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Hey folks.

I understand that many have asked about the legitimacy of using a large crossbow on a medium creature. Of course, the responses seem to be very mixed, and it seems a lot of people who have responded in such threads either are not aware of the rules for crossbows, or simply state their opinion rather than what the rules dictate. I'd like to make this thread the nail in the coffin for this subject by offering what I do believe is a comprehensive RAW approach to this matter, but I'm also asking for any evidence supporting for counter-arguments in regards to the rules themselves.

I'm going to ask about the legitimacy of a medium-sized character using a large heavy crossbow as a primary weapon. I'm operating on the principle that it can be done, because the rules, both RAW and RAI appear to allow this to be doable, and from my understanding there are no clauses which explicitly prevent this, nor are there any balance concerns.

So let's look at what we have for rules for just the heavy crossbow:

Heavy Crossbow:

Loading a heavy crossbow is a full-round action that provokes attacks of opportunity.

Note: You draw a heavy crossbow back by turning a small winch. Normally, operating a heavy crossbow requires two hands. However, you can shoot, but not load, a heavy crossbow with one hand at a –4 penalty on attack rolls. You can shoot a heavy crossbow with each hand, but you take a penalty on attack rolls as if attacking with two one-handed weapons. This penalty is cumulative with the penalty for one-handed firing.

Okay, so we're at being able to shoot a regular crossbow one-handed as though it were a one-handed weapon, and it needs more than one hand to reload RAW - you need one hand to hold it and another to crank the winch and load the bolt as a full-round action. That's fine.

Crossbow Mastery:

The time required for you to reload any type of crossbow is reduced to a free action, regardless of the type of crossbow used. You can fire a crossbow as many times in a full attack action as you could attack if you were using a bow. Reloading a crossbow for the type of crossbow you chose when you took Rapid Reload no longer provokes attacks of opportunity.

Alright, so now we're at explicitly and unquestionably any kind of crossbow being able to be reloaded as a free action.

So our medium crossbow is able to be shot with two hands with no penalty with a free action reload albeit weighted as a one-handed weapon for the sake of TWF. It still requires two hands to reload, though.

So when we bump the size up, per the way weapon sizes work:

Every weapon has a size category. This designation indicates the size of the creature for which the weapon was designed.

A weapon's size category isn't the same as its size as an object. Instead, a weapon's size category is keyed to the size of the intended wielder. In general, a light weapon is an object two size categories smaller than the wielder, a one-handed weapon is an object one size category smaller than the wielder, and a two-handed weapon is an object of the same size category as the wielder.

Inappropriately Sized Weapons: A creature can't make optimum use of a weapon that isn't properly sized for it. A cumulative –2 penalty applies on attack rolls for each size category of difference between the size of its intended wielder and the size of its actual wielder. If the creature isn't proficient with the weapon, a –4 nonproficiency penalty also applies.

The measure of how much effort it takes to use a weapon (whether the weapon is designated as a light, one-handed, or two-handed weapon for a particular wielder) is altered by one step for each size category of difference between the wielder's size and the size of the creature for which the weapon was designed. For example, a Small creature would wield a Medium one-handed weapon as a two-handed weapon. If a weapon's designation would be changed to something other than light, one-handed, or two-handed by this alteration, the creature can't wield the weapon at all.

The crossbow would be designated as a one-handed weapon as designation is assigned to all weapons, and its size designation is based upon the mere ability to be wielded in one hand. Thus, a medium creature can absolutely and undeniably shoot a large heavy crossbow. But what of reloading?

Most other posts end here, with the ruling on over-sized crossbows being a matter of DM discretion due to the need of reloading such a large object. I'd like to reference the two-handed weapon rules, however, as well, for the notion of being able to hold the weapon, in this case, a crossbow, with one hand.

Combat (Two-handed FAQ):

What kind of action is it to remove your hand from a two-handed weapon or re-grab it with both hands?

Both are free actions. For example, a wizard wielding a quarterstaff can let go of the weapon with one hand as a free action, cast a spell as a standard action, and grasp the weapon again with that hand as a free action; this means the wizard is still able to make attacks of opportunity with the weapon (which requires using two hands).

As with any free action, the GM may decide a reasonable limit to how many times per round you can release and re-grasp the weapon (one release and re-grasp per round is fair).

So, what we have here, is the ability to hold the large heavy crossbow with no problems in one hand. One hand is required to hold the crossbow as mentioned in the description of the weapon, doing so is not a problem per the FAQ, and actions can still be performed while one-hand-holding the two-handed weapon also in the FAQ, so reloading the crossbow, one hand holding it, and one hand turning the crank, would be acceptable by all rules standards and also be entirely free actions. Crossbow mastery then turns this reloading time into a free action as well, allowing full use of iteratives.

Are there any rules disputes or contradictions that I'm not aware of preventing these kinds of interactions? I understand it is the DM's discretion to limit free actions, but this doesn't really seem exploitative since all crossbows require the same action economy technically speaking, for all of them require two hands to reload and all are affected by crossbow mastery.

As far balance, the damage remains similar to that of the bow due to the lack of composite options for damage, manyshot for enchantment procs/volume, ammunition enchantment procs, etc. All said and done, the heavy crossbow does 2d8 damage base at a -2 penalty to hit, and so does a normal attack + manyshot on a non-composite longbow, except the crossbow requires Rapid Reload and Crossbow Mastery to use. It's "big" damage on a single bolt, and scales nicely with effects like vital strike and Gravity bow, re-gaining competitiveness with a composite enchanted longbow through a feat investment at one attack per turn over volume of arrows gaining damage benefits and enchantment procs. Seems like it RAW gives the crossbow a semi-viable place among a couple of niche builds taking a different approach to ranged than sheer arrow-slinging as normal, and it still ends up a bit weaker in the medium/higher levels.

I'd love to hear thoughts and feedback, and hopefully this thread finally answers all future questions on the matter and can clarify some of the rules debates from the past.

It's pretty much a known fact that crossbows are a terrible weapon choice, despite offering tons of flavor. They are feat-intensive, ineffective, and strictly speaking, under-used and under-performing weapons, especially when compared to bows. This mostly comes through the fact that there requires way too much of a feat investment to make them usable, and also comes from a lack of feats and early to mid-game builds which allow for some basic functionality in regards to damage potential.

There are a few options out there, such as the Bolt Ace, but these options are ultimately weaker and much more late-game-oriented. Needing to reach level 11 or hundreds of thousands of gold for enchantments (or a third arm - weird) to get basic character functionality is way too far. For historically the simplest and easiest ranged weapon to use at its inception, it makes no sense for it to be so difficult to use the weapon at all.

The ranger works, and can offset these problems given the benefits of the Crossbow Style and Favored Enemy, but I play with a group that generates the world after player-backstories are written as to create vast lands of diverse cultures and geographies. This creates huge conflicts with this mechanic early on, and the dependency here is too great.

I found that the Hunter offers a lot of flexibility in regards to stats, abilities, and flavor that I felt necessary for a crossbow-based build to work. I really like the idea of a Dual-wielding crossbowman, masterfully adept with his weapons and using magic to reload them. I initially tried a Reloading Hands concept, but it was ultimately too slow on the setup time, less-effective than any archer build I devised, and still struggled on the once-per-turn issues of reloading.

Thus, I created a Hunter Archetype that attempts to strike a balance between the Bolt Ace and the Ranger and Druid while not feeling inherently overpowered. Since the Divine Hunter drops teamwork feat potential, I didn't think this suggestion of using pets to draw aggro or distract things for him would be too far-fetched. It gives crossbow builds an early-game presence that is much-needed without detracting too much from any standard archer, while also giving them a bit of utility through limited and specialized magic at a druid-level progression of higher level spells.

Basically, it enables a TWF-crossbowman Dual-wielder who can build in a variety of specializations - from Sniper to Skirmisher - via feat choices and magic, things which are normally not attainable for crossbow-users.

So here we go:

Hunter Archetype – Imbued Splinterer

The Imbued Splinterer is an aggressive skirmisher which uses the crossbow as his weapon of choice to lead a devastating assault against his foes by funneling his innate magical capabilities into his weapons to create ammunition. With pinpoint accuracy, the Imbued Splinterer takes an opportunistic approach to combat from range, using allies from nature to distract his enemies for him.

Weapon Proficiency
The Imbued Splinterer is proficient with all crossbows and simple weapons and light armor. This modifies Weapon Proficiency.

Predator’s Prowess
The Imbued Splinterer loses access to the following Animal Foci: Bear, Monkey, Owl, Wolf. He instead gains access to the following Animal Aspects instead:
Shark: The creature gains a +4 competence bonus to track fleeing foes it has struck in combat. This bonus increases to +4 at 8th level and +6 at 15th level.
Komodo Dragon: The creature gains a +4 competence bonus against Diplomacy checks made to convince it to go against its orders or convictions of its owner (players control ownership of their characters). This bonus increases to +4 at 8th level and +6 at 15th level.
Leech: The creature gains a +4 competence bonus to fly and ride checks. This bonus increases to +4 at 8th level and +6 at 15th level.
Mongoose: The creature gains a +1 competence bonus to CMD against the bull rush, trip, and grapple combat maneuvers. This bonus increases to +2 at 8th level and +3 at 15th level.
This ability modifies Animal Focus.

Imbued Shots
Imbued Splinterers devote themselves wholly to the crossbow, focusing their magic into manifesting ammunition automatically into their weapons. The Imbued Splinterer gains the ability to manifest magical bolts into his crossbow inheriting from the crossbow’s base damage. The speed of reloading a crossbow is reduced by one step and functions identically to the Bolt Ace’s Inexplicable Reload, except this occurs immediately after each shot. As a cost, the Imbued Splinterer knows four fewer 0th level spells (minimum 0) and cannot learn more spells of higher level than he knows 0th level spells, and does not gain additional spells known for having a high ability score. This penalty applies to all spells the Imbued Splinterer gains access to from any class he selects levels in.
This ability modifies Spell Casting.

Crossbow Style
At 3rd level and every three levels thereafter, an Imbued Splinterer gains a bonus feat from the following list in addition to those gained from normal advancement. He does not need to meet the prerequisites of the selected feat:
Deadly Aim, Rapid Shot, Point-blank Shot, Crossbow Mastery.
At 6th level, the Imbued Splinterer adds the following feats to the list:
Improved Initiative, Point-blank Master, Snap Shot, Far Shot.
At 9th level, the Imbued Splinterer adds the following feats to the list:
Improved Snap Shot, Shot on the Run, Pinpoint Targeting.
This ability replaces Hunter Tactics and Teamwork Feats.

Powerful Insight
At 4th level, an Imbued Splinterer may choose to add his WIS score as damage to attacks made using his Imbued Shots to foes within 30 feet. This may not be used simultaneously with any other effect which adds an ability score to his crossbow attacks.
This replaces Improved Empathic Link.

Blood for Blood
At 11th level, an Imbued Splinterer can channel his lifeblood into his Imbued Shots. He gains the ability to expend up to twice his character level in health per turn to infuse his next Imbued Shot with the ability to heal a single target struck by the bolt for half of the health sacrificed this way, dealing no damage, or deal half of the health expended as extra damage to his next attack made against a single enemy. The healing aspect of this ability cannot critically hit.
This ability replaces Speak with master.

Greater Powerful Insight
At 15th level, an Imbued Splinterer can concentrate his Imbued Shots into one extremely potent assault. As a full-round action, the Imbued Splinterer may choose to take a -5 penalty and make a single attack roll against an enemy at his highest Base Attack Bonus. Include all penalties normally associated with making attacks. If the attack hits, he deals damage as though making a full-round attack as well as an additional attack, and all damage is totaled before applying Damage Reduction.
This ability replaces Greater Empathic Link.

While I don't have very high hopes that this would ever get implemented, I'd like some feedback, and would love to see a bit of a push to get this concept moving. I heard the newly-released DTT bumped up sniping a bit, but I haven't gotten a look at it, so it's possible there may already be some buffs in this department I don't know of yet. I feel like this is a role that's really under-represented and really under-powered in the game, and there seems to be community demand for it every so often based around my google searching for help in trying to make a build like this work out.

Thanks for reading through this, and I'll gladly make alterations if deemed necessary!

Hello folks. After some quick googling I couldn't find an answer to a question that may or may not define the success of a really cool build I've been trying to make viable for a long time.

My question is simply this: How do the Hunter Animal Foci interact with Aspect spells, and can all (or some) of these stack?

My real question lies in being able to Stack Aspects from the Hunter class + Cat's Grace + Aspect of the Falcon + Aspect of the Wolf. That seems like an awful lot of dex/ranged attack bonuses to be had, but I see no rules stating that more than one Aspect can't be applied at once. I know the spell Animal Aspect can't be, but that's totally different.

Any answers would be much appreciated. I'm looking into a dex-based build that may be taking some huge penalties on attacks, and was curious if these magic effects could be used to compensate for the penalties coming from attack bonuses.

Thanks!