it.
The system has no preset setting so I hope that isn't off putting: examples of Games I have seen or heard of so far: a Dr Who game, an Exalted game where the players could actually try and kill the Scarlet Empress, a space opera game with a telepathic hive mind in charge of the known universe and us on the run, and rumors of a game where all the characters are sentient origami animals trying to stop a fire before it destroys their environs as "a test" to prove that the Origami are sentient.
The last Hive game I played we spent 2 hours of real time and started a riot in a spaceport, stole a shuttle, found a safe port in the asteroid remains of a planet, boarded a planet killer ship run by the telepathic hive mind, my sentient sand being merged with the power source while another player had a showdown with his sister who has been assimilated by the Hive, managed to get her unconscious body off the ship, fail to stop the planet killer ship from being scuttled, and take the powersource back to our own vessel to enact repairs. also revealed a new hierarchy sub routine(sub villian of the faceless Hive) Each of the things above we actually made rolls to determine success or failure, except the very last. TBH I rarely get that much done in 4-5 hours of PF.
I have no experience with the system but I have heard good things about Fantasycraft. My other suggestion would be to take a break from fantasy and run a modern/future game.
That's what I did when I got burned out on fantasy and it was a good decision.
Try looking at the Dresden Files iteration of the FATE system.
Right now I'm running a Pulp game with Savage Worlds, which I'll likely do for the next little while. However, I'm not burned out on fantasy genrewise. I am feeling more burnt out on D&D systemwise.
Isn't Fantasy Craft basically a d20 system?
I have no experience with the system but I have heard good things about Fantasycraft. My other suggestion would be to take a break from fantasy and run a modern/future game.
That's what I did when I got burned out on fantasy and it was a good decision.
It is based on it as a root but they use the Mastercraft system which is slightly different.
I have been looking for an all around replacement to the IBM of the RPG industry (d20). Although it is a solid system there is really nothing innovative enough to keep my interest with the exception of the refresh rate in Fantasycraft.
However I have found that an old system (GURPS) and a newer iteration of the FATE system (Dresden Files) have really piqued my interest.
Maybe they will be different enough to keep me vaguely interested in the current elephant in the room.
I ended up settling on Dragon Age, or at least I'm going to give it a shot. I found some material for running a more D&D/Pathfinder style setting with the AGE system, which I'll be using since I wanted to run the game in my previous campaign world.
Hopefully it will work well. If not, we'll find something else.
A system like GURPS has alot of rules to learn on the front end during character creation, but this is something the DM and players can go through together. Once you have a basic character, then the progression is slow in comparison with D&D. So you have time to tweak and get used to it, versus learning something new at every level wtih D&D. Combat is easy, including skill resolution.
GURPS is very good in regards to a roleplaying game where you have to think, because combat is not the preferred option. The spell system is simple and easy to use. The only time it becomes difficult is when you mix advantages (similar to feats) with disadvantages (penalties or anti-feats) to optimize. But there is no need to get into all the optional rules, as there is plenty of material to use right out of the book.
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I ended up settling on Dragon Age, or at least I'm going to give it a shot. I found some material for running a more D&D/Pathfinder style setting with the AGE system, which I'll be using since I wanted to run the game in my previous campaign world.
Hopefully it will work well. If not, we'll find something else.
I've played an increasing number of games with DragonAGE (mostly thanks to the second box and its increased options range), and it's quickly becoming a hit amongst my players.
I recommend taking a look at the latest Kobold Quarterly issues, that feature expanded stunt lists, custom stunt lists ideas (issue #17, IIRC) and greatly enhance the versatility of the game.