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Thanks so much I couldn't find a guide on this before, my google foo must be weak.

Mystic past life can only add spells of the same type to your spell list as in I could pick spells of the cleric's (or any other divine caster) spell list but not the wizard's (or any other arcane caster), so arcane spells are still off limits.

I have never played a Inquisitor before and so the best thing I can do is suggest this guide. And if you decide to play another class this Page can direct you to more helpful guides.

I'm building a Samsaran Reincarnated Druid and have yet to pick what spells I want for mystic past life. For a arcane caster this would be cake as I could just pick whatever spells I wanted from the summoner's or bard's spell list but I'm not so sure with a divine caster. I know I want restoration (so that I can get rid of the negative levels when I Reincarnate) miracle looks good too but that's about all I have so far. Also for reference I am building the druid as more of a blaster/battle field controller.

Thanks for any suggestions your help is much appreciated.

Ha I didn't even notice the misspelling of rogue thanks :)

Rynjin he isn't coddling them that much it is just that this is the rouges first time playing a rpg and he doesn't want scare/bore her to death, mostly because we need as many players as we can get. But I do dislike that he let her play a rouge given that he knows that it is one of worst classes in the game.

B.A. Robards thanks for the detailed answer however I have actually played almost that exact character before on 2 different occasions suffice it to say I want a change of pace. But that is one of the best non summoner summoner builds in the game imho. Also I wasn't a summoner the class I was a sorcerer who focused on summoning just thought I should clarify that (sad thing Is I built it so it wouldn't take off till level 11 and I died at level 3).

Well the group consensus is to play a cleric so a cleric I shall be. And as always thank you all for the advice and the quick responses.

I made a post a few days ago about a character of mine, it went well the post served its purpose. But my GM didn't like the character I built he said it would "overshadow other members of the party (mostly the rouge)" and he asked me to change my character in such a way as to completely put me of the idea of playing it, so the other option was to make a new character guess which one I chose. The main problem my GM had with my old character was he was a vivisectionist alchemist and he feared (and rightly so) that I would overshadow the rouge in the party and that there would be no way to let the rouge shine without in turn making me better as well.

So I am now tasked with making my new character, the other members of the party are a rouge who I have mentioned and a gunslinger (there is also a fighter that is there occasionally but not often enough to be relevant). My fist thoughts are a magus as that is somewhat like a alchemist 2/3 spell progression and 3/4 BAB but is different enough that my GM will be ok with it. So mostly I am asking what would be the best class for this group, we need someone who can do magics but we also need someone who can mix it up in melee as we have no real front line, my last character was a summoner that all the mobs rushed at and killed instantly it was partly my fault as well because I stood to close but still I died in one turn.

We are playing rise of the rune lords and we are level 3, the only character creation rules are that it must be published by Paizo so no 3pp and that it must make some sense as far as the world of Golarion is concerned example a undead cleric of Pharasma would be a big no.

Thanks for any advice on the subject as I'm not sure what to play, if all else fails I will play a kensai blackblade/hexcrafter staff magus (not sure which one of those I like better either).

Would you mind providing a link to that FAQ Firebug as that may impact some of my builds. I tried finding it myself but all I can seem to find are the old ones.

#1 No accelerated drinker does not work with extracts the only reason potion glutton does is because of that "and other potables" clause. Also there was a FAQ that stated that accelerated drinker does not work with extracts.
#2 As far as I know there is no easier ways to get DEX to damage on natural attacks then a agile amulet.
#3 By RAW share spells does nothing for you as you can't cast spells (extracts do not count as spells). Most GMs I know would let you use it as normal though. But note that it says that you cast the spell on the familiar nowhere does it say you both gain the benefit of the spell. And if your familiar drank the extract well then it would be like he had cast the spell on himself you would gain no benefit as you didn't drink it.

Ok but Nethys lists both books as sources?

I was looking at the juju oracle mystery on the OGC and wanted to know if they left out anything (as there was a note saying they had edited it) and so I found it on Archives of Nethys and for some reason they are almost completely different mysteries. Does anyone know why this might be or perhaps some one owns the book it is from and can verify which is correct.

OGC

Nethys

#1 Fullplate has a a ACP of 6 there is a trait (Armor Expert) that reduces that by 1, the comfort enchantment reduces it by 1 (or you can go cumfort +2 if you don't have the trait), masterwork (all magic items are masterwork) reduces it by 1, and mithral reduces it by 3 so 1+1+1+3=6-6=0 that is how.
#2 No you don't for the reasons I mentioned before. Let me explain, with a STR build I can use Monstrous Physique II to turn into a four armed gargoyle (one of the best forms to use with this spell) which gives me 6 natural attacks and a +4 STR and a -2 to DEX which means that there is a 6 difference between a STR and DEX builds with this spell (one of the best polymorph spells you get) so 6/2=3x6=18 plus any damage lost form missed attacks do to the lower accuracy. And there aren't any really good DEX polymorph spells the best one is elemental body which gives crap natural attacks. That is why you do less damage.
#3 You have to be a worshiper of Urgathoa to use potion glutton and Urgathoa is a NE god your character is CG you must have one hell of a back story to justify that alignment.
#4 Improved familiars can't use archetypes as they don't get the speak with animal ability that the archetypes replace.
#5 The rest looks fine.

Well I don't do DEX builds on a alchemist (melee ones at least) on a magus yes. I feel even more then a magus alchemists rely on polymorph effects and DEX builds don't really benefit from them a whole lot. To me it breaks down like this low to mid levels STR builds do much more damage, DEX builds have better ac and initiative, at high levels it is damage vs initiative as by this point STR can buy fullplate armor with 0 ACP. but that is just my two cents worth others may disagree.

Well I am building a alchemist as we speak and the first thing I would recommend is to read this guide.

And once you have done that (or if you already have) I would use this point buy STR 16 DEX 12 CON 12 INT 14 WIS 10 CHA 7. This is before racial modifiers and level increases, I would put my level increase into str and pick a race that buffs int and another stat like con or dex as the only races that buff both STR and INt are lashunta and scaleheart skinwalkers.
I doubt your gm will let you use lashunta but if he does for sure do it and the scaleheart skinwalkers only grants you a STR buff while in beast form and most gms wont let that bonus carry over into polymorph effects (I would argue it does as it is a racial bonus and not a polymorph effect but that's just me) and by level 10 as a melee alchemist you should be polymorphed all the time.

Well there is some conflicting data on that some people say to use the polymorph size chart and some say to use the universal monster rules one so I am not sure on the actual numbers.

I shall go with beastmorph! Thank you for the advice, you are all the best.

There are all so good makes my decision even harder.

Actually I have changed my mind I am going to use the preservationist archetype because upon further investigation I decided beastmorph doesn't give you that much. My reasoning behind this is that the main thing you want beastmorph for is pounce and you don't get that until level 10 and at that same level you get beast shape 2 which also gives pounce so all that beastmorph really does is save me a standard action because I don't have to use beast shape and at higher levels when I am under a ploymorph effect most of the time beastmorph offers no real benefit. Or at least that's what I think, though I still feel I am missing some thing as everyone speaks highly of the beastmorph archetype so what is it that beasmorph gives that I am missing?

EDIT: Unless do Beastmorph's abilities stack on top of whatever you ploymorph into as I could you give a pounce and rake to any creature you turn into?

Yeah I know about tumor familiar and regardless of what I do I am going to take it but like Errant said Homunculist gets me another familiar to flank with. Anyways thanks for all the input I think I will go beastmorph as my last character was a summoner and I want something different.

I am building a alchemist and I have decided on almost everything but archetypes, I know I want to use Vivisectionist and one other and I have narrowed that list down to Preservationist, Beastmorph, and homunculist. So it seems to break down like this Preservationist to give me some temporary flanking buddy's who can also take some damage for the team. Then there is Beastmorph which just makes me more awesome at melee plus adds some utility abilities. Then there is homunculist which falls some where in the middle as I would use the familiar as melee partner with that new mauler archetype.

For some background my party is made up of me, a gunslinger, and a rouge so useless she may as well not exist, I am joking about that but it does feel that way sometimes. My last character was a summoning sorcerer the problem was that any smart enemy would just rush past are not existent front line and attack me so I couldn't summon anything. So I built this new character with that in mind and made him more melee oriented but we still need someone who can do magics so an alchemist seemed a good choice it was that or a magus and a alchemist seemed like he would be better at skills.

The last thing I need help with isn't so much about the alchemist but about skills. I am planing to pick up a knowledge skill but I only have enough traits for one. I was thinking religion as that could help with outsiders as well as cultist and the like. Someone else suggested history as it could be used as a for almost anything not sure about that but that's what they said.

Well anyways thanks for any advice you might have for me it is much appreciated.

PS: forgot to mention this is a level 3 character.

Hahaha I have been doing it wrong for years then. Thanks guys just seems weird to me that they work this way but whatever it is what it is. Also Thanis I was referring to this, An extract is “cast” by drinking it, as if imbibing a potion, this part to me means they take the same action but whatever I guess I am wrong.

I am building a alchemist and was trying to figure out what action it was to use a extract and on the OGC there is a handy little side bar that references any relevant FAQ's and on there it said it was a standard action to use a extract and that this included retrieving any supplies or materials. But in the rule's for extract's them selves it says it is the same action as using a potion and that basically for all intensive purposes they are just powerful potions. So does that mean it is just a standard action to both retrieve a potion and drink it and not a move and a standard like I thought or is it still even with a that FAQ a move and a standard to use a extract. The former makes the most sense to me as I always thought it should only be a move and a standard if the potion was in a pack or some thing but if it was in a bandolier or the like it should just be part of the standard, like how you can draw a weapon as part of a move.

Or you could just say that extracts and potions are different things and so they take different actions but the way extracts are worded makes me doubt this is the case.

Hey guys I'm back after the first game and it went well (and sorry about the delay got the dates wrong). Like you said Frodo it became a matter of who went first not that normal play isn't already like that bu this was just more so. Anyways thank you all very much for your advice it was a big help.

I agree his item list is superb.
Edit: I just realized most things past CR 20 are immune to fear does this mean I should drop enforcer?

Hi Frodo believe it or not have read your guide before (It is very good by the way) and if I was Staring at level one I would be a Kensai Bladebound Fiend Flayer Magus because it seems like the most sensible choice. But I have wanted to play this build for a while now and it only works at very high level because of the high feat requirements and I feel like this is my only chance to play this character so I am taking it after all the whole point is to have fun.

I was thinking Why use slumber after all I could grab Eternal Slumber its better in almost every way the only problem I see is waking someone up if I need to for some reason. Also any good Wizard spells I Should grab with greater spell access perhaps ones with good mythic options?

Edit: First game Is Thursday I will let you know what happens.

Also Dafydd to the best of my knowledge pearls of power are reusable?

4 Shapeshifting Mastery makes it so my base attack bonus is equal to my caster level (which is 20) for the natural attacks of what ever I Polymorph into 20-5=15 which is equal to my normal BAB.
5 If you find a way I would be very interested.
6 true I probably wont end up using either so it doesn't really matter but its true all the same.
11 Found a solution, the merciful enchantment should do the job I think.

If there are rules for such items then yes if not then no.
By raw the bladebound archetype and hexcrafter archetype don't stack but I'm sure my GM would let me, but it also doesn't mesh to well with what I'm trying to do.
My GM is being Nice as it is I don't want to make him regret it though it is tempting.

1 Didn't know about that item thanks!
2 It is a house rule yes.
3 It only works on non mythic creatures and given how powerful the team is going to be I don't think we will be running into many of them.
4 It would take up one of his hands and he would lose that slam but he could do it.
5 I would but I may not always be Polymorphed or I may be something other than a Calikang, but it would make things easier yes.
6 True but I don't see sudden strike being that much better I either move and attack with a plus 10 bonus as swift action or I attack as a swift action and get to reroll the attck roll if I miss it's a meh choice to me but you have a point.
7 True true.
8 The Elf's favored class bonus gives you three extra Arcana by level 18 and thanks to a recent FAQ half-elves can take it.
9 How dumb of me I forgot that i could put more then one enchantment on an item thanks.
10 also true thanks.
11 From what I have read frostbite would activate enforcer but yes I should grab that trait to be sure.
12 It is called Ring of Continuation but the spell has to have a duration of 10 minutes per level for it to work which monstrous physique does not unfortunately.

Thanks for all the help!

Okay so after Reading your advice Hear is what I have come up with.

I still have one myhtic feat left as well as a few magic items. I am unsure what mythic spell to grab any tips would be welcomed. The main reason I went with a strength magus over a dex magus is because of the polymorpth spells, by using Monstrous Physique and turning into a Calikang I can grab five extra attacks that's a lot of damage and a dex build couldn't really do this. However a dex build would have better ac, saves, and initiative and so I built that to and we will see which is better.

So it's the same deal as before I still have one mythic feat and a few magic items left to pick as i said the main difference is the ac, saves, and initiative which the dex build is much better at. Also no Calikang which is sad but it gets one more mythic spell so yeah there is that.

I know you all don't like the hex strike part but its what I want so I will take the hit to over all strength for it. A note on ability scores I didn't go all out into strength/dex and instead buffed intelligence a bit so that I still have good dc's, also Cap. Darling you have a feat bonus listed in your break down of the attack stat I'm curious where this is from.

And lastly thank you all so much for the advice.

I just started a new campaign and my Gm gave us the character creation rules so here they are.
Level 20, mythic tier 10, any 3pp, we are to use these numbers for are base stats (as in before racial mods, magic items and level bonuses) 30 28 26 24 22 20, and we can pick any 12 magic items of any price or rarity. Basically he wants us to make super mega awesome sauce characters who are then going to stop a world war.
I have decided to make a strength based hexcrafter magus, my build so far is based around using hexes in melee as part of hex strike (for this build lets assume hexcrafter's can us hex strike) I plan on using a cestus because if I am reading it right it qualify as an unarmed strike. I have most of the the build worked out I'm just wondering what mythic path (or paths) would Work best for a magus, what magic items you would choose, what feats you would pick, and what mix of arcana and hexes you would use. Thanks for any help.

Disclaimer: poor grammar ahead read at own risk.

I have been researching summoners (not the class just anyone who can summon) and have come to the conclusion that the best summoner is the master summoner (or maybe the evangelist cleric) which I find annoying maybe its the name, I don't know.
And so I have been on a mission to build the best non summoner summoner possible here is what I have so far.
Samsarans thassilonian specialists (sloth) bloatmage (both thassilonian specialists and bloat mage are called something else on the ogc) and here are my reasons for those choices.

Samsarans because of mystic past life racial trait which lets you get summon monster at a lower level off the summoners spell list.
Wizard because of of one feat acadamae graduate (the downsides can be bypassed with a cord of stubborn resolve and some damage damage reduction) which lets you summon as a standard action which is key to matching a summoner.
thassilonian specialists to give you enough spells per day of you highest level to compete with the summoner.
And lastly bloatmage so you can us the abyssal bloodlines level 15 power which whilst it takes a while to get is awesome, the blood pool also gives you more spells per day which is nice.

This all adds up so that by level 15 you can cast summon monster VIII to summon 3 hezrou demons 9 times a day (10 with bonded item) as a standard action.
The main problem with this build is that it takes a while to get rolling as until mid levels its hard to find a cheap reliable source of damage reduction for the cord of stubborn resolve. But on the other hand you are still a full caster (minus the arcane schools you gave up) where as a summoner is a 2/3 spell caster. And so when all is said and done I think it compares nicely to the master summoner.

This character was just a thought experiment to show that there is other game in town besides the summoner when it comes to summoning, which I know everyone all ready knows but I felt it was worth reiterating.
Also I'm sure I wasn't the first to come up with this type of build there is probably even a thread about it but I spent a lot of time on it and wanted to share it with the forums and if I made a mistake or if you think there is a better option please leave a comment.

I was wondering what would happen if a cleric took both the animal and scalykind domains as they both grant animal companions. And before you you go looking there is one god that has both domains Ydersius the god of serpent folk.
Now my first thought was that you just get both but then I was reading that there is a unwritten rule that you can only have one animal companion at a time (without an archetype at least) is this true or is it written somewhere and I just missed it. And if it is true then what happens do you only gain the benefit of one domain, do you get both regardless, or do you only get one but the druid levels stack giving you an animal companion at a higher than character level?
This may have been asked before and if so I am sorry.

Sorry if this has been asked before but could find anything about it.
I was looking through the witch's hexes when I came across the grand hex summon spirit which got me thinking if is it possible to summon spirits with spells like planar binding and planar ally? I know you can summon ghosts and what not through necromancy but necromancy isn't everyone's cup of tea. I figure that you might be able to summon spirits from one of the afterlife planes now you could make the argument that they don't count as outsiders but if that's the case just summon the spirit of a tiefling/aasamir. I know this still has a lot of holes in it but I wanted see what public opinion on this might be. Sorry if this sounds stupid but I thought it could be interesting.

Thanks for all the great advice guys and gals it was very helpful.
I figured I would post my character and get everyone's Opinion on it so with out further adieu.

I'm not sure if I really need to pump charisma that high after all summoning spells don't have DC's. I would also really like to dump strength to 7 but pitborns dumb +2 to strength means I can't, oh well.
Also not sure what my second spell should be after all mage armor only gives me a +2 to ac since I have armor. And lastly not sure which is better for me Desperate Focus or Diabolic Dabbler.

Anyways as always thanks so much for all your great help I appreciate it a lot!

Great advice about retraining thanks!
It's not that the illusionist wasn't allowed it was just that I thought of this summoning character first than the illusionist but my GM had already made plans for the summoning character. It was my fault I told him that I was making a summoning character and took that as that was what I was going to play but for me that usually isn't the case (I make a lot of characters). Unfortunately for me I will probably be evil after all my character is a tyfling abyssal sorcerer focused on summoning evil things but if I can write a good enough back story to justify a good/neutral alignment I will look into it.

Planar binding is good but requires 2 other spells to work and sorcerer spells known are at a premium. I have access to ACG (I even own the book!) and plan an taking evolved summon no matter what I was just wondering if it would be worth it at higher levels once I have my core feats. I know it's unlikely that I will reach that high of a level in a standard adventure but I like to be an optimist.

Edit: Now don't get me wrong I think tattooed sorcerer is a good archetype it's just not as clear cut between the two for me.

The brutal bloodline doesn't seem as good for summoning because it replaces the abyssal bloodline arcana which is one of the best things about it. I completely missed that part of the bonus spells I feel stupid now.
And thanks for all the advice.

I don't plan on mixing it up in melee if possible that's a job better suited to my disposable summons. Couldn't I use the 9th level power of false priest to use divine summoning spells from the cleric/druid spell list like summon planar ally? Also do you think the spell harrowed summoning is worth the two feat investment.

I made a thread the other day about building a illusionist sorcerer and the advice I got from that thread was great and if I was playing a illusionist I would follow it however I made the fatal mistake of not clearing it with my GM. Long story short he wasn't thrilled with it and after a short talk we came to a compromise in the form of a summoning sorcerer as it fit into his campaign better.

So the point of this thread is to get some advice about my new character so far the character looks like this pit-born tiefling sorcerer abyssal bloodline.
My main concerns are in the feat, trait, and archetype sections. As feats go I know what feats to take just not when to take them one feat in particular augment summoning. Since my blood line gives it to me as a bonus feat I'm wondering if I should wait until level 7 and get it that way or just get it as my level 3 feat (also while were on the subject do I still have to qualify for bloodline bonus feats or do I just get them?). As for traits I know some good all around traits like reactionary but I'm wondering if there are any must have traits for this kind of build. Of the few archetypes two standout as possible improvements over the base sorcerer, tattooed sorcerer and false priest (I know it's called razmiran priest but considering you don't have to worship razmir to take the archetype I see little reason to call it that) but I just can't decide which is better.

which would you suggest for arcane bond familiar or bonded object? And thanks for all the great advice.

What feat would you suggest for first level, I'm thinking Effortless Trickery so that I can have more than one illusion at once. And thanks for the advice.
Edit: Veiled Illusionist looks interesting but wouldn't I stop progressing in my bloodline?

I know there are quite a few threads about this but I felt the need to make my own so please bare with me.
I am trying to build an illusionist for an upcoming rise of the rune lords campaign but I'm having trouble deciding on a somethings. Right now I'm thinking gnome sorcerer but I cant decided between the arcane and umbral bloodlines. Next do you think the tattooed sorcerer archetype would be good for an illusionist? And lastly do you think I would be better off using a wizard instead of a sorcerer?
Thanks for any advice.

Ah I see, a harrow deck is a deck of fortune telling cards they are used for the spell harrowing which gives bonuses (or penalties) based on the cards drawn. There was a player companion book released recently called harrow hand book which has a bunch more uses for them, like using one for summoning (harrowed summon).

A true neutral caster's summoned monsters wouldn't be affected by any of the protection spells either.
Edit: I get that SNA is supposed to be weaker but my question is why?

Darksol those are all good points all I'm trying to argue is that SM does those things just as well as SNA if not better thanks to better feat support.
And for more proof lets look at SM9 and SNA9, SM9 has 6 monster on its list SNA9 has 2, the highest CR monster on SM9 is CR 14 the highest on SNA9 is CR 13. To me this looks pretty cut and dry SM9 is better than SNA9.

Wraithstrike I get that part of the reason is thematic but if summon monster is meant to summon outsiders than why does it summon better animals than summon nature's ally?

Darksol summon nature's ally can summon elementals but so can summon monster! Also for pure damage the big cats are better.

The title is a bit misleading, my real question is why is summon monster so much better! I mean if you compare summon monster (SM) and summon nature's ally (SNA) level by level SM beats SNA to a pulp. I may be exaggerating a bit but look at SM 6 and SNA 6 the best summon on both those list is the dire tiger but SM's dire tiger gets the celestial/fiendish templates which makes it 1 CR higher than SNA's dire tiger. And thats not even mentioning feat support which SM wins hands down (sacred summon anyone).
The only reason is see for this is to debuff druids as summoners, as there the main user of SNA. I mean would making SNA as powerful as SM really make the game unbalanced? if you know the answer please tell me I would love to know.

Thanks for any input.

Dukeh555
#1 don't know what your first question is exactly could you explain?
#2 I'm a wyvaran druid (saurian shaman archetype).

Dieben, these where my thoughts as well.