Either in Magnimar or one of smaller towns/cities? I mean asylums without deplorable conditions, where some good might actually be done for the patients.
Character background stuff. :)
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There's a small asylum outside of Sandpoint mentioned in the The Skinsaw Murders. It's not exactly hospitable, but the owner isn't described as cruel. It's just a quiet place to lock away the unwanted.
I think you'll be hard pressed to find a progressive asylum in a darker setting like Golarion. Most of the cultures seem to be modeled after Europe (somewhere between the 15th and 18th century), with assumedly similar views on mental health. It’s a tricky subject, one the D&D concept of healing magic doesn’t really address.
Either in Magnimar or one of smaller towns/cities? I mean asylums without deplorable conditions, where some good might actually be done for the patients.
Character background stuff. :)
Varisia still counts as a frontier region in a lot of ways, so I'd doubt you'd see much in the way of reliable mental health care out there. That being said, aside from the one noted in PF #2, you might find something supported by a temple of a good-aligned deity in Magnimar or outside Korvosa. Palin's Cove might even be a good place for something like this.
For the most part, though, in the wild wild west I think you either cowboy up, or wander off into the woods to find a bear to talk with.
I think you'll be hard pressed to find a progressive asylum in a darker setting like Golarion. Most of the cultures seem to be modeled after Europe (somewhere between the 15th and 18th century), with assumedly similar views on mental health. It’s a tricky subject, one the D&D concept of healing magic doesn’t really address.
That's kind of what I was expecting. I was just wondering if there were any places in Varisia that could reasonably support at least a somewhat more progressive asylum. Or at least some place where some actual help could be found.
The character isn't going to get much better and would escape anyway to make her way to Riddleport. It's just that a stay at a decent place or even recieving treatment from one compassionate person could help her move up to "functional". She's going to be in really rough shape, physically and mentally, before they find her. And after she escapes, honestly.
I would be inclined to think that there might be a religious monastic order (in the traditional sense of monastic not the PC class) that would endeavor to care for the mentally ill. There are lots of medieval precedents for this as well as monastic orders that cared for lepers, the poor, and even orphans. Much of Golarion has been presented as sort of a pseudo-Edwardian culture, which is interesting...but perhaps not to everyone's taste.
Also recall that Golarion is a diverse land. I'm sure somewhere there are folks who care about the less fortunate. We don't get to read about all the kind and benevolent folks in the lands because there is much more adventuring potential in the sordid and the vile.
CJ
Varisia still counts as a frontier region in a lot of ways, so I'd doubt you'd see much in the way of reliable mental health care out there. That being said, aside from the one noted in PF #2, you might find something supported by a temple of a good-aligned deity in Magnimar or outside Korvosa. Palin's Cove might even be a good place for something like this.
It makes sense, but I was kind of hoping to avoid aid from clerics, since one of her delusions is that Sarenrae is actively out to get her for something she did(she accidentally caused the death of her guardian and her foster brother through her own misbehavior), and almost all the gods and all their priests are in on it. I might just go ahead and run with this though and have that delusion take shape while in their care.
She would have to be found late enough for her horrible horrible acid burn scars to have healed naturally enough so that divine healing doesn't remove her disfigurement.
For the most part, though, in the wild wild west I think you either cowboy up, or wander off into the woods to find a bear to talk with.
Well, she's a gnome, so she's halfway to the latter already. ;)
Thanks guys!
There are lots of medieval precedents for this as well as monastic orders that cared for lepers, the poor, and even orphans.
Agh, I should have thought of that to begin with, that's perfect! Thanks!
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I'm glad you asked this question. I have wondered about mental health issues and healing spells a lot over the last few years.
If the mental health issue was organic in nature, such as chemical imbalances or dyslexia or Tourette's, when a cleric healed you would it disappear? Permanently? Temporarily?
If it was an injury, such as a brain lesion or an orc arrow lobotomy received in combat, healing would permanently take care of that, right?
If the mental health issue was stress or environment induced, such as Post Traumatic Stress Disorder or an abusive childhood, a cure spell would have no effect, right?
Mental health issues that come from a genetic propensity, such as substance abuse, would be unaffected? Or affected in the short term and then relapse?
If a character has Alzheimer's Disease and receives healing magic, is the brain tissue returned to its normal composition and memories restored?
Depending on how the game designer or an individual GM ruled on these questions, the number of asylums (or unmarked mass graves) might vary greatly.
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Hmm, i see this a little differently, actually. Most people in the world will never ever going to see clerical healing above (maybe) level 1. If a cure light wounds is pretty much the best you can hope for, and that takes up your income for several months to a year... Really, if your brother starts screaming for "no reason at all", and talks to trees, you are more likely to try and help him yourself, and eventually settle to keep him from harming himself.
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I typically think of healing magic (at least the day to day stuff) as resetting folks to their natural state. So, if you get a nasty scar across your face, then later get hurt somewhere else and get healed, the scar isn't going away...it's a part of you now. The new wound would heal up no problem, though.
So, chemical imbalances, substance abuse, PTSD...none of that's going away with a Cure Light. Arguably, you might have more benefit from Restoration for madness with an organic root, though as a DM I'd be inclined to call those fixes temporary in most cases.
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If the mental health issue was organic in nature, such as chemical imbalances or dyslexia or Tourette's, when a cleric healed you would it disappear? Permanently? Temporarily?
I'd say it removes the effects only temporarily. It's similar to a chronical disease.
If it was an injury, such as a brain lesion or an orc arrow lobotomy received in combat, healing would permanently take care of that, right?
Right! :-)
If the mental health issue was stress or environment induced, such as Post Traumatic Stress Disorder or an abusive childhood, a cure spell would have no effect, right?
Right! :-)
Mental health issues that come from a genetic propensity, such as substance abuse, would be unaffected? Or affected in the short term and then relapse?
I'd rule that heal spells won't have any effects. Sure, you can build up an addiction faster because of genetic disposition, but mostly it's depending on behaviour. It would be different with something like depression. You can try to prevent an outbreak of the disease, but if it's common in your family, you have a higher chance to get it, than people from healthy families. I'd rule this the same way as in your first example. Actually, it's nearly the same situation, but with a higher risk of being affected because of inheritance.
If a character has Alzheimer's Disease and receives healing magic, is the brain tissue returned to its normal composition and memories restored?
That's a tough question. I'd rule that it can be cured only with spells like Greater Restoration or Wish.
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Hmm, i see this a little differently, actually. Most people in the world will never ever going to see clerical healing above (maybe) level 1. If a cure light wounds is pretty much the best you can hope for, and that takes up your income for several months to a year... Really, if your brother starts screaming for "no reason at all", and talks to trees, you are more likely to try and help him yourself, and eventually settle to keep him from harming himself.
What's the reasoning for good clerics charging for basic healing spells? I know that they do...but why?
Additionally, with Pathfinder's new Channel Positive Energy mechanic, wouldn't churches have 30' radius circles inscribed on the floor? Just cram the wounded into the circle, say every two hours, and FLASH, healed! They could have a sign-up sheet after mass.
There's a small asylum outside of Sandpoint mentioned in the The Skinsaw Murders. It's not exactly hospitable, but the owner isn't described as cruel. It's just a quiet place to lock away the unwanted.
That is somewhat debatable. Doctor Habe knowingly and willingly allowed Grayst Sevilla to go untreated while the man was languishing with ghoul fever. A magical disease that rots the body and souls, and resurrects you as a horrid thing trapped between life and death, damned to eat carrion.
Dr. Habe did it in the interest of Science, but the two sets of PC's I've run through Runelords found him to be despicable.
The fact that there was no one else willing to take care of the sick, blind, and infirm, they would have seen him brought to justice. The fact that society dictated that Dr. Habe be allowed to continue to run his Sanitarium with routine inspections by the Sheriff and Father Zantus (a situation Habe deplores but has no alternative but to consent to), was definitely one of the creepy grey areas of the AP.
Not busting your chops Selk, but I think Habe could be a worthwhile minor villain, even if his Sanitarium is not filthy.
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There's a small asylum outside of Sandpoint mentioned in the The Skinsaw Murders. It's not exactly hospitable, but the owner isn't described as cruel. It's just a quiet place to lock away the unwanted.That is somewhat debatable. Doctor Habe knowingly and willingly allowed Grayst Sevilla to go untreated while the man was languishing with ghoul fever. A magical disease that rots the body and souls, and resurrects you as a horrid thing trapped between life and death, damned to eat carrion.
Dr. Habe did it in the interest of Science, but the two sets of PC's I've run through Runelords found him to be despicable.
The fact that there was no one else willing to take care of the sick, blind, and infirm, they would have seen him brought to justice. The fact that society dictated that Dr. Habe be allowed to continue to run his Sanitarium with routine inspections by the Sheriff and Father Zantus (a situation Habe deplores but has no alternative but to consent to), was definitely one of the creepy grey areas of the AP.
Not busting your chops Selk, but I think Habe could be a worthwhile minor villain, even if his Sanitarium is not filthy.
I interpreted Habe's unwillingness to treat Grayst more as fear than curiosity. He was alone, dealing with a half mad Szcarni who was showing signs of contagion. Maybe I skimmed over something.
It is a bit strange that they wouldn't have brought him to Father Zantus or another real healer. The sanitarium and Foxglove Manor were set pieces though -kind of daffy and anachronistic - but they established a great mood.
I interpreted Habe's unwillingness to treat Grayst more as fear than curiosity. He was alone, dealing with a half mad Szcarni who was showing signs of contagion. Maybe I skimmed over something.
It is a bit strange that they wouldn't have brought him to Father Zantus or another real healer. The sanitarium and Foxglove Manor were set pieces though -kind of daffy and anachronistic - but they established a great mood.
Ehh.. I regret any tone of condescension.
I do think you can read between the lines that Habe knows what is happening to Grayst, and is allowing it to play out in order to learn more about the disease. Its explicitedly stated that he left his practice in Magnimar because he was tired or afraid of inquiries made into his own medical ethics.
It plays into his inhospital nature he has towards visitors that you pointed out, its because he knows that he might have something to hide.
Anyway, I didn't mean to take the know-it-all tone.
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Madness in d20 is typically represented as ability drain rather than hp loss, so it should require a restoration to fix - and that is hefty magic, not readily found anywhere but major cities or metropoli, and even then fairly expensive (380 gp, roughly a year's salary for an average working-class tradesperson). I would imagine that madness is only slightly more likely to get cured in Golarion than in the historical real world, and then only for the truly wealthy.
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I interpreted Habe's unwillingness to treat Grayst more as fear than curiosity. He was alone, dealing with a half mad Szcarni who was showing signs of contagion. Maybe I skimmed over something.
It is a bit strange that they wouldn't have brought him to Father Zantus or another real healer. The sanitarium and Foxglove Manor were set pieces though -kind of daffy and anachronistic - but they established a great mood.
Ehh.. I regret any tone of condescension.
I do think you can read between the lines that Habe knows what is happening to Grayst, and is allowing it to play out in order to learn more about the disease. Its explicitedly stated that he left his practice in Magnimar because he was tired or afraid of inquiries made into his own medical ethics.
It plays into his inhospital nature he has towards visitors that you pointed out, its because he knows that he might have something to hide.
Anyway, I didn't mean to take the know-it-all tone.
No worries Watcher. I do it all the time. Half my posts are me getting my knickers in a twist over thematic minutae. I'll probably go off the deep end one day, railing at James (or F. Westley Shneiderblesteinerstein) because the brandy snifters in picture #1242 don't look Chelaxian enough, or something. ;)
If the mental health issue was stress or environment induced, such as Post Traumatic Stress Disorder or an abusive childhood, a cure spell would have no effect, right?Right! :-)
I was hoping this would be the general consensus, since I don't want it to be something that someone could just fix with magic.
Again, thanks for the help guys!