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Basically as a GM i would say

your strength score is bellow zero as a result of the shadow attacks.

Because of this you die. 1d4 turns later a shadow emerges.

BoL is cast and you return from dead. still at zero strength so unconscious. There is no check on what put you there at this point. Check happens on the damage from the attack not on the completion from the spell, or anything else.

It would require another attack by the greater shadow. that in terms of an unconscious character is an auto hit for a touched attack. But would the Greater shadow attack him again?

Then next would there be a shadow, In a non PFS game i would say no, but rules attorneys would probably make it a probably(better than 50/50).


Simply.. Items like ring of invisibility. depending on the quality one ring adds 5, 10, or 20 to stealth.

Also go for anything to add dex to your score. Fro every 2 points added to dex that is a +1 to dex based skills needed from a rogue, and AoO through com exp. I try to get a belt of physical might. adds to all physical stats (Str, Con, and Dex), though your group might fight over them.

And you might benefit from anything that increases movement or initiative. If you fast stealth then while you might not attack first, If you are the first to go, you can get to a nice advantage on your fist turn to set up all your attacks later on.

According to the rules... Hit and run type attacks via spring attack should be very similar to the sniping rules. That would mean that you receive a -20 to your stealth check on a turn that you attacked. It might be worse as you would be using a melee attack where "sniping" implied a ranged weapon at aprox 30 ft.

Ask your DM about a few feats in 3.5 one of them allowed a character that made a stressful reflex save via evasion to then make a stealth check at no penalty.


Starting at first level, consider taking ranger or warrior early for one level. It opens up more weapons, but you need to stay away from the armor.

I would suggest ranger for your 2nd lvl for the reflex and opening up more skills. With all the skill point you get as a rogue, you can decide to do practically anything off the skill tree and still have it be a class skill.

One thing with a rogue is matching what your team needs.

Ranged rogues generally work best with ridiculous amounts of stealth. There is a penalty to hide after attacking that would mean equipping gear specifically to add to stealth. There are also feats/rogue talents to stretch the distance for sneak attack damage back from 30 feat.


Whips aren't as good as they used to be in 3.5. Part of the trip mantra was Attacks of opportunity to keep enemies away and were they were, but those only happen on threatened squares. Whips do not threaten squares outside your typical 5 foot radius. So you get no attacks of opportunity. So tripping does not delay as many creatures or as long as it did in 3.5.

Also look at the damage. A whip deal no damage against a creature with a +1 to armor or a +3 to natural armor. Only sneak attack damage would then apply. And it sounds like you might not be sneak attacking that much if you plan on using trip.

Also, many creatures have more than two legs, thus they are much harder to trip.

It looks like the Advanced Players Guide hasn't been opened for your group. There are a few more rogue talents that might prove useful there.


I play as a Shadow dancer/rogue and part of the issue is picking your battles. Rogues are great at doing serious damage via sneak attack, and doing almost everything outside of combat thanks to their skills.

So on to decide how you fight.. the question is are you a striker or are you a supporter. Strikers go for the leader while the party takes care of the rest, while supporters try to use their sneak attack to aid their allies by aiding what they are dealing with. You sound like a supporter, so you seem to want to be the last line of defense between them and your range/spell caster.

Honestly , if you have a high charisma, then go for magic through rogue talents after fast stealth. Keep going in shadow dancer to get respectable at spells while being respectable at melee.

If your sorc becomes fireball happy, then being in the middle of the worst isn't terrible. Your reflex save with evasion should mean you are perfectly fine when your own team decided that you make a great target and that should keep most of the enemies at bay.

and flank flank flank. The shadow will help with flanking, but can be a little annoying when he is the only thing dealing strength damage and everyone else targets HP.

Sometimes the best option for a rogue is to hide and strike when it is best and not be fighting right away.