Unseen servant could use a bit of clarification because as of now it is cast by casters in my campaign all day, every day, and it ends up being used as a cheap fly spell when the caster also reduces himself etc. It seems that the vast functionality of this spell could be reduced at least a little bit.
Unseen servant could use a bit of clarification because as of now it is cast by casters in my campaign all day, every day, and it ends up being used as a cheap fly spell when the caster also reduces himself etc. It seems that the vast functionality of this spell could be reduced at least a little bit.
This spell just does about everything ( including coffee ! :D ). It's up to you to state what are the limits, because there would be too much to say otherwise.
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...as of now it is cast by casters in my campaign all day, every day, and it ends up being used as a cheap fly spell when the caster also reduces himself etc...
That is actually quite funny, and the players probably feel they should be rewarded for their ingenuity.
Don't forget, though, that the servant can be damaged, and, unlike fly, losing the spell does not mean you float to the ground...
Unseen servant could use a bit of clarification because as of now it is cast by casters in my campaign all day, every day, and it ends up being used as a cheap fly spell when the caster also reduces himself etc. It seems that the vast functionality of this spell could be reduced at least a little bit.
Where does it say that an unseen servant can fly?
Personally, I think there should be a penalty when you're being carried by another creature (as opposed to riding another creature); for instance, I think you should be denied your Dex bonus to AC if you've been hoisted over someone's shoulder like a sack of potatoes. But that isn't really a problem with the Unseen Servant spell.
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Unseen servant could use a bit of clarification because as of now it is cast by casters in my campaign all day, every day, and it ends up being used as a cheap fly spell when the caster also reduces himself etc. It seems that the vast functionality of this spell could be reduced at least a little bit.Where does it say that an unseen servant can fly?
After look in the Beta I found no reference that an Unseen Servant could fly.
After look in the Beta I found no reference that an Unseen Servant could fly.Unseen servant could use a bit of clarification because as of now it is cast by casters in my campaign all day, every day, and it ends up being used as a cheap fly spell when the caster also reduces himself etc. It seems that the vast functionality of this spell could be reduced at least a little bit.Where does it say that an unseen servant can fly?
True, but unseen servant is actually a better version of mage hand and mag hand can lift objects in the air up to the maximum range. So can unseeen servant I guess. Futhermore there is this passage that says the maximum range of unseen servant is mesurated from the caster's current position : if he's in the air, i would state this is possible.
Now, ways to limit the use of unseen servant as flying spell can be found. Unseen servant can't do what requires a skill check of 10 or more. So actually if we look under the flyning skill, we can see the limits. And lifting an object and lifting a person isn't really the same. If the person tries to take some kind of action, it could make the situation unstable and require a fly check. In case of failure it's AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH... And yup no feather fall effect XD
After look in the Beta I found no reference that an Unseen Servant could fly.
And herein lies one of the problems with Unseen Servant. It is an unseen, invisible, mindless, shapeless "force". Why would it *not* be able to fly? Is it even appropriate to describe "it" as flying, when in reality it is simply a "force"? Personally I do not want it to fly and I want it to perform mundane tasks like opening and closing doors and drawers etc but as it is worded currently it is so unclear/vague that it gets used for whatever is imaginable.
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That's kind of ingenious (like the old 'all the wizards ride each other's floating disks trick), but I'd definitely impose a serious 'unstable footing' sort of penalty or 'distracting circumstances' for spellcasting.
I'd probably also have some sort of height limit, like 30 ft. from the ground or something, since it's not intended to be an actual fly spell, just an 'invisible bagman.'
After look in the Beta I found no reference that an Unseen Servant could fly.And herein lies one of the problems with Unseen Servant. It is an unseen, invisible, mindless, shapeless "force". Why would it *not* be able to fly? Is it even appropriate to describe "it" as flying, when in reality it is simply a "force"? Personally I do not want it to fly and I want it to perform mundane tasks like opening and closing doors and drawers etc but as it is worded currently it is so unclear/vague that it gets used for whatever is imaginable.
I agree it's vague. Would you be satisfied if they said it has a "land speed of 15 feet" instead of a "speed of 15 feet"?
I agree it's vague. Would you be satisfied if they said it has a "land speed of 15 feet" instead of a "speed of 15 feet"?
That might be sufficient. Although if you say that then I guess you could never use the servant to open a window in your house that is up high? How tall is the force? How high can it jump? Can it climb walls?
If you're the accomplished mage that owns a mansion with windows like that, you've crafted other options instead of wasting your time with Unseen Servant.
Yeah but unless you state that it can not fly, you get into all sorts of time-consuming arguments with crafty players complaining you are stomping on their creativity. Certainly you want to encourage and reward creativity, but you also can not allow clearly illegal actions. Its the middle part, where its not entirely clear, where you end up with pissed off players thinking you are making them sad just because you don't like them or something.
I agree it's vague. Would you be satisfied if they said it has a "land speed of 15 feet" instead of a "speed of 15 feet"?That might be sufficient. Although if you say that then I guess you could never use the servant to open a window in your house that is up high? How tall is the force? How high can it jump? Can it climb walls?
From the spell:
"It can't perform any task that requires a skill check with a DC higher than 10 [or use skills] that can't be used untrained."So it could potentially make a Jump or Climb check with a DC of 10.
The force is "shapeless", but you can imply that it's effectively Medium-sized since its 2 Str can lift 20 lbs.
I agree it's vague. Would you be satisfied if they said it has a "land speed of 15 feet" instead of a "speed of 15 feet"?That might be sufficient. Although if you say that then I guess you could never use the servant to open a window in your house that is up high? How tall is the force? How high can it jump? Can it climb walls?From the spell:
"It can't perform any task that requires a skill check with a DC higher than 10 [or use skills] that can't be used untrained."So it could potentially make a Jump or Climb check with a DC of 10.
The force is "shapeless", but you can imply that it's effectively Medium-sized since its 2 Str can lift 20 lbs.
Try Fly check DC 10
From the spell:
"It can't perform any task that requires a skill check with a DC higher than 10 [or use skills] that can't be used untrained."So it could potentially make a Jump or Climb check with a DC of 10.
The force is "shapeless", but you can imply that it's effectively Medium-sized since its 2 Str can lift 20 lbs.
I dunno. You sure can "imply" a *LOT* of things from the spell. All I'm saying is I'd like it if there was a little less "implying" is all.
So it can't:
1) climb "any surface with adequate handholds and footholds (natural or artificial), such as a very rough natural rock surface or a tree, or an unknotted rope, or pulling yourself up when dangling by your hands."
2) climb a surface with ledges to hold on to and stand on, such as a very rough wall or a ship’s rigging- IF IT IS SLIPPERY
3) climb a slippery rope quickly
4) balance on a beam 2-6 inches wide
5) balance on a sloped ramp 7-12 inches wide
6) long jump more than 10' (unless it is running? can it run?)
7) high jump more than 2' (again, unless it runs first?)
8) swim in rough water (can it swim? or would it walk on water since its a "force"?)
9) if it can't fly, how tall is it really? how high is its vertical reach?
Soo many questions.
From the spell:
"It can't perform any task that requires a skill check with a DC higher than 10 [or use skills] that can't be used untrained."So it could potentially make a Jump or Climb check with a DC of 10.
The force is "shapeless", but you can imply that it's effectively Medium-sized since its 2 Str can lift 20 lbs.
I dunno. You sure can "imply" a *LOT* of things from the spell. All I'm saying is I'd like it if there was a little less "implying" is all.
So it can't:
1) climb "any surface with adequate handholds and footholds (natural or artificial), such as a very rough natural rock surface or a tree, or an unknotted rope, or pulling yourself up when dangling by your hands."
2) climb a surface with ledges to hold on to and stand on, such as a very rough wall or a ship’s rigging- IF IT IS SLIPPERY
3) climb a slippery rope quickly
4) balance on a beam 2-6 inches wide
5) balance on a sloped ramp 7-12 inches wide
6) long jump more than 10' (unless it is running? can it run?)
7) high jump more than 2' (again, unless it runs first?)
8) swim in rough water (can it swim? or would it walk on water since its a "force"?)
9) if it can't fly, how tall is it really? how high is its vertical reach?
Soo many questions.
Well as for answer to question 9 : No it can't fly if we stick to rules : "It can't perform any task that requires a skill check with a DC higher than 10 [or use skills] that can't be used untrained." and fly is Trained only skill
Hope this help you a little thought I would play it like a possibility to "fly" or levitate in some case such as to attach a rope to a ledge.
Well as for answer to question 9 : No it can't fly if we stick to rules : "It can't perform any task that requires a skill check with a DC higher than 10 [or use skills] that can't be used untrained." and fly is Trained only skill
Flying does not generally require the use of the Fly skill; it's only if you want to do something fancy like hovering, turning sharply, etc.
RPG Superstar 2008 Top 32, 2011 Top 16
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If it can only lift 20 pounds, then, unless you're playing a small sized caster, even a reduce self spell shouldn't put you within it's carrying capacity. Maybe a female elf could also get under the weight limit with the reduction, but that's about it.
If using 2 1st level spells in combination gets you some advantages, that's okay. Very slowly floating around at 15 feet speed isn't that big of a deal.
If it can only lift 20 pounds, then, unless you're playing a small sized caster, even a reduce self spell shouldn't put you within it's carrying capacity. Maybe a female elf could also get under the weight limit with the reduction, but that's about it.
The spell reduces your weight to 1/8th of normal, so as long as you and your equipment weigh less than 160lbs you are good. I'm talking about a scrawny human sorcerer carrying virtually no equipment, so he is easily under 160lbs, thus being able to be carried.
If using 2 1st level spells in combination gets you some advantages, that's okay. Very slowly floating around at 15 feet speed isn't that big of a deal.
Unseen servant lasts all day, every day, so the spellcaster has it up at all times. Its there to catch/fetch fallen items in combat, carry things across the battlefield, lift him to a higher location, fly him across a pit, hold an item in the air next to him, ready for him to grab, and even make his breakfast and make his bed lol. Its one spell that can do a million things. Most of those things I don't care about but the whole reduce person/fly trick gets old.
The combination of the 2 spells works. But reduce person lasts 1 min/lvl so your mage will have to expend spells slots to learn more reduce person if he wants to "fly" longer. Those slots could be so useful for other spells, but well it's a choice. Now, I can see him making scrolls to go around this...
Now the speed of flight is up to 15 feet in horizontal, and if ascending 45° it's only 5 feet. while using this mean of fly you are denied your DEX bonus to AC. And it can't be used efficiently in combat situation ( I'll require at least a spellcraft check from the wizard to cast in this position, and a fly check from the unseen servant ( if possible ? ) to see if he drops what is he lifting. )
So now if it's just to cross pits once in a while, it should be okay
your not going to get the cheap flying off a small caster:
Starting 5th level when they can communicate verbally with the familiar they can get a hawk familiar to do the job.
A hawks strength is 6 which = carrying capacity of 10lb
Reduce Person reduces the weight by factor 8 so a (now tiny) caster with full gear will be max 8lb
5th Level also opens the door to Improved Familiar:
small Air Elemental, Fly 100 ft. (perfect) Str. 10
so you might as well congratulate them for a smart combination of spells
Now, I can see him making scrolls to go around this...
Reduce Person can be made permannent for 2500gp
or put in a magic item for 1800gp, including Feather Fall in the magic item will put the price up to 9350gp (3.5SRD prices)
your not going to get the cheap flying off a small caster:
Starting 5th level when they can communicate verbally with the familiar they can get a hawk familiar to do the job.A hawks strength is 6 which = carrying capacity of 10lb
Reduce Person reduces the weight by factor 8 so a (now tiny) caster with full gear will be max 8lb5th Level also opens the door to Improved Familiar:
small Air Elemental, Fly 100 ft. (perfect) Str. 10
Well, as far as text goes, Unseen Servant is all but identical to the one in 3.5e. What you have is a great player, playing a Wizard, who has the capacity of creatively using spells for something other than "Ka-Boom".
My first thought when reading this thread was that the servant was in fact an Air Elemental(He is not.), but I believe that thought was actually an Invisible Stalker... those have fly.
As Agi Hammerthief pointed out above, the trick only works with small races reducing themselves to tiny. The servant can only lift (carry) 20lbs. flying or otherwise. 40lb. humans are hard to come by unless the character is a midget(Verne Troyer{Mini-Me} is 2'8"). Push/Pull/Drag requires a surface such as ground as things are easier to move along a surface. So 100lb. drag is not viable while flying.
Reduce Person can be made permannent for 2500gp
or put in a magic item for 1800gp, including Feather Fall in the magic item will put the price up to 9350gp (3.5SRD prices)
for 2000gp more you can get a wand of flying and fly like the big boys do :|
Personally "Speed of 15'" means the same thing to me as Speed: 15 which means ground speed. I don't see it as ghetto fly and figure if folks let their players get away with it then that's their game. It just isn't a problem in my group.
...and here we have a good old Rule as Intended vs. Rules as Written argument.
If your elderly butler Jeeves couldn't do it, the spell can't do it. Because, at heart, that's what the unseen servant spell is for.
Agreed. Unfortunately some people need it spelled out exactly because some DM's let player's run rings around them. Learn to say NO!
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If your elderly butler Jeeves couldn't do it, the spell can't do it. Because, at heart, that's what the unseen servant spell is for.What about Bruce Wayne's butler, Alfred?
Because he's awesome.
he is an ex-special forces from her Majesty Army...
thatis why he is awesome... British butler are the best :P