Camris provides whatever help he can to the boy so he can limp more quickly. He looks at Loba as he passes.
If you're in trouble too, then you need to come with us. I don't want to have your blood on my hands.
Loba nods once and then silently follows Camris and the boy down into the cellar.
My thin rationale for having her follow is that Loba suspects, given that she's a Tiefling, she's unlikely to receive "fair" treatment from Hellknights during questioning. As I said earlier, as a player I'm kind of fudging a "failed Wisdom check" here, since it seems rather unlikely such a wise individual would follow fools she never met down into this cellar. In other words, I'm viciously skewering Loba on the GM's hook and dropping her into a villain-infested future. Poor, poor character...
From beneath the cowl, Loba says her first words since entering the tavern. "It seems my good deed has placed me in an awkward spot, with curfew now fallen and Hellknights on their way." She tilts her head as if pondering for a moment (player fudges fumbling a Wisdom check). "I don't suppose you'd allow me to follow you through the sewers rather than having to stay behind and face potentially cruel questioning? I won't be a nuisance and can certainly take my leave of you once we've avoided this complication."
Loba, make a Perception check. Everyone else can try as well, but you get a -4 penalty for being inside the tavern.
Perception: 1d20 + 9 ⇒ (3) + 9 = 12. *sigh*
I'd like to beg all of your indulgence to allow me to (continue to) postpone a lengthier physical description until tomorrow evening. This week has been back-to-back 14-16 hour days, and I just can't spend the time until tomorrow evening.
Until then, though, I'd urge you to contemplate the possibilities from crossing a human with a barbed devil (p.72 of PFRPG Bestiary) in such a way that it results in a 5 Charisma score. Also, I should at least leave you with the following.
The figure escorting the boy through the tavern door is fully covered by robes died a drab dark burnt umber. Her face is mostly obscured in the shadows of a full cowl pulled low, but you can just make out that she is also wearing an even darker scarf tied across the bridge of her nose just below her eyes.
The boy continues to plead: "Please help me, it's just down this alley, not far at all!"
Loba hesitates a moment longer, as if uncertain, then nods wordlessly from deep within her cowl. She strides over to where the boy sits on the ground, picks him up, and starts walking swiftly in the indicated direction.
"Please, ma'am. You gotta to help me! I need to be gettin' home before it's too late! Can you help me?"
Loba, always cautious, takes in the scene, trying to determine whether the kid is faking his injury (Sense Motive: 1d20 + 7 ⇒ (17) + 7 = 24) and whether there might be others lurking in the shadows waiting to ambush her as reward for a good deed (Perception: 1d20 + 9 ⇒ (14) + 9 = 23).
I believe that my character edits are pretty much done, other than the physical description that I still owe (although it is implied in some of the current race description). Please tell me what you think.
Do note that I tweaked a few more things here and there; however, this was not done with any power-gamer motive but mostly to make things "fit". In particular, you should note where I modified the racial skill bonuses (Bluff & Stealth => Intimidate & Perception, given barbed devil fear and awareness abilities) and fiendish resistances (cold, electricity & fire => cold & acid) to make more sense based upon barbed devil stats.
I'm fine with using a Tiefling, and you definitely don't have to pay anything more, I feel that Tieflings are already pretty balanced, and even though they do have a few extra abilities, I don't think it's anything unbalancing. I'm fine with this. The variant you chose sounds cool and thematic to me, so I'm fine with it. As for physical appearance, I'm not going to limit you in any way. Feel free to write what you wish, you're not even limited to that chart as long as it makes sense!
Okay, so that means I still have a starting feat to choose for her, which will help. I'll also revise her description to reflect her Barbed Devil heritage.
Nameless GM wrote:
As for the Hamatulatsu, I agree that the original feat is a bit too powerful, but splitting it into three feats makes it seem too costly. I like the middle ground option, where the feat progresses as you level. Seems reasonable to me.
Okay. This feat won't be available to her until second level anyway, so we have a bit of time to work out the specifics. Sometime soon, in the next week or so, I'll post the "middle ground" proposal for us to iterate from.
Nameless GM wrote:
As for how to integrate your character... All I need is for you to explain why she would be walking the street in the late evening, near Westcrown's curfew. Perhaps she's late coming home from work, or 'temple.' Also, if you could provide me a quick background summary and her alignment, that would be much obliged! I should be able to tie you in over the weekend if you can provide me with this.
Many apologies. I had a busy weekend and didn't see your response until just now. I'm going to presume that she is now living at a Westcrown branch of the Sisters of the Golden Erinyes monastic order. So, instead of returning home from 'temple', let's say that she is returning to the temple from an errand that took rather too long, leaving her in danger of being on the streets after curfew.
Here is a background summary, distilled from what I've already previously said. She was the child of some unknown, to her, Chelish noble house. Her mother, upon seeing the Infernal heritage obvious from the newborn infant's hideous face and disfigured body, knew that her daughter would be killed once the lord of the house returned from the trip he was on. So, the mother had the midwife smuggle the poor babe away to be left on the doorstep of one of the Sisters of Golden Erinyes monasteries, after which they conspired to concoct a story and "evidence" indicating that the infant had died during childbirth.
The Devil Nuns raised the child along with the other orphans, training her in their secret martial arts, keeping a close watch on the rather "special" orphan in their midst. Loba has recently been fully ordained into the order, and the monastery's leaders have started giving her errands requiring that she go out into the world beyond the monastery's walls, a radical change from her previously completely sheltered life. Although they understand that there is significant danger in doing this, they also know that the young monk needs to start coming to terms with interacting in a world that may often be outright hostile to her obviously Infernal nature.
Nameless GM wrote:
Loba, is your character almost ready? I want to bring her in before the main plot begins.
I'll finish up rewriting the description of her appearance and any other preparations over the next couple of hours.
The following pieces were written to Nameless GM, but I invite everyone to peek.
The Good - Sisters of the Golden Erinyes:
Broken Hamatulatsu feat aside (more on this later), I'd still like to use the story of the Sisters of the Golden Erinyes and their Hamatulatsu combat style as part of my character's background story, if only for the roleplaying flavor it provides. I think it's an absolutely perfect fit for the backstory I was already working on as well as for a Tiefling Monk in a campaign set in Cheliax, in general. Here are the relevant paragraphs, taken from the section discussing Isger on p.83 of the Campaign Setting.
Isgeri Orphans
The Goblinblood wars left swathes of Isgeri orphans. The ensuing years of unchecked bandit raids only further swelled the number of unwanted homeless. Tragically, the only institution to respond to the growing crisis was the church of Asmodeus. Cheliax’s House of Thrune installed a number of monasteries across the Isgeri countryside which collect, feed, and clothe orphaned children, all the while co-opting them into their dark fold.
The most prominent of these monasteries is the Sisters of the Golden Erinyes, colloquially referred to as the Devil Nuns. The sisterhood baptizes the rescued youths with unholy water and drills them from an early age in the basics of Hamatulatsu, an exotic martial art pattered (sic) on the study of barbed devils. Upon reaching adulthood, young female orphans often aspire to join the ranks of the sisterhood themselves, while males often seek admission to an order of Hellknights or find their calling in the priesthood of Asmodeus.
The Bad - Hamatulatsu feat:
One of the things I asked about in an earlier post was whether you'd allow my character to take the Hamatulatsu feat (also appearing on p.83 of the Campaign Setting).
Hamatulatsu
You have mastered a deadly fighting form inspired by the varying attacks of the barbed devil. You seek not just to defeat or kill your opponent but to first cripple him with memorable, scarring pain.
Prerequisites: Intimidate 5 ranks (should be 2 ranks after applying rules in conversion guide), Improved Unarmed Attack, female, raised by the Sisters of the Golden Erinyes.
Benefit: Each round, your unarmed attacks may be treated as bludgeoning, piercing, or slashing damage. You decide which type of damage you deal, but you may only choose one type at a time. In addition, for each consecutive round that you change the type of damage selected from the previous round, the threat range of your unarmed attack increases by 1, to a maximum of 16–20/x2 after 5 rounds. If you succeed in confirming a critical hit, the threat range of your attacks resets to normal and you may further make an opposed Intimidate check as an immediate action to attempt to demoralize your opponent and render him shaken.
Special: Hamatulatsu may be selected as a substitute bonus feat at 2nd level by a monk even if the monk does not otherwise meet the prerequisites. Hamatulatsu does not stack with Improved Critical.
Having gone back and reread this, I now retract the request. There's no way I'd ever allow this feat in any of the games I GM, nor would I expect you to. It's way too powerful for a single feat, especially one available at such a low level. In addition, it provides too many kinds of benefits for a single feat. Frankly, I'm rather surprised it slipped out past Paizo's editorial review staff.
The Ugly - Hamatulatsu combat stye, redux:
I went way overboard earlier this evening after realizing how broken the Hamatulatsu feat was, and completely redesigned it in an attempt to keep its flavor while preserving overall play balance.
I actually had quite a bit of fun playing amateur game designer, and I even think I did a pretty good job of it; however, I decided in the end that I wouldn't feel comfortable asking you to introduce the alternate feats that I'd designed into your game. On the other hand, having spent a non-trivial amount of effort on this, I didn't want to simply throw it away, so I'm presenting it here for (all of) your entertainment.
So, the first modification I would make to the Hamatulatsu feat is to additionally constrain the maximum increase in threat range by some division of total character levels (i.e. something like, max threat range = lvl/4, round up). Also, I would stipulate that the "reset" occurs either due to confirmation of a critical or on the round after the attack at the maximum range (i.e. so that it cycles rather than sticks until reset by critical confirmation).
Thus, at levels 1-4, there is no threat range extension, only the ability to choose damage type; at levels 5-8, attacks would be made alternating between x2 and 19-20/x2 (in the absence of resets due to confirmed criticals, of course); next, at levels 9-12, a 3 round cycle: x2, 19-20/x2, 18-20/x2; then, at 13-16, 4 rounds: x2, ..., 17-20/x2; finally, at 17-20, 5 rounds: x2, ..., 16-20/x2.
Although this certainly does make the feat a bit more reasonable, albeit more complicated, it still offers too many kinds of advantages for a single feat. So, I would next split its advantages over a feat progression, which has the added benefit of reducing the complexity of any individual feat. After a number of revision passes, I ended up with this (note that PFRPG conversions have already been applied):
Hamatulatsu Acolyte
You have studied the basic forms of a deadly fighting style inspired by the varying attacks of the barbed devil. Through intense study and rigorous training, you have developed the capability of flexibly altering the type of damage your unarmed attacks deliver to an opponent.
Prerequisites: Intimidate 2 ranks, Improved Unarmed Attack, raised by the Sisters of the Golden Erinyes.
Benefit: Each round, your unarmed attacks may be treated as bludgeoning, piercing, or slashing damage. You decide which type of damage you deal when the round begins, and you may only choose one type per round.
Special: Hamatulatsu Acolyte may be selected as a substitute bonus feat at Monk level 2 or higher even if the character does not otherwise meet the prerequisites.
Note that I dropped the 'female' prerequisite since it seemed reasonable, given the Sisters of the Golden Erinyes background material above, that some of the male orphans might pick up these skills from their childhood training, even though entry to the actual monastic order might be barred to them later in life. Besides, I thought it might be rather cool to have the PCs in one of my campaigns encounter a non-Monk Hellknight practicing the Hamatulatsu combat style.
Hamatulatsu Adept
You have received training in the advanced techniques of a deadly fighting style inspired by the varying attacks of the barbed devil. You seek not just to defeat or kill your opponent but to first cripple him with memorable, scarring pain.
Benefit: At the beginning of your round, immediately after selecting the type of damage dealt by your unarmed attack due to Hamatulatsu Acolyte, the threat range of your unarmed attack increases by 1, to a maximum determined by your character level divided by 4, rounded up; however, if any of the following conditions are met, the threat range resets to normal instead of increasing:
the threat range or your unarmed attack increased to the maximum at the beginning of the preceding round;
you chose not to vary the type of damage selected during this round from that of the previous round;
or, you succeeded in confirming a critical hit since the start of the prior round.
Special: Hamatulatsu Adept may be selected as a substitute bonus feat at Monk level 6 or higher even if the character does not otherwise meet any prerequisites other than Hamatulatsu Acolyte. Hamatulatsu Adept does not stack with Improved Critical nor any other means of extending critical threat range.
The final feat in the series actually adds capability compared to the original feat. I did this in part because it still seemed too powerful to leave the "shaken effect" attached to the critical threat range extension; however, when peeled off as its own feat, it didn't feel like it had enough "meat" to be worth anyone spending a feat on. More importantly, I didn't want to drop it altogether since a fear effect is a significant element of the barbed devil creature inspiring the combat style in the first place.
Hamatulatsu Apostle
You have mastered a deadly fighting style inspired by the varying attacks of the barbed devil. Successfully employing its techniques strikes increasing fear into the heart of your opponent.
Benefit: If you succeed in confirming a critical hit with an unarmed strike, you may further make an opposed Intimidate check as an immediate action to attempt to demoralize your opponent. If you succeed, one and only one of the following conditions is applied to your opponent for a number of rounds equal to the current size of your unarmed attack critical threat range (e.g. for three rounds after confirming a critical while attacking at 18-20/x2):
if your opponent is already unconscious due to the effect of Hamatulatsu Apostle from a prior attack by you, no further condition is applied;
otherwise, if your opponent is already panicked due to the effect of Hamatulatsu Apostle from a prior attack by you, he is rendered unconscious;
otherwise, if your opponent is already frightened due to the effect of Hamatulatsu Apostle from a prior attack by you, he is rendered panicked;
otherwise, if your opponent is already shaken due to the effect of Hamatulatsu Apostle from a prior attack by you, he is rendered frightened;
otherwise, your oppenent is rendered shaken.
Special: Hamatulatsu Apostle may be selected as a substitute bonus feat at Monk level 6 or higher even if the character does not otherwise meet any prerequisites other than Hamatulatsu Adept. For the purpose of immunities and other game mechanics, any condition applied by Hamatulatsu Apostle is considered a non-magical mind-affecting fear effect. Only one condition may be applied to an individual opponent during any single round, although it is possible that multiple independent opponents may be effected during a given round.
Loba, how soon can your character be ready? I need to weave you into the adventure, and I know just the way. Also, if you have another long entry like the one above, please use spoiler tags around it so as not to disrupt the flow...
I can finish her up tonight or by tomorrow at the latest; however, I do want to reiterate the questions I was asking in my comment above.
I'd like to make certain you are okay with my construction of her variant Tiefling race via the feat Fiendish Heritage, as presented in The Bastards of Erebus. I'd contend that paying her first-level feat for the privilege of the racial advantages is sufficiently balancing, but if you'd also like to assign an XP debt (as per one of the suggestions in The Council of Thieves Players' Guide) or apply some other penalty for taking the Tiefling race, I completely understand.
Presuming the variant Tiefling is acceptable, are you okay with having me tweak her variant ability from one of those that I originally randomly rolled to #78, since it is the effective equivalent of the #26 I chose from those three random rolls? If you're uncomfortable with that ability, would you be okay with one of the others that I listed as seemingly appropriate for a Tiefling of devil subtype (25, 36, 67, 72, 88) or barbed devil heritage (17, 21, 64, 78)?
Finally, in the same vein, may I simply choose one or more appropriate physical traits instead of the Face: Canine Muzzle that I randomly rolled? These supply no specific in-game advantage, and my intentions are only to more closely fit her looks with her Barbed Devil ancestry as well as to provide basis for such a low Charisma score.
Please excuse me for being inconsiderate with that prior "noisy" post full of OOC comments. I'll certainly conceal any future similar bursts within spoiler tags.
Loba, the Tiefling is fine, but I'd prefer it if you just used the Tiefling article from PF25 as a resource, I don't have the Cheliax book, so I'd rather avoid using it. Also, please list your Tiefling trait that you randomly rolled... Which benefit does it provide? I know some of them can be pretty broken, so I just want to make sure...
I was specifically using the material from PF25 listed under Custom Tieflings, pp.64-7. I spent my single first level feat on Fiendish Heritage, selecting Devil-Spawn Tiefling. My three rolls on the abilities table were 15, 92, and 26. Of these, I selected 26, "Your body produces searing heat. Any creature that grapples you takes 1d4 points of fire damage per round.", since it seemed most useful for a monk. The roll of 26, Face: Canine Muzzle, on random features was intended in part to help justify her obscenely low Charisma.
On the other hand, if I were simply selecting from the abilities that most closely mesh with the Devil-Spawn fiendish heritage, I'd probably choose one of the following, given that they fit the features of the devil subtype listed on p.311 of the Bestiary:
25 - You gain acid resistance 5.
36 - You can communicate telepathically with any sentient creature with which you are in contact.
67 - Your eyes glow fiendishly and you possess the see in darkness ability as if you were a devil.
72 - You can communicate telepathically with any evil creature within 50 feet.
88 - Any damage you deal with a melee weapon is treated as evil for the purposes of overcoming damage reduction.
Further, given my specific interest in the Barbed Devil as the source of Loba's fiendish heritage, I might also add the following from the list of appropriate abilities to choose from.
17 - You possess claws that are treated as natural weapons and deal 1d4 damage.
24 - You can produce a barb from your body once per day. This barb is removable and is treated as a dagger.
61 - You can manipulate any armor, gauntlets, or shield you wield, causing them to grow spikes. These spikes last only as long as you wear your armor.
78 - Your skin is spiky. Any creature that attempts to grapple you takes 1d4 points of damage.
Of all of these, number 78 is actually the closest to the ability that I originally selected from the three randomly rolled abilities and would thus be a likely tweak I'd suggest we make to her Custom Tiefling race composition in order to make the theme more coherent.
On the other hand, I'm also good with having you simply assign whatever ability you think appropriate.
My reference to the Chelaxian book was not with regard to anything about the Tiefling race, but rather to a couple of interesting combat feats that would work well with the character at later levels. I understand if you don't want to allow access to them.
I was also quite keenly interested in the Hamalatsu feat mentioned in the section on Isger in the Campaign Setting book. I'm hoping that you will allow this one, even if you won't allow the feats from Chelaxian, since it fits so well with the background I'd already been devising for her before I saw it.
My interest in Belier's Bite led me to do some deeper background research in the campaign setting book, where I discovered, in the section on Isger, the Sisters of the Golden Erinyes and the associated feat, Hamalatsu.
Given this, I'd also like to consider reshaping her obvious physical deformities to something based upon either the belier devil or barbed devil physiology, especially since my randomly rolled "dog-faced" feature doesn't really match any of the known devil traits.
Of course, being a female Tiefling orphan with obvious ancestry stemming from a barbed devil would provide further reason why the Sisterhood would have harbored the child.
I'll think I'll allow Loba to take my spot. At the time I had alot of game rebuilding going on and could barely keep up with my other games. And I do not feel right taking back the spot as he has already made someone for it
Well, I'm definitely still interested, if you'll have me. Also, I apologize for the impatience I showed the other day.
Earlier in either this thread or the recruitment thread, I asked Warforged Gardener to approve my race selection of Tiefling combined with the Fiendish Heritage: Devil-Spawn feat. Before we start, I should reiterate this request for approval to Nameless GM.
Also, I'm keenly interested in a couple of the feats introduced in the recent Pathfinder Companion, Cheliax - Empire of Devils. In particular, although I've no need to take either of them at first level, at some point I'd like to be able to take both Belier's Bite and Cornugon Stun.
In a case of really bad timing, I caught a nasty stomach flu and have been pretty useless after working all weekend. If everyone can stand to wait just a little longer, I'm going to try to feel up to posting over the next few days.
I've no problem with waiting a bit longer. I note that it appears you still conveniently have a vacant spot where there used to be a Monk...
Make that four! I still want to play. Just didn't check back for a long time. Ready when you are!
Great, hope we still have enough room!
Okay, of the original cast, it does seem like you are still missing the monk. Does that mean Loba is in? If not, I'm fine with that and will place her on a shelf as an arrow to be drawn quickly in the future when the time is appropriate.
Anyway, I'll continue working on the build tonight and tomorrow, which should give you the time to get the books and figure out what you think is appropriate.
Although some final polish remains to be done, I believe Loba is basically complete and ready for review (by both DM and other players). Tell me what you think.
