Short simple, I know about Osprey, but I'm curious as to what other famous/powerful canon druids there are running around in Golarion or even in Golarion's history. Any info would be appreciated!
I can't keep anything animated beyond the one scenario since permanent effects end, and I can't keep skeletons or other corpses from one scenario to the next either. I already know about the onyx cost, because I will have to buy different value onyx gems ahead of time and guess at a creature's HD when I want to raise it. Since here is no price listed for a skeleton, I can't buy it in PFS rules to my understanding, unless someone can post a source stating otherwise. Also, for pulling it out, skeleton is in a sack, sack is in a handy haversack. Move action to retrieve the sack, free action to drop the sack, spilling it's contents, standard action to cast animate dead. It's the only way it's possible to do it in combat without a full corpse being lugged around, which is a hassle and far heavier. As far as consumables go, at least one third of my total GP if not more will have been spent on just onyx by the time the character retires.
It's a material component for a spell, with no listed cost. I've been told I CANT take skeletons with me from scenario to scenario because they are mundane items, and don't have a price listed anywhere. So basically, animate dead is almost useless in society play. Thanks for clarifying, I tried to find something saying I couldn't do this, but didn't. This clears it up a bit, I shall no longer make dragons.
I just have a short and simple question, I can't seem to find an answer for it. It seems that it's easily possible, but because it's domains, it's foggy.
As an example, can I use a 5th level domain slot to prepare one of my 4th or lower level domain spells?
I ask because I want to swap a useless domain spell, for a useful one of a lower level. Why prepare a Locate Object, when I can prepare a second Longstrider or Comprehend Languages? Again, as an example.
That story makes a good point. So then the final ruling it seems will be to just let everyone keep their current alignment. Yes this will kill a few abilities, but only the most powerful ones that make characters have an unfair advantage for this occasion.
Secondly, Trollbill, that's why I added in multiple different styles of combat. This is a combat tournament. Earlier on this post the thought went out for a Survivor style challenge, and I liked the idea, and I'll work on that after I get the kinks worked out of this. Most of them seem to be sorted, save for this alignment problem. It is rather problematic, to say the least. It hadn't even occurred to me. Thank you messageboards! And of course, all you helpful people. I really want to have a few friends together and do a smaller scale test of this, and depending on how that goes, hold a larger scale open invite one here in the Twin Cities later in January if possible.
I believe I have thought of a solution for the tournament that should actually solve almost any and all alignment based issues. Ignore any class requirements for the duration of the tournament (you still have to qualify naturally outside the tournament), then each character is assigned a random alignment upon registration. Roll a D10. 1 is Lawful Evil, 2 is Neutral Evil, 3 is Chaotic Evil, and so forth, 10 is reroll or choice (undecided). This could work quite well at balancing abilities, as in theory every 1 in 3 PCs will be evil aligned, so paladins will get to smite on occasion (as they should get a chance to) as well as other class abilities working. Thoughts?
Maybe just flat out assigning one team as lawful good, and the other as chaotic evil for the purposes of any alignment based abilities. This would effectively alter all abilities a character has based off of those abilities as well for the duration of the match. Example being, a paladins smite evil and detect evil abilities, if he were assigned to the evil team, they would become smite good and detect good.
Another possible solution would be to have every PC have a random alignment for the entirety of the tournament. The main problem I see with this solution is the potential to harm your own allies, but that should always be a potential danger.
True neutral filter is probably the only fair way to do that. The hidden starting areas is a nice idea, I think what I will end up doing is the random map idea, so they may start out hidden, or in public view for all to see.
Lormyr, the number of rounds before combat is an excellent idea. That would probably work far better than allowing casters to buff. As far as terrain goes, allowing players to buy terrain or select it could give some characters a needed or situational edge, and can neuter others. A random map could work better, however the only way to do that effectively is have a decent sized supply of maps available for use.
Jiggy, I do not know how to accommodate for alignment based abilities. Many spells such as chaos hammer should work fine, but smite evil, I haven't the faintest idea. Any suggestions?
Conman, I really really like the idea of a Survivor style game for PCs. That could be my next project to work on. That could allow for a whole different breed of characters to shine. Of all kinds even.
That's what the team and and larger games are for. Imagine your Inspire Courage buffing 20 or more PCs at once. Not every PC will be good at 1v1 combat. Not every PC will be good in large scale combat. Fighters will shine 1v1. Wizards will shine in 4v4. etc etc. The multiple game types allow every PC a chance do have some fun.
However, it is still a combat based tournament. Again, not every character is built for that, and some will be left out. This is a chance for PFS PvP. Plain and simple.
James, I like the rule in the grand melee about two rounds to prepare before combat begins. The leaving the arena rules are also something important it seems I left out, as well as invisibility or secret moves. Announcing the bonus to rolls before they are made also sounds like a very helpful rule.
Thanks for the feedback so far. I understand that there will be many PFS characters who will not do as well as others in this. That said, I believe some characters will surprise people. Yes, a lot of matches will be either Win the Initiative or Die, but there will never be a way round that. It's how the game mechanics work.
To Cao, the Role system is an attempt to breakdown what characters do to help judges balance things. Maybe it could be expanded a bit to help out more. In addition, if you read the rules about player registration, them giving us additional info helps reduce stress on judges, as well as needing resources and ruling on hand.
Lormyr, yes I had planned to run this thing sometime in January. I've got my home store here in Minneapolis in mind.
James, I had not thought about trying it out online, that could get a lot of players potentially, and would be beyond my skill alone to organize.
Myles, that's kinda why I threw in the team and larger battle styles. So more styles of character get a chance to shine. I know PCs like skill monkey or socialites won't really get to, but it is a tournament after all.
And Jiggy, I've seen it a fair amount. Not too big, but a fair amount.
Most of the players up here realize they need to optimize to survive, so there are few "bad" characters here. But at the same time, those who minmax too hard kinda become the brunt end of a joke and that shies others away from doing the same. Optimization is an essential part of the game, but Min Maxing to break the game actually ruins the fun. It makes your teammates feel less useful, and leaves the GM disappointed if he never gets to put you in danger. I have and always will strongly despise broken or overpowered PCs. In a tournament, I understand that in solo matches they will probably reign, but in team matches, I think they will get wiped out. Because a group of smart players with the right skills can knock out anyone.
Hello everyone, first, a little background information for this. You see it all the time as a player or a GM in society play. "My character is better," or "Well, I can do this." What if there were a way for PFS players to have a time where they could truly show how they would fare against everyone else? Whether in a one-on-one match, or in team fights, a place where every character had a time to shine. Enter the Unsanctioned and Unofficial Pathfinder Society Tournament (for now.)
I've got a basic layout of the tournament rules and inner workings, but I would love to hear feedback from everyone about this, whether you are a player, GM, or Paizo staff.
This is rather expansive:
-------Basic Rules
-No level 1 PCs.
-All matches will be by tier, unless specified.
-Tiers are as follows; 2-3, 4-5, 6-7, 8-9, 10-11, 12+
-All rulings made by judges are final.
-These are PFS characters, and all combat is to be based on PFS rules and rulings. This includes everything from spell selection to magic items and everything in between.
-All spectators must keep any and all tactical help to a minimum. (No help at all is best.)
-Anyone outside the current participants who gives tactical help will receive one warning. After that, they will be asked to spectate elsewhere so as not to disrupt and offset gameplay. Three warnings total, and the player will be asked politely to leave. All matches are a test of player skill and character strengths and tactics. Outside influence swings the balance of a match unfairly in the direction of one player.
-While rounds in combat are 6 seconds, each player will have 15 seconds to decide their actions. Combat is quick and dirty. Get into the mindset of your characters. Learn their abilities and tactics. Know everything you have at your disposal, and know it well. You don't get second chances, and you don't get extra time. Be prepared. Plan your turn even as your opponent plays out theirs. Measure distances quickly. Know your spells. Have AoE templates.
-Not every PFS character will be suited to gladiatorial combat. Choose what characters you bring with that in mind. If you bring a character not designed for combat, be prepared to not do as well as others. Unless you have some sort of trick up your sleeve. *wink*
-All matches are until death, or surrender. This goes for every play style. That means Heal checks to stabilize, Heal checks to see if defenders are still alive, coup de grace's will be taken. (This allows for some third element tactics to come in to play, provided the right PCs are involved, such as bluff checks to feign unconsciousness, and similar situations.) This does not mean a PC can forfeit a match on accident by leaving a living opponent accidentally. A PC will not be allowed to finish a match until all opponents are dead or have surrendered. (NPC judges have miscellaneous spells to watch all current opponents.)
-NO CHEATING. This should not need to be stated. While most PFS players are quite honest, this could still be a factor. Please have all numbers broken down, so you know where your bonuses are from if asked. It shouldn't ever be a debate. (Examples, "I don't know, hero lab said I had it," or "I don't remember where I got it from.") Be thorough. Again, know your character well. Please. It will help everyone have a great time, and help everything go smoothly.
-Buff spells may be cast in and out of combat, but have separate rulings. Spells with a duration of "10 minutes per level" or greater may be cast before combat. Each spell being cast must be stated before initiative is rolled, and spent accordingly. All spells with lesser durations than "10 minutes per level" must be cast in combat. No exceptions.
-All PCs reset all vital statistics after every combat. Nothing rolls over from one combat to another. All spells reset, hit points reset, ability damage, death, etc.
-Players may not look up any Bestiary entry during the course of the match unless they have summoned the creature to be looked up. Any player who does so will be counted as cheating, and forfeit the match. Any knowledge a player may have beforehand about a monster is acceptable, and any knowledge check a character makes will have the resulting learned information given by an unbiased spectator or judge.
- THE GOLDEN RULE –
- Be respectful of the Host Location. They are kind enough to let us have such an event, we should be just as kind and support them in turn.
-------Game Types
Part One - The Singles
-These are the main tournament matches. It will be broken down by tier, with each tier having its own champion. All singles matches require a Judge.
-Each tier will be run Round Robin style, with each PC fighting every other PC in tier. The PC with the most wins, is the champion.
-All ties will have a tiebreaker match to determine the winner. This includes to determine the champion as well as suicidal matches.
----Optional----
-To give different style PCs a chance to win this, possible other styles of competition are available.
-Examples as follows
--Arcane Spellcaster duels
--Melee Fighter duels
--Archer duels
--Tank duels (The Slap Fight Pits)
--Divine Spellcaster duels
Part Two - The Doubles
-2v2 Teams chosen by players who wish to play together against other teams.
-These are also Round Robin style, with a Champion Duo at the end.
-Both PCs do NOT require separate players.
Part Three - The Parties
-4v4 Teams chosen by players who wish to play together against other parties.
-These are played free roam style, not bound by tier, nor any other requirement.
-Each of the 4 PCs must have a separate player.
-Each Party will have its members, races, classes, and APL up for public view at the tournament.
-Any Party may be challenged by ANY other party at any time. Matches will commence once all players on both parties are free. NO ONE is required to accept a challenge, and no Party is allowed to challenge a party more than 2 APL below their own, though any Party is allowed to challenge another party of a higher APL than their own. (Ex, Party A has an APL 3, and Party B has an APL 6. Party A may challenge party B, but Party B may not challenge Party A.)
-ALL Party PCs must be within 2 levels of the APL. This is to keep teams from recruiting high level PCs counterbalanced by low level PCs to create teams of misleading strength. APL rounding rules follow those laid out in the Society Guide to Organized Play.
Part Four - The Frenzy
-This is a Free For All match held for every tier.
-All characters from each tier are to be invited to participate, none are required.
-This has the potential to have a very large number of involved PCs. A judge is required to track Initiative as well as keep players in check.
-All initiative ties will be decided first by initiative bonuses first, then a flat D20 roll-off second. Highest roll wins.
-These matches may take up a considerable chunk of time.
Part Five - The Battle
-This is a Half and Half battle style match held for every tier.
-All characters from each tier are to be invited to participate, none are required.
-This has the potential to have a very large number of involved PCs. A judge is required.
-Initiative will be determined by taking the average initiative bonus for each team, and then each team rolling a single D20 and applying the bonus. Turns will be taken in waves.
-One team will take a round, followed by the other. This is to cut down on the number of rounds required in a battle to complete it. This is intended to be fun, not lengthy and painstaking.
-Each team will break its members down into groups based on initiative bonuses. 0-3, 4-6, 7-9, and 10+. After teams roll initiative, it will go back and forth from team to team based on initiative groups. (Example, Team A gets a 13 initiative and Team B gets a 7. Team A breaks its members down into initiative groups, and finds that only 2 of its members have initiative bonus's greater than 10. Team B does the same and finds they have 4 members with initiative bonus's greater than 10. Though Team A won initiative, Team B has the advantage for the first round. Team A will have its two members go first, since they won team initiative, and both act at once. Then Team B will have its four members go. Then Team A has its members with bonus's of 7-9 go, and so on and so forth.)
-Judges will divide teams as evenly as possible. Each PC registered will have an attached role. Judges will divide PC roles evenly amongst the teams, ignoring all other qualities of any given PC.
------- Fame Bonuses
-All PCs may use their total Fame as a currency of sorts for the duration of the tournament.
-Each character will have a card with their total Fame listed, as well as Fame spent during the course of the Tournament.
-Fame may not be spent during The Battle or The Frenzy play styles.
-Fame may be spent for several purposes, as follows:
--Fame may be used to select the terrain for any given match the PC is participating in. This is for one match only, and any other PC in the current match may outbid another to select a terrain of their preference instead. This is allowed as an open bidding war in duels, and must be a team decision in all other game types. These are to be played strictly on open, flat battlefields. Players may bring terrain with them to use and bid for, or borrow terrain from other players not currently in the match.
--- The following are a number of random terrains to be drawn on blank flip mats or battle mats by nearby judges if available; 5 foot wide maze corridors, 10 foot wide maze corridors, and random urban environments.
--Fame may also be used to purchase a bonus to any single initiative roll. Bonuses must be purchased prior to the roll, and checked off on the tracking card before rolling.
-------- Registration Rules
--All Registering PCs must also provide the following information to the host upon signup.
-PFS player - character number
-Class and any applicable archetypes
-Race
-Levels of all classes
-Character role : Melee DPR, Melee Tank (HP or AC), Ranged DPR, Arcane Spellcaster, Divine Spellcaster
-Any Team or Party the PC is a part of. Each PC is limited to being a member of a single Team and/or Party.
-Any rare or odd feature of your character you believe the host and judges should know. This could be anything from being a Goblin to a man with no legs. All we need to know is how you have it legal for society play, and proof. This will save an immense amount of time with debates.
--Learn the abilities and equipment of all PCs you wish to register. There will not be do-overs, there will not be take backs. If you forget something you could have done, that is on you. Be as prepared as possible. This will help everything flow smoothly, and ensure that YOU have much more fun, as you will keep the ball rolling, and get into more action, more fights, and more play time.
--If you have any piece of equipment or class feature or ability or archetype, outside of the core assumed resources, please have an up to date ruling and/or resource available. You may be asked to show said resource during the course of the day by any judge. The rulings are to help if a rules debate appears. If you have the ruling readily accessible, this can end many arguments before they begin, without needing a judge called to make a ruling.
-Any and all hosts have the ability to limit the number of characters a player may register. Please take the time to learn this information and plan accordingly.
----Judge Rulings
-Judges will be labeled and known to all players.
-There will not be a judge at every table. Most matches will run themselves, and won't need a GM. Judges are players too.
-Roaming judges can be called to settle any and all rules debates, their word is final for the course of the match. If you can find a source to overturn their ruling in between matches, have that resource available in case the debate comes up again. Judges are not perfect. They are there to end conflicts between players, and can make mistakes.
-All judges are volunteer, so please show your gratitude and thank them for their assistance.
-Be kind and respectful to all judges. Even if you don't like how they ruled a debate, please be sportsmanlike and roll with the punches. You'll get 'em next time.
-Judges will be required for multiple game types. There may not always be a judge available. If a debate arises, and one is unavailable, two options remain. If the debate cannot be decided between the two players, then a spectator can hunt down the ruling quickly, or else the players may wait patiently for a judge to become available.
----Prizes and other Monetary rules
---Optional---
-Registration fees
-Prize fund
-Prize donations
--My plan--
- $1 per PC per player. As a host I would limit players to 3 PCs each. All registration fees would go into prizes for Singles matches, such as minis, or dice sets. Any extra proceeds would be donated to the Game Store that hosted the event or any expenses paid for reserving space, in addition to the prizes bought there. No profit will be given to the Host or Judges. Depending on the number of players and PCs who sign up, I could budget out a prize for each tier of Singles matches, and if a large enough gathering of people, possible expand out to Teams rewards as well. Prizes would be random, with a couple larger prizes, and multiple smaller prizes. Each prize would have a number attached, and a dice would be rolled (Is there any other way? I thought not.) to select your prize should you become the champion of your tier.
