Starfinder Second Edition is Coming!

People, I don't think it's necessary to engage this discussion further. Just flag the comments appropriately and move on. This is the SF2e announcement thread, so maybe we should focus on that instead?

1

Dragon Nexus Games wrote:

Ezekieru wrote:

I think it needs to be emphasized: You're not going to achieve any substantial amount of networking and professional work just by posting on the Paizo forums. Contacting the Marketing team via their email on the Contact page would be a much better start. And doing so with previously published third party products for Pathfinder and Starfinder would do wonders more in helping you get your foot in the door than sending a reply to Thurston offering to sign an vague NDA.

At least you didn't suggest customer representatives. Of course, I rather be talking to actual decision makers than going around in circles between people whose job is to be a communication barrier.

Someone with a title like Managing Creative Director sounds like someone with an important leadership role.

PS: Companies are not going to want to discuss things that they have not registered for copyrights protection with someone without an NDA at the very least like all unpublished WIP stuff.

Since Thurston has indicated drows aren't going away, the NDA would be moot.

The "actual decision makers" still have to go through their Hiring Managers in order to get the paperwork ready to work with freelancers or with in-company developers. Or with the Marketing Team in order to set up work contracts with their official partners. Trying to circumvent that because you don't like those departments' people doesn't show professionalism.

Thuston's job is to manage his team on the Starfinder side, and help creatively direct the game. It's not to deal with random people soliciting job opportunities, especially on the forums meant primarily for fan engagement. That's why Thurston would be talking with their HR department or the Marketing department to hire or work with people.

So, again, it might help your chances if you stopped and simply go through the proper channels. Look for hiring opportunities by Paizo through their regular communication channels. Contact the...

Since I am still writing up the stuff, there is no reason to get into licensing agreements. I have to be within 6 months or so to launching my project for sales or pre-orders. What job opportunities was I soliciting? It's not like I am requesting employment with Paizo. It is about working with nor working for, as an independent third-party developer working on an otherwise large independent project which I would want to not canonically contradict SF2e setting, either. It is so the story base jive or plausible canonically. So, it's a matter of coordination. As for licensing, I have no plans to start licensing until closer to release date for any publications when it is at a presentable fashion.

It isn't that I wouldn't be at some point talking with those individuals.

You’re not doing a very good job of talking to these individuals here. Not inspiring a lot of confidence.

Dragon Nexus Games wrote:

Maybe, I'll worry about the little state reinstatement/renewal stuff when I get to it.

Wait, your company doesn’t even legally exist due to a major screwup on your “company’s” side of things, so all of the above posts trying to solicit stuff fall under misrepresentation don’t they?

Technically, it's just inactive but reinstatable to active status. Doesn't stop contractual matters. Since the company is for all intents me, anyway... I'm alive and exist. However, Dragon Nexus Games is an ABN of Cyber City - The Online Virtual City, Inc. Which is really a single shareholder corporation. All IP rests with me.

You’re not doing a very good job of talking to these individuals here. Not inspiring a lot of confidence.

At earliest, I am looking at about 2024/2025 regarding that. There's about a year or two worth of work to do, at least. Don't you think that would be a tad early to get into any licensing agreement or marketing people at Paizo? Maybe in spring 2024.

I just don't want to be bugging the marketing and Licensing guys until 2024. I would want to have a presentation level draft at near final draft level not the mountain of notes and rough drafts.

What does that have to do with how you are conducting yourself now?

What does that have to do with how you are conducting yourself now?

People harassing me because of wanting a general maybe informal overview of their plans regarding story setting canon, and involve some sort of confidentiality agreement such as some form of NDA so we agree not to disclose what we disclose to each other confidentially to legally protect ourselves. Going in circles over what is moot.

First, it's moot. No particular need to do that, now.

Second, it is premature to discuss licensing and marketing with the licensing and marketing staff at this time.

"Contact the Marketing Team to see if you can establish a professional connection. Publish third-party products on Pathfinder/Starfinder Infinite. Anything other than wasting your time doing... this, I guess?"

Okay... fair enough. I'll contact them, but it will likely be closer to 2024.

I already plan to publish on SF Infinite, PF Infinite, drivethru RPG, etc. for the books/pdf. Video games and crpg is a different matter. I already know about doing that. I just want to be sure there is no particular surprise in story canon and all with SF2e.

Rysky the Dark Solarion wrote:

Dragon Nexus Games wrote:

Maybe, I'll worry about the little state reinstatement/renewal stuff when I get to it.

Wait, your company doesn’t even legally exist due to a major screwup on your “company’s” side of things, so all of the above posts trying to solicit stuff fall under misrepresentation don’t they?

Technically, it's just inactive but reinstatable to active status. Doesn't stop contractual matters. Since the company is for all intents me, anyway... I'm alive and exist. However, Dragon Nexus Games is an ABN of Cyber City - The Online Virtual City, Inc. Which is really a single shareholder corporation. All IP rests with me.

… dood, you’re defunct. And deal in NFTs.

Dragon Nexus Games wrote:

Rysky the Dark Solarion wrote:

Dragon Nexus Games wrote:

Maybe, I'll worry about the little state reinstatement/renewal stuff when I get to it.

Wait, your company doesn’t even legally exist due to a major screwup on your “company’s” side of things, so all of the above posts trying to solicit stuff fall under misrepresentation don’t they?

Technically, it's just inactive but reinstatable to active status. Doesn't stop contractual matters. Since the company is for all intents me, anyway... I'm alive and exist. However, Dragon Nexus Games is an ABN of Cyber City - The Online Virtual City, Inc. Which is really a single shareholder corporation. All IP rests with me.

… dood, you’re defunct. And deal in NFTs.

What NFTs??? That's not my business that you looked at. The project I am working on isn't going to be called Cyber City. It is something else. The corporate name may be renamed in the future after reinstatement and update name profile.

NFT… Non-Functioning Thoughts.

Give it a rest, bruv.

Rysky wrote:

Dragon Nexus Games wrote:

Rysky the Dark Solarion wrote:

Dragon Nexus Games wrote:

Maybe, I'll worry about the little state reinstatement/renewal stuff when I get to it.

Wait, your company doesn’t even legally exist due to a major screwup on your “company’s” side of things, so all of the above posts trying to solicit stuff fall under misrepresentation don’t they?

Technically, it's just inactive but reinstatable to active status. Doesn't stop contractual matters. Since the company is for all intents me, anyway... I'm alive and exist. However, Dragon Nexus Games is an ABN of Cyber City - The Online Virtual City, Inc. Which is really a single shareholder corporation. All IP rests with me.

… dood, you’re defunct. And deal in NFTs.

What NFTs???

Searching “Cyber City - The Online Virtual City” brings up that they deal in NFTs, if you don’t know what NFTs are why are with them?

I’m excited for an update. I hope they take the opportunity to consolidate the rules, make them easy to reference and read, and I’m always excited to see Paizo’s ideas on their setting.

Dragon Nexus Games wrote:

Rysky wrote:

Dragon Nexus Games wrote:

Rysky the Dark Solarion wrote:

Dragon Nexus Games wrote:

Maybe, I'll worry about the little state reinstatement/renewal stuff when I get to it.

Wait, your company doesn’t even legally exist due to a major screwup on your “company’s” side of things, so all of the above posts trying to solicit stuff fall under misrepresentation don’t they?

Technically, it's just inactive but reinstatable to active status. Doesn't stop contractual matters. Since the company is for all intents me, anyway... I'm alive and exist. However, Dragon Nexus Games is an ABN of Cyber City - The Online Virtual City, Inc. Which is really a single shareholder corporation. All IP rests with me.

… dood, you’re defunct. And deal in NFTs.

What NFTs???

Searching “Cyber City - The Online Virtual City” brings up that they deal in NFTs, if you don’t know what NFTs are why are with them?

That looks like a different company called Cyber City Games. There are a lot of things with "Cyber City" in the name.

Rysky, I know what NFTs are. I'll probably going to rename the corporation name.

Rysky the Dark Solarion wrote:

Dragon Nexus Games wrote:

Rysky wrote:

Dragon Nexus Games wrote:

Rysky the Dark Solarion wrote:

Dragon Nexus Games wrote:

Maybe, I'll worry about the little state reinstatement/renewal stuff when I get to it.

Wait, your company doesn’t even legally exist due to a major screwup on your “company’s” side of things, so all of the above posts trying to solicit stuff fall under misrepresentation don’t they?

Technically, it's just inactive but reinstatable to active status. Doesn't stop contractual matters. Since the company is for all intents me, anyway... I'm alive and exist. However, Dragon Nexus Games is an ABN of Cyber City - The Online Virtual City, Inc. Which is really a single shareholder corporation. All IP rests with me.

… dood, you’re defunct. And deal in NFTs.

What NFTs???

Searching “Cyber City - The Online Virtual City” brings up that they deal in NFTs, if you don’t know what NFTs are why are with them?

That looks like a different company called Cyber City Games. There are a lot of things with "Cyber City" in the name.

It’s what popped up when I put in that full title.

If they are distinct things then I retract and apologize.

Rysky, I know what NFTs are. I'll probably going to rename the corporation name.

Okies, I apologize for the confusion on my part there then.

Dragon Nexus Games wrote:

Rysky, I know what NFTs are. I'll probably going to rename the corporation name.

Okies, I apologize for the confusion on my part there then.

No problem. A plan to rename the business name is part of why I'm not immediately in a rush to spend $350 to $400 or so on that and other associated costs.

*nods nods*

Yes

IMHO then they should have waited, why make people buy new books which will not last long?

So don’t buy them.

Rysky the Dark Solarion wrote:

Yes

IMHO then they should have waited, why make people buy new books which will not last long?

1: No one is making you buy anything, it's a choice only you can make for yourself.

2: Starfinder 2e won't even be out for 2 years.

3: People still play Pathfinder 1e, there's no expiration date on the books.

Interesting that voicing inpopular opinions brings out the vultures.

Just watched an interview with Erik Mona and Thurston Hillman that covers a lot of concerns brought up in this thread. Here is the link. Some important highlights:

Thank you magic man.

Interesting that voicing inpopular opinions brings out the vultures.

As good as the moderators are at filtering overt abuse, there's something to be said about the subtle smugness that can fester on these forums, especially when the conversation features a lot of regular posters versus just a few people. For a place that autocensors profanity, these forums can be surprisingly toxic at times. I suppose it's the homefield advantage that emboldens people siding with the company and defending its decisions to engage in a lot of condescension and smarm.

(Granted, it could easily be a lot worse, and I recognize the hard work and reasonable impartiality of the moderators in keeping it as good as it is.)

Interesting that voicing inpopular opinions brings out the vultures.

Do you have any evidence any of these statements are wrong? I'll be happy to correct them if you do.

1: No one is making you buy anything, it's a choice only you can make for yourself.

2: Starfinder 2e won't even be out for 2 years.

3: People still play Pathfinder 1e, there's no expiration date on the books.

And clearly, and proudly, my ancestors were rats, not vultures.

*nods nods*

BTW: The books for TTRPG "project" I am working on, there is approximately, between 5 to 10 "core" books to supplement PF2e-Remastered, and SF2e. Exact number will depend.

Letting you know. To get official designation of PF/SF Compatible (assuming the rules remain essentially the same, fundamentally but I would assume that will be updated with the ORC stuff), there are licensing rules to follow, if I recall correctly so it would require use of PF/SF Rulebooks.

That’s unnecessary, you don’t need Paizo to personally sign off on Third Party stuff, that’s what ORC and Infinite are for.

That’s unnecessary, you don’t need Paizo to personally sign off on Third Party stuff, that’s what ORC and Infinite are for.

That's true. Before going deeper discussion regarding this, maybe we can PM and then at some point it would go in the third-party "forum " part instead of this topic thread.

Sure, not sure how much assistance I could be though.

That’s unnecessary, you don’t need Paizo to personally sign off on Third Party stuff, that’s what ORC and Infinite are for.

The PF/SF Infinite program may be more preferable from a variety of legal reasons but there may be a reason in my project for PF/SF Compatibility license. It might come to matters pertaining to "new settings".

Generally, more or less... only the Paizo published stuff are official canon of PF/SF. As for story writing to jive with well with official canon would be entirely my responsibility. I would know the official canon changes or amendments eventually as anyone else would be. You are on to something there. Thank you.

Will this be released as Starfinder Player Core, GM Core and Alien Core?

Or, will it be as some have suggested and be more of a campaign setting book and PF2 core rulebooks will be required to play?

Will this be released as Starfinder Player Core, GM Core and Alien Core?

Or, will it be as some have suggested and be more of a campaign setting book and PF2 core rulebooks will be required to play?

It is going to be it's own core rulebook, not sure if we'll get a GM core (1e didn't), but we'll probably get an alien archive/monster book pretty early into the games life.

You will not need Pathfinder to play Starfinder.

Terevalis Unctio of House Mysti wrote:

Interesting that voicing inpopular opinions brings out the vultures.

Do you have any evidence any of these statements are wrong? I'll be happy to correct them if you do.

1: No one is making you buy anything, it's a choice only you can make for yourself.

2: Starfinder 2e won't even be out for 2 years.

3: People still play Pathfinder 1e, there's no expiration date on the books.

I'm definitely on the side of being excited about Starfinder 2e - heck, I'm in the elite group of people that has been accused of being a Paizo shill - but sealioning like this doesn't strike me as conducive to a non-toxic discussion.

And while Terevalis phrased it in an unhelpful and combative manner, I do feel like sometimes people are quick to go on the offensive. There has been a time or two that I've felt a bit unwelcome on these forums, because my opinion on an issue diverged from the zeitgeist.

I love Pathfinder 2e. I adore it. It's by far my favorite system ever. But I think sometimes people forget that it's okay to not like things.

Not this forum, but watching some people literally attack Puffin Forest for daring to not like Pathfinder 2e at first blush was embarrassing. Being an inclusive community means more than just being accepting of people with different backgrounds and orientations. It means also accepting people who don't enjoy the same things, and even (especially!) people who are unhappy about decisions we are happy about.

Just my 2gp, I guess.

I'm very excited about SF2e. When Starfinder e2 comes out I'm going to start using it for organized play. And I will use Starfinder e1 for homebrew. I'd rather homebrew with an old system, not under development. That way I don't have to worry about new content coming out that might change my plans for my game.

Just like when Pathfinder 2e came out, there will be some players that stay with the old system, and there is nothing wrong with that. I've never played Pathfinder 1e, but I still bought the lore humble bundle for it because all the old lore is still the history for Pathfinder 2e. So for me, even if I completely switch to the new version, I'll keep my old books for the lore. And it will take a few years after 2e comes out before it feels like a complete system, so having the old books around can help fill in.

Whatever way people chose to go when the new edition comes out is a choice they have to make on their own. There should be no question why this is happening unless someone missed the whole OGL mess, it's Wotc fault for forcing Paizo to have to move the ORC.

Unfortunately, opinions, facts, and the internet don't mix well.

Well it's many many pages in and I'm still super excited. I really enjoy the Starfinder world, I was day 1 on the original even though I really was not into Pathfinder at the time due to the 1e mechanics. I'm really looking forward to getting back in

Driftbourne wrote:

Terevalis Unctio of House Mysti wrote:

Interesting that voicing inpopular opinions brings out the vultures.

Do you have any evidence any of these statements are wrong? I'll be happy to correct them if you do.

1: No one is making you buy anything, it's a choice only you can make for yourself.

2: Starfinder 2e won't even be out for 2 years.

3: People still play Pathfinder 1e, there's no expiration date on the books.

I'm definitely on the side of being excited about Starfinder 2e - heck, I'm in the elite group of people that has been accused of being a Paizo shill - but sealioning like this doesn't strike me as conducive to a non-toxic discussion.

And while Terevalis phrased it in an unhelpful and combative manner, I do feel like sometimes people are quick to go on the offensive. There has been a time or two that I've felt a bit unwelcome on these forums, because my opinion on an issue diverged from the zeitgeist.

I love Pathfinder 2e. I adore it. It's by far my favorite system ever. But I think sometimes people forget that it's okay to not like things.

Not this forum, but watching some people literally attack Puffin Forest for daring to not like Pathfinder 2e at first blush was embarrassing. Being an inclusive community means more than just being accepting of people with different backgrounds and orientations. It means also accepting people who don't enjoy the same things, and even (especially!) people who are unhappy about decisions we are happy about.

Just my 2gp, I guess.

That is the energy that is shown to those who DARE go against the group think. Social psychologists would have a field day studying the interactions here.

People disagreeing with you does not make you a victim.

Yeah, I think it's pretty understandable why Paizo is choosing to do this. There are lots of things that make sense about it, moving fully to their own system rather than something with links to the OGL, wanting to have the systems be the same so they don't have to be in the design space of two separate systems when working on it, having standardized formats, etc.

Obviously, it's unfortunate for me personally, since I don't happen to find Pathfinder Second Edition enjoyable, gave up on it after Secrets of Magic, and I did enjoy Starfinder's unique science fantasy blend, but, you know, that's just me, and I'm sure there are enough people who do enjoy it and wouldn't have played Starfinder normally to probably make up for people like me who won't move over to the next edition.

A bit of a personal downer, but I don't wish Paizo any ill will. Who knows, perhaps there will eventually be a third edition that I enjoy more?

And I will be sure to snag Starfinder Enhanced and anything else in the last days of first edition that looks appealing, of course.

Terevalis, you approached the periphery of a valid point, which is why I said something.

But you've been pretty combative the entire time, and flinging insults at one of the most respected members of the community (not to mention claiming to speak for people other than yourself) is not going to win you any favors or sway anyone to your point of view.

I've been open about critizing aspects of the potential PF2e-ness of SF2e (though on the whole I think the product will end up pretty good), and haven't really encountered hostility so far at least.

Social psychologists would have a field day studying the interactions here.

They would, but probably not for the reason you think.

3: People still play Pathfinder 1e, there's no expiration date on the books.

Sure. But looking at the gencon online schedule, each slot had 20 PF2 games, 10 SF games, and only 1 PF1 game.

Terevalis Unctio of House Mysti wrote:

Social psychologists would have a field day studying the interactions here.

They would, but probably not for the reason you think.

It's because of the drinking game isn't it?

Driftbourne wrote:

3: People still play Pathfinder 1e, there's no expiration date on the books.

Sure. But looking at the gencon online schedule, each slot had 20 PF2 games, 10 SF games, and only 1 PF1 game.

”I wanna play this game” and “I wanna play games at a Con slot” are two veeeeery different things.

thistledown wrote:

Driftbourne wrote:

3: People still play Pathfinder 1e, there's no expiration date on the books.

Sure. But looking at the gencon online schedule, each slot had 20 PF2 games, 10 SF games, and only 1 PF1 game.

”I wanna play this game” and “I wanna play games at a Con slot” are two veeeeery different things.

While I did online this year so I don't know what the offerings were for in-person gencon, I've found my regional conventions the ONLY place where I can find in-person PF1 tables.