If you really can’t use these, offer them for sale. Someone will take them. I’m definitely going to be buying these, so let me know if you sell them.

If you're serious about that comment, PM me. I really won't have time to start practicing on throw-away minis, much less be confident enough in my ability to make near-perfect assemblies until after Origins of 2021 at the very soonest and that doesn't help me with getting good minis on tables between now and then. I ordered the original $400 all-in and the additional blue dragon add-on.

I'm rather disappointed that -if the rumors are true- we're getting unassembled minis, as that's not what I was led to believe I was getting when I backed it on kickstarter, but as one of the few who got lucky enough to receive 8 of their minis, I want to point out that that's not much of a change. I'm just sad that Archon won't be doing their Unicast. I bought some of their AvP unis, and I enjoyed them.

That being said, I JUST today received the last batch of minis I bought from their clearance, and I really need to go check them out. I think I got some non unicast minis in this one, so I might be able to gauge their quality.

If ND is si insolvent, how did they end up with a booth in the Exhibit Hall at Gencon this year? Those booths are not cheap, not to mention the expense of travel and lodging.

If ND is si insolvent, how did they end up with a booth in the Exhibit Hall at Gencon this year? Those booths are not cheap, not to mention the expense of travel and lodging.

Sorry, that was probably hyperbolic. They haven’t filed bankruptcy as far as I know. But based on the numbers they posted previously, each of their projects had expended most of their funds and needed quite a bit more to complete all of them. They seem to be investing whatever they have in trying to generate revenue. Since they haven’t been very transparent, there is no way to know how successful they’re being and how much progress they might be making toward the other projects they’re still trying to fulfill.

If ND is si insolvent, how did they end up with a booth in the Exhibit Hall at Gencon this year? Those booths are not cheap, not to mention the expense of travel and lodging.

Note that I have NO insider knowledge on the specific situation with ND and their booth.

But as possibilities:

At least in some cases, companies pay for their Gen Con booths a full year in advance.

Travel and lodging costs depend very much on how far you have to travel, and who you know locally. This year I just drove 4 hours to Gen Con, and more than one year I have had people give me a berth in their room at no cost.

I have NO idea if those are the sorts of things that impacted ND's appearance, but they are things that can and do happen.

I understand Archon does not owe backers anything.

They were a subcontractor who got royally screwed by there employer. I assume they have lawyers working on that.

However.

I believe Paizo does owe backers something as they convinced people to invest in the kickstarter despite there misgivings about ND.

The solution with Archon is a nice start, but it should have been paired with an optional refund / trade credit, even if its discounted a % to account for Kickstarters cut for people who are really really not interested in un-assembled plastic minis.

That isn't what the paid for and they should have some other option then Key Lime Pie, or starving.

I understand Archon does not owe backers anything.

They were a subcontractor who got royally screwed by there employer. I assume they have lawyers working on that.

However.

I believe Paizo does owe backers something as they convinced people to invest in the kickstarter despite there misgivings about ND.

I assume Archon is getting a generous licensing agreement from Paizo for cleaning up Ninja Division's mess.

50% of what I paid to the Kickstarter in Paizobux. Heck, a couple bricks of Starfinder Battles would be nice, considering that's what I actually wanted 2 years ago.

50% of what I paid to the Kickstarter in Paizobux. Heck, a couple bricks of Starfinder Battles would be nice, considering that's what I actually wanted 2 years ago.

I would like to transfer my order to someone else

The transfer of your order may be authorized on certain projects, but only in acceptance of the project manager.
To trigger the transfer of a participation, first contact the project manager to confirm with them that this is possible on their project. Then send an email to Game On's customer service by copying the project manager and second party your transfer in the e-mail : alerte@gameontabletop.com

Game On or the project manager cannot be held responsible for the transaction between the parties wishing to transfer the order.

So it seems that Ninja Division has to approve transfer of pledges. Then people can just sell their pledge to an interested party and the sprues can be sent directly to their new owners (saving time and postage).

If only ND actually responded to attempts to establish contact for any reason whatsoever.

I understand Archon does not owe backers anything.

They were a subcontractor who got royally screwed by there employer. I assume they have lawyers working on that.

However.

I believe Paizo does owe backers something as they convinced people to invest in the kickstarter despite there misgivings about ND.

The solution with Archon is a nice start, but it should have been paired with an optional refund / trade credit, even if its discounted a % to account for Kickstarters cut for people who are really really not interested in un-assembled plastic minis.

That isn't what the paid for and they should have some other option then Key Lime Pie, or starving.

This could all be true but I also meant it from the standpoint that it was a bold move by them since they had to assume several attendees who pledged these minis would stop and vent their spleen on them

No update from ND is forthcoming. Since we'd need their approval to sell a pledge, we're hosed.

Still waiting...

No update from ND is forthcoming. Since we'd need their approval to sell a pledge, we're hosed.

You don't need anyone's approval to sell anything from this kickstarter if you sell it after its delivered to you.

Its done quote often using ebay, etc.

People used to buy extra copies of zombiecide to sell extra exclusives for some pretty nice $$$.

I want to transfer pledge, not wait until product never arrives to not sell it. It's simple. Someone more optimistic than me can buy the pledge off of me, and then this is their concern.

Garbage, this campaign keeps getting worse

I noticed how a lot of staff wrote in this blog when the Archon announcement was first put out, but now not very many have commented since it came out how Archon is actually going to fulfill the kickstarter. I too am not happy I have to build all the miniatures; but something is better than nothing at this point. Major time loss in life to put together the whole set, especially for those who have no experience assembling such small pieces. Just cleaning up the parts after taking them off sprues is a pain. I was willing to put the time in to paint these minis, but now I have to add in more time. Does anyone at Paizo know why there has been no word/updates from Archon on the kickstarter page?

The page is still under the control of Ninja Division, who have done their utmost to not exist on the Kickstarter page. Archon has no control of it, and that is the biggest problem here.

Even if Archon pulls through in the next week and starts churning out these things, shipping is still on Mr. "We were given millions and ran out of bubble wrap, so your products (that totally exist) can't go out."

I just want to recoup my losses and let some optimistic soul out there wait for the nothing. Or hey, Paizo could just give me store credit?

The page is still under the control of Ninja Division, who have done their utmost to not exist on the Kickstarter page. Archon has no control of it, and that is the biggest problem here.

Even if Archon pulls through in the next week and starts churning out these things, shipping is still on Mr. "We were given millions and ran out of bubble wrap, so your products (that totally exist) can't go out."

I just want to recoup my losses and let some optimistic soul out there wait for the nothing. Or hey, Paizo could just give me store credit?

I’m with him, store credit please

A 20mm dwarf comes in 12 pieces, do you understand how ridiculous that is?

Only if it actually arrives.

The Pledge Manager company got back to me this afternoon, and their advice to me was, quite literally, pester ND and associates until ND gets in touch with me, because the pledge manager can't do anything without their say-so. So with that in mind, I apologize in advance for any kooky things I might do in the coming days

Does anyone at Paizo have a non-ignored line of communication with ND they could utilize, or do they ghost you as well?

That would be Glenn. He is currently out of the office though. I will ask around and see who else can answer that question.

I'm just trying to get them to weigh in on pledge selling, and it's been 10 days since I asked them.

I've reached out to Archon and Ninja Division to get an update posted for the Kickstarter backers, to get the Pledge Manager unlocked, and to answer your question about transfers.

-Jim

For purely informational purposes, it has been 1 month since the last activity on ND's part on the Kickstarter page. ND have not even logged in to their project page in over a week. As of tomorrow, September 27th 2019, we are back to fulfillment being behind schedule.

I've only purchased pre-painted plastic miniatures in the past. I backed this knowing they were unpainted and was going to just use them in a game since options were so limited when starting starfinder. I figured I may just give some to a table-mates who may want to paint their favorites. Now I have to assemble small pieces together as well? two years later that interest has passed. What's being offered now is well beyond me, I have no idea where to begin on assembling these types of things. I had also thought that this would likely resolve with some sort of store credit, was going to use that to re-establish my subscriptions. Now I'll have a few dozen sheets of pewter or whatever it is now which does me no good.

I don't want to have Paizo go through long negotiations on this issue and have the new fulfillment company produce something that just won't be of use to me as the end user. If I could pass this pledge on to someone who actually has an interest into what this has turned out to be, it wouldn't be a total loss to everyone and not be a pointless effort.

Ninja Division has no incentive to help us, and at this point I'd say no incentive to listen to Paizo either. They got our money, and shoved their obligations onto Archon and now are just ignoring the world.

Over $500 for a bag of broken miniatures, if the dwarf is in 12 pieces, simple scaling tells us that some of the larger miniatures will be in 100s of pieces, is each scale of the dragon going to come separately? Are they going to come with 200 page instruction books like the larger LEGO sets or are we just going to be left with a pile of scrap plastic that they tell us somehow goes together into a dragon or other monster?

Ninja Division has no incentive to help us, and at this point I'd say no incentive to listen to Paizo either. They got our money, and shoved their obligations onto Archon and now are just ignoring the world.

Paizo did not get your money. I understand you're frustrated by Ninja, but Paizo is working to try to get you something after Ninja failed to deliver. Paizo is out in this endeavor too, but you refuse to see that.

technarken wrote:

Ninja Division has no incentive to help us, and at this point I'd say no incentive to listen to Paizo either. They got our money, and shoved their obligations onto Archon and now are just ignoring the world.

Paizo did not get your money. I understand you're frustrated by Ninja, but Paizo is working to try to get you something after Ninja failed to deliver. Paizo is out in this endeavor too, but you refuse to see that.

They in this case was Ninja Division, not Paizo. Paizo's only less victim than us because they can actually communicate to ND and be acknowledged.

Granted, the fact that a week later there's been nothing to show for their efforts would seem to indicate that ND feels they can safely ignore Paizo as well.

Over $500 for a bag of broken miniatures, if the dwarf is in 12 pieces, simple scaling tells us that some of the larger miniatures will be in 100s of pieces

That's generally not how it works. Miniature pieces are cast separately based on the needs of the mold and is dependent on the pose, not the size. I know it's little solace but you won't see anything with hundreds of pieces, or even dozens. Twelve seems on the high side; I've seen that only in the most complex miniatures, based on what I've gotten from Reaper.

Has there been any kind of ETA on this yet?

They said in their press releases they'd be doing monthly releases. That was 2 months ago. Paizo clarified that they'd be doing monthly releases once they actually got started. 1 month ago Archon announced they'd actually got started. As of 4 days ago, Archon're behind schedule.

technarken wrote:

Ninja Division has no incentive to help us, and at this point I'd say no incentive to listen to Paizo either. They got our money, and shoved their obligations onto Archon and now are just ignoring the world.

Paizo did not get your money. I understand you're frustrated by Ninja, but Paizo is working to try to get you something after Ninja failed to deliver. Paizo is out in this endeavor too, but you refuse to see that.

Paizo got the licensing fee that was to be provided to them by ND, correct?

Y’all forgive us if we don’t believe that after this thread and the other.

Has there been any kind of ETA on this yet?

No. I'd be astonished if we see anything before 2020 (and I wouldn't be surprised if it ends up being a GenCon release, to be frank).

It sounds to me that they've basically gone back to the drawing board. That means they need to go through the modelling, sculpting, proofing stages all over again before they get to production.

Apparently there are going to be monthly releases once they get through all that, but I have no idea how reliable Archon are. It seems to me batching things up monthly sounds lovely, but has to result in increased shipping costs for someone.

I'm bracing myself for a repeat performance in a year or two when we find out the resuce plan didn't pan out the way they thought it was going to.

Y’all forgive us if we don’t believe that after this thread and the other.

Hey, at this point I can see Paizo got scammed just like us backers did.

Did Archon give a good reason why they were not going to use their touted Unicast method for the Starfinder minis to Paiso?

Came in to see if there was any updates on the Paizo side. Not really? Appreciate you guys reaching out.

As for the people who jump to the defense I am learning to ignore them. They alienate people who have legitimate questions and gripes and distract from the topic without actually providing information. Technarken has legitimate questions that get overshadowed. Pledge Transfers?

Good luck on selling your pledge, I don't know of a single company that will take on the responsibility if you were to scam or someone scams you and you are fully out what you pledged for. I've pledged alot of campaigns and have never seen any company officially offer the transfer of pledges/accounts.

As for the people who jump to the defense I am learning to ignore them. They alienate people who have legitimate questions and gripes and distract from the topic without actually providing information. Technarken has legitimate questions that get overshadowed.

Yeah, I totally agree. They are not helping the situation and in my opinion causing additional frustration.

I want to thank Technarken and the others that keep this post alive...I know for me it's getting harder to keep my interest in this Paizo/ND disaster and I'm close to just writing this off as a total loss.

If it's a war of attrition I'm close to tapping out.

I agree...it feels like all parties involved want this PR nightmare to just disappear...with how ND on the reg continues to ghost us at ever turn and seems ignore "requests" from paizo to speak to us im reaching max bs limits here.

But hey if we hold out long enuff, we can buy all new clone copies of smiliar mins from wiz of the coast in blind boxes...just cost you double the current buy in price we already shelled out..

I'm not feeling terribly happy about this project, but just for clarity the upcoming prepainted Starfinder Battles is from WizKids not wizards of the coast.

I also agree this project feels like this is just sputtering along and fading into obscurity. I currently feel I'm more likely to be disappointed again than pleasantly surprised, but I do recognise that I know nothing about Archon, so it isn't really fair to pre-judge them.

Perhaps I'll see something eventually (albeit not the product I thought I was funding).

Well unless Archon starts communicating, or even better, actually delivering on something, the expectation that we are getting nothing will continue.

Is Archon communicating somewhere outside of the Kickstarter page? Because I haven't seen anything from them except for the one post saying they were taking over.

Well unless Archon starts communicating, or even better, actually delivering on something, the expectation that we are getting nothing will continue.

Is Archon communicating somewhere outside of the Kickstarter page? Because I haven't seen anything from them except for the one post saying they were taking over.

There was a 2nd update back in late August where they revealed their piecemeal miniatures.

I'm glad I circled back on this. I had some interaction with Game On Table Top back in July when this Archon deal was announced and they indicated that late backers (I'll never do that again) would receive some indication that their pledges were also being handled. Is anyone on here a late backer and unable to communicate on the KS page? Have you heard from Archon, Ninja or GOTT about managing your late pledge? I'm moving next year, and changing my address would be great. As of right now, my pledge manager on GOTT is marked "closed" -- ooo, it brings back all the bad feels when I look at that manager page.

Honestly I stopped gming starfinder and pathfinder over this months ago, but still check in to see how bad it is, I never seem to be disappointed...

I'm glad I circled back on this. I had some interaction with Game On Table Top back in July when this Archon deal was announced and they indicated that late backers (I'll never do that again) would receive some indication that their pledges were also being handled. Is anyone on here a late backer and unable to communicate on the KS page? Have you heard from Archon, Ninja or GOTT about managing your late pledge? I'm moving next year, and changing my address would be great. As of right now, my pledge manager on GOTT is marked "closed" -- ooo, it brings back all the bad feels when I look at that manager page.

Closed on GOT doesn't mean completed. Just means the pledge manager is locked. I haven't had a GOT project deliver yet, but I've only backed 2.

I did manage to get my address changed through GOT customer service though a while back.

Late pledging is ok, but any pledging is always a risk. Just sucks when we are told by a company we trust to have faith in a company my instincts said I should pass on. Wishing I'd just waited for WizKids but at this point this project soured me to Starfinder and I think it would have been a good time. I would take a refund, but that isn't an option. So now I just come back every now and then to watch the people who are upset constantly be attacked for being upset by people who didn't even back the project instead of getting what I really want.

An update. In my feels I've written this off as a loss. As a customer I won't let it go and will come back from time to time to remind people that there are real people behind the numbers and where I could have sunk just as much money into Starfinder as I do into Pathfinder it is now a loss of revenue because of a failed project.

If the Kingmaker remake isn't an absolute success I think it will be hard for me to buy anything with Paizo's name that isn't already at retail moving forward.

I've reached out to Archon and Ninja Division to get an update posted for the Kickstarter backers, to get the Pledge Manager unlocked, and to answer your question about transfers.

-Jim

2 weeks later, still no update from either ND or Archon. We can see they've logged onto Kickstarter in the interim, but they're still ghosting us, and apparently you as well.